The Ford Barn

reggiedog · 07-26-2011, 08:34 PM

HI: I need some help is there any one around Eau Claire Wisc. That could help me to take a 31 model a motor apart. So I can send it out to Mass. To have a crack fixed in the block that was repaired years ago. But it leaks a little when it;s hot and I don't want to have it heat up screw up the motor any more then it already is. So if there some one that could help me take it apart I'm NOT a machanic and I'm disabled but I do know alittle about macanics alittle. But I need some one to do it on the cheap and put it back together again when it comes back in about three to four weeks. I'm on S.S. So you know where I am can't aford crap. I've been working on this car for about 10 to 15teen years. I just can't aford to buy to much at any one time. I have most of the stuff to get the car back together but I do buy parts from time to time. The crack in the motor is on the front water way and it's going to cost me about 1200.00 to have it shipped out there and fixed and sent back. I'm NOT going to do this until I can aford it probably this winter . I have to save up for it so I need some one that I can call when I'm ready to take the motor apart. So Please let me know if theres any one around that is willing to take the motor apart on the cheap. I just can't aford to much as I said before I'm on S.S. so I have little money to pay much and I would like to do it at my house. Thanks let me know reggiedog

Tom Wesenberg · 07-27-2011, 12:51 AM

There should be a shop close to home that can fix that crack. We have some shops in the Twin Cities, and that would save you a lot on shipping.

Craig Lewis · 07-27-2011, 01:29 AM

$1200xx? ...sounds a mite high don't cha think?

So...is that a crack on the outside waterjacket behind the oil filler tube? There's a few people who have covered this common crack with JB weld and had it last for years.
Not telling you how to spend your money....just saying...
I think for $1200 I'd desire a guarantee including freight and dissassembly and ABOVE ALL you'll want some assurance that they aren't going to heat the block enough to damage the babbit bearings or that'll add another $2000 aprox. to the total.
Based by your apparent financial limitations I'd suggest spending $8xx on the JB weld and use the balance towards finishing your car.

reggiedog · 07-27-2011, 05:22 AM

I was going to do thee patch thing first. But it still needs to be fixed the right way. And no they don't heat the motor and the crack is in the front of the water way just under the water pump. And every thing is to be taken out of the motor so it's just the block and the only ones in the u.s. that fixes the crack the way it's garenteed.

Bill in NJ · 07-27-2011, 07:19 AM

Its sounds a lot cheaper if you buy a good used motor or buy one rebuilt for $ 2,000 or so. What happens when you take the motor apart and find the rear main cracked, timing gear worn, you have a bad valve seat, to much end play in crankshaft, need a new gasket kit, get head shaved etc etc?? You end up spending more money then a rebuilt woud cost.

reggiedog · 07-27-2011, 08:14 AM

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NO what happened is it is a brand new rebiult model a motor that is all counter balenced> and we had it put in the car and that winter my Dad never told me that all it had in it was water. It was still his car and it was in his garage not mine and the motor cracked that first winter. We had it taken back out and I took it some where to have it fix. The guy that welded it was to stitch weld it but he never did that. All he did was took a mig welder and welded the crack now it leaks out the weld. So now the only way to fix it is to have it taken apart and magafluxed and the crack pined together. And to do that is to take it apart and send it out to Mass. And have it fixed out there. But I need help taking the motor apart I'm not a macanic but I do know a little about macanics and how to fix thing but I'm disabled and can;t do it any more. So I need some one to take it apart and put it together when it comes back in about three to four weeks. J and M Machine is the only place in the U.S. that can do that kind of work to make a peice for the motor and pin it to the motor and magaflux and presure test it. So if any body can help me Please let me know. thanks reