The Ford Barn

C26Pinelake · 04-01-2016, 07:15 AM

I am ready to purchase new bearings. Please advise me and everyone else where these were purchased. Wayne

john in illinois · 04-01-2016, 07:21 AM

I have had this problem. I think most vendors sell the same bearings. Seek out good used bearings. These straight roller bearings also need fibrous grease not modern grease. Napa has crc stalube 3131 short fiber drum brake grease which these bearings originally used. May have to order it.

John

Keith True · 04-01-2016, 07:23 AM

Rear wheel bearings are one of the things I've almost always found to be good.I've had rear ends full of water,with the ring and pinion one solid mass,with good bearings in the hubs.I have seen a couple that had the hub run loose,on those the bearing rollers were almost barrel shaped.They had to have done that for a long time to wear them that much.I have a rear that I used in my truck for years that has a huge amount of end play in it.It doesn't rub on anything,but the play is all toward the outside,not the inside.evidently all the wear is on the carrier where the axle rides on it,not on the spider where the end of the axle rides.You can pull the axle outwards,but you can't push it in enough for it to rub anywhere.

Tom Wesenberg · 04-01-2016, 08:38 AM

This is why I don't replace good original bearings.

Glen in Hillman MI · 04-01-2016, 09:01 AM

I was one of the recipients of the bad wheel bearings that was not hardened and I got a call from the vendor for the possibility that I had received a set of those bearings. I told them that the car was still on jack stands and had not been driven since installed. I also said it would probably be about six weeks until I got to it. I did not get them inspected in the six week period. UPS dropped off a box from the vendor that I had not ordered and in it was a replacement set with all necessary parts to install them.
As I recall, those bearings were not case hardened and to tell if you had the bad bearings there were two more rollers in them than the original design, if memory serves me, the originals have 12 rollers and the bad ones had 14 in each cage.
I commend the vendor for being on top of getting the right thing done when they had a problem. That vendor was Bratton's and I thank Walt for being the businessman that he is.

Glen

Mitch//pa · 04-01-2016, 09:26 AM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Glen in Hillman MI

I was one of the recipients of the bad wheel bearings that was not hardened and I got a call from the vendor for the possibility that I had received a set of those bearings. I told them that the car was still on jack stands and had not been driven since installed. I also said it would probably be about six weeks until I got to it. I did not get them inspected in the six week period. UPS dropped off a box from the vendor that I had not ordered and in it was a replacement set with all necessary parts to install them.
As I recall, those bearings were not case hardened and to tell if you had the bad bearings there were two more rollers in them than the original design, if memory serves me, the originals have 12 rollers and the bad ones had 14 in each cage.
I commend the vendor for being on top of getting the right thing done when they had a problem. That vendor was Bratton's and I thank Walt for being the businessman that he is.

Glen

Bingo

Rowdy · 04-01-2016, 09:37 AM

The scary thing is that if Brattons recieved part of a bad batch then it is likely that other vendors without morals (Macs) also received some and it is likely many are on the road and getting the money back or getting replacements will be near impossible. Rod

Mitch//pa · 04-01-2016, 09:42 AM

I know for a fact that Tams in MA (Joe) is and has been acquiring his own quality replacements. I am not sure if what he is getting is making its way to any other dealers....
It is very very scary with lives on the line...

George Miller · 04-01-2016, 10:04 AM

I have had 25 Model A's and have never had to replace a rear wheel bearing. My goal is to build the best car or truck that I can with out replacing a lot of the original parts.
It has worked well for me. When ever I have had to replace parts I was disappointed with the repo parts. Some are getting better now, and hope they keep working on getting them better.

mkmskm · 04-01-2016, 10:13 AM

I have new bearings that I'm getting ready to install on a chassis I'm rebuilding this weekend and mine don't have that spiral groove like the style in the shown. It looks like Bratton's sells this style and Snyder's and Mac's has the smooth rollers.

CarlG · 04-01-2016, 10:17 AM

The first time I took my rear hubs off, I thought for sure that I would need new bearings (among other things). So I ordered a set. When I got everything cleaned up, the bearings that I took out were Ford script bearings and looked perfect. So back in they went. Still have the "new" set on the shelf.

Pat Martone · 04-01-2016, 10:32 AM

I just ordering a rear roller bearing from Bratton's; they do not have the spiral groove in them as illustrated in the catalog. When I called them they told me the photo in the catalog is wrong.

Mitch//pa · 04-01-2016, 11:28 AM

Tams has the spiral grooves

OlSkoolTech · 04-01-2016, 01:22 PM

Good Day! I hope All are enjoying a pleasant one. Yuck! What a mess! You would think with all that going on you would hear something right away. Try putting something like this in the mix to help prevent further damage. I hope the link works, I'm a new member, first post, wingin' iit!

xon 1LDiB CAN 635 FINELY POWDERED GRAPHITE

https://www.waresdirect.com/products...FYlehgod3cUF6A

I used to use it on lawn/garden tractors when I was a Tech for Sears. I'd mix it up with some heavy duty thick ugly grease and pack it in. I'd use it to get a little more life out of mandrels and bearings. When you put the wheel on make sure you give it a good "wobble" test. Thinking about 2ManyCars Post again, I wonder if the Torque Specs are different for these bearings.

I like the answer that 2ManyCars gave you. Sometimes the stuff that looks like the "real/good" stuff, is just a wolf in greasy clothing... and stealthy as it eats up your rear end.

I'm going to Follow this Post closely... I'm very curious to know what you find is the culprit. I Hate/Love when this kind of thing happens. It's Fun to troubleshoot, but Not Fun to spend tons of time, and a truck load of money to fix it especially when you have a "real" life going on in the background.

Cheers!

John

PS. This is my first post. Everybody go check out my Profile and Photo Album. Hey 2ManyCars, I was going to press a button to "Like" your post but I didn't see a feature like that... so, uhhh... I "Like" your post. I like that kind of behind the scenes data.

OlSkoolTech · 04-01-2016, 01:26 PM

Oops! I hope it's Ok to put that reference in my post. Some boards don't like that. Please let me know if I did a
baddee.

John

Ron W · 04-01-2016, 08:00 PM

Graphite grease is often used in high pressure applications. It is commonly used in saw mill machines. I think that is what you have. There is no need to replace or condemn parts that are not worn. Ron W

Zener424 · 04-01-2016, 09:44 PM

For those of you that posted late, you may have missed my earlier response at Post #15. I determined what the problem is. I purchased bearings that were part of a bad batch. They were manufactured incorrectly. The end plates are soft and get ground up by the rollers. In addition the end of the rollers grind into the inner surface of the hub. All this fine metal mixes with the grease and makes the silvery gray paste that you see. Go back and look at the photos in Post #15. You can see that one of the bearings actually failed and fell completely apart when I removed it.

Thanks for everyone's help & support.

Benson · 04-01-2016, 10:52 PM

For those reading this I had a similar failure with the needle bearings in my stock Model A transmission that destroyed 2nd gear and the cluster gear. One of the two bearings inside the cluster gear fell apart just like the ones shown here.

The bearing that totally failed was on the end that supports second gear end of the cluster.

So the cluster gear was allowed to "flop" around which destroyed second gear and the matching gear on the cluster.

The cages on the surviving bearings had the oblong holes worn in them and the pins on the rollers were worn to a point.

The transmission worked fine for about 8,000 miles it just made a lot of noise in second gear at speeds above 20 MPH. It was really loud!

So I just shifted early and lived with the noise.

This transmission was built with all new parts in the Mid 1980s.

At the time that it finally failed (about 6 years ago) I did not have any explanation as to why it failed. I now think after seeing this that defective needle bearings caused the failure.

Note: the parts were purchased new in the mid 1980s from a company that no longer exists. So hopefully we do not have to worry about getting bad bearings from suppliers today.

Ron W · 04-02-2016, 07:35 AM

Sorry, I did miss that you had packed the bearings yourself. I guess I'm half asleep when I read the forum. Ron W

CWPASADENA · 04-03-2016, 12:04 AM

I am in the process of rebuilding the rear end out of my '31 Vicky. One of the wheel bearings showed some ware, both were original "Ford". I found an old rear hub and drum in my parts stash that had a good original "Ford" bearing and this is what I will use to replace the worn one.

Like others have said, Re-using good original used bearings is just fine. Original bearings are very good quality and rarely cause any problems.

My experience,

Chris W.

04-01-2016, 07:15 AM	#21
C26Pinelake BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: Michigan / Ontario border, Sarnia, Ontario. 50 miles from Detroit and 150 from Toronto. Posts: 5,800	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? I am ready to purchase new bearings. Please advise me and everyone else where these were purchased. Wayne

04-01-2016, 07:21 AM	#22
john in illinois Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Illinois Posts: 2,184	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? I have had this problem. I think most vendors sell the same bearings. Seek out good used bearings. These straight roller bearings also need fibrous grease not modern grease. Napa has crc stalube 3131 short fiber drum brake grease which these bearings originally used. May have to order it. John

04-01-2016, 07:23 AM	#23
Keith True Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Epping N.H. Posts: 2,987	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? Rear wheel bearings are one of the things I've almost always found to be good.I've had rear ends full of water,with the ring and pinion one solid mass,with good bearings in the hubs.I have seen a couple that had the hub run loose,on those the bearing rollers were almost barrel shaped.They had to have done that for a long time to wear them that much.I have a rear that I used in my truck for years that has a huge amount of end play in it.It doesn't rub on anything,but the play is all toward the outside,not the inside.evidently all the wear is on the carrier where the axle rides on it,not on the spider where the end of the axle rides.You can pull the axle outwards,but you can't push it in enough for it to rub anywhere.

04-01-2016, 08:38 AM	#24
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? This is why I don't replace good original bearings.

04-01-2016, 09:01 AM	#25
Glen in Hillman MI Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 107	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? I was one of the recipients of the bad wheel bearings that was not hardened and I got a call from the vendor for the possibility that I had received a set of those bearings. I told them that the car was still on jack stands and had not been driven since installed. I also said it would probably be about six weeks until I got to it. I did not get them inspected in the six week period. UPS dropped off a box from the vendor that I had not ordered and in it was a replacement set with all necessary parts to install them. As I recall, those bearings were not case hardened and to tell if you had the bad bearings there were two more rollers in them than the original design, if memory serves me, the originals have 12 rollers and the bad ones had 14 in each cage. I commend the vendor for being on top of getting the right thing done when they had a problem. That vendor was Bratton's and I thank Walt for being the businessman that he is. Glen

04-01-2016, 09:37 AM	#27
Rowdy BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: Gothenburg Nebraska Just off I-80 Posts: 4,893	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? The scary thing is that if Brattons recieved part of a bad batch then it is likely that other vendors without morals (Macs) also received some and it is likely many are on the road and getting the money back or getting replacements will be near impossible. Rod __________________ Do the RIGHT thing - Support the H.A.M.B. Alliance!!!!

04-01-2016, 09:42 AM	#28
Mitch//pa BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bucks County, PA Posts: 11,454	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? I know for a fact that Tams in MA (Joe) is and has been acquiring his own quality replacements. I am not sure if what he is getting is making its way to any other dealers.... It is very very scary with lives on the line...

04-01-2016, 10:04 AM	#29
George Miller Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: NC Posts: 2,975	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? I have had 25 Model A's and have never had to replace a rear wheel bearing. My goal is to build the best car or truck that I can with out replacing a lot of the original parts. It has worked well for me. When ever I have had to replace parts I was disappointed with the repo parts. Some are getting better now, and hope they keep working on getting them better.

04-01-2016, 10:13 AM	#30
mkmskm Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Kansas City Posts: 202	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? I have new bearings that I'm getting ready to install on a chassis I'm rebuilding this weekend and mine don't have that spiral groove like the style in the shown. It looks like Bratton's sells this style and Snyder's and Mac's has the smooth rollers.

04-01-2016, 10:17 AM	#31
CarlG Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Anchorage, Alaska Posts: 9,115	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? The first time I took my rear hubs off, I thought for sure that I would need new bearings (among other things). So I ordered a set. When I got everything cleaned up, the bearings that I took out were Ford script bearings and looked perfect. So back in they went. Still have the "new" set on the shelf. __________________ Alaskan A's Antique Auto Mushers of Alaska Model A Ford Club of America Model A Restorers Club Antique Automobile Club of America Mullins Owner's Club

04-01-2016, 10:32 AM	#32
Pat Martone Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 495	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? I just ordering a rear roller bearing from Bratton's; they do not have the spiral groove in them as illustrated in the catalog. When I called them they told me the photo in the catalog is wrong.

04-01-2016, 11:28 AM	#33
Mitch//pa BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bucks County, PA Posts: 11,454	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? Tams has the spiral grooves

04-01-2016, 01:22 PM	#34
OlSkoolTech Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Upstate NY, Owego Posts: 2	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? Good Day! I hope All are enjoying a pleasant one. Yuck! What a mess! You would think with all that going on you would hear something right away. Try putting something like this in the mix to help prevent further damage. I hope the link works, I'm a new member, first post, wingin' iit! xon 1LDiB CAN 635 FINELY POWDERED GRAPHITE https://www.waresdirect.com/products...FYlehgod3cUF6A I used to use it on lawn/garden tractors when I was a Tech for Sears. I'd mix it up with some heavy duty thick ugly grease and pack it in. I'd use it to get a little more life out of mandrels and bearings. When you put the wheel on make sure you give it a good "wobble" test. Thinking about 2ManyCars Post again, I wonder if the Torque Specs are different for these bearings. I like the answer that 2ManyCars gave you. Sometimes the stuff that looks like the "real/good" stuff, is just a wolf in greasy clothing... and stealthy as it eats up your rear end. I'm going to Follow this Post closely... I'm very curious to know what you find is the culprit. I Hate/Love when this kind of thing happens. It's Fun to troubleshoot, but Not Fun to spend tons of time, and a truck load of money to fix it especially when you have a "real" life going on in the background. Cheers! John PS. This is my first post. Everybody go check out my Profile and Photo Album. Hey 2ManyCars, I was going to press a button to "Like" your post but I didn't see a feature like that... so, uhhh... I "Like" your post. I like that kind of behind the scenes data.

04-01-2016, 01:26 PM	#35
OlSkoolTech Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Upstate NY, Owego Posts: 2	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? Oops! I hope it's Ok to put that reference in my post. Some boards don't like that. Please let me know if I did a baddee. John

04-01-2016, 08:00 PM	#36
Ron W Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Central Me. Posts: 260	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? Graphite grease is often used in high pressure applications. It is commonly used in saw mill machines. I think that is what you have. There is no need to replace or condemn parts that are not worn. Ron W

04-01-2016, 09:44 PM	#37
Zener424 Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Staten Island, NY Posts: 77	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? For those of you that posted late, you may have missed my earlier response at Post #15. I determined what the problem is. I purchased bearings that were part of a bad batch. They were manufactured incorrectly. The end plates are soft and get ground up by the rollers. In addition the end of the rollers grind into the inner surface of the hub. All this fine metal mixes with the grease and makes the silvery gray paste that you see. Go back and look at the photos in Post #15. You can see that one of the bearings actually failed and fell completely apart when I removed it. Thanks for everyone's help & support.

04-01-2016, 10:52 PM	#38
Benson Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 2,595	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Similar transmission bearing FAILURE. For those reading this I had a similar failure with the needle bearings in my stock Model A transmission that destroyed 2nd gear and the cluster gear. One of the two bearings inside the cluster gear fell apart just like the ones shown here. The bearing that totally failed was on the end that supports second gear end of the cluster. So the cluster gear was allowed to "flop" around which destroyed second gear and the matching gear on the cluster. The cages on the surviving bearings had the oblong holes worn in them and the pins on the rollers were worn to a point. The transmission worked fine for about 8,000 miles it just made a lot of noise in second gear at speeds above 20 MPH. It was really loud! So I just shifted early and lived with the noise. This transmission was built with all new parts in the Mid 1980s. At the time that it finally failed (about 6 years ago) I did not have any explanation as to why it failed. I now think after seeing this that defective needle bearings caused the failure. Note: the parts were purchased new in the mid 1980s from a company that no longer exists. So hopefully we do not have to worry about getting bad bearings from suppliers today. Last edited by Benson; 04-02-2016 at 07:09 AM. Reason: Spelling corrections

04-02-2016, 07:35 AM	#39
Ron W Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Central Me. Posts: 260	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? Sorry, I did miss that you had packed the bearings yourself. I guess I'm half asleep when I read the forum. Ron W

04-03-2016, 12:04 AM	#40
CWPASADENA Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: PASADENA, CA Posts: 1,884	Re: Rear Wheel Bearing Grease Silver Gray. Is this Rear End Shot? I am in the process of rebuilding the rear end out of my '31 Vicky. One of the wheel bearings showed some ware, both were original "Ford". I found an old rear hub and drum in my parts stash that had a good original "Ford" bearing and this is what I will use to replace the worn one. Like others have said, Re-using good original used bearings is just fine. Original bearings are very good quality and rarely cause any problems. My experience, Chris W.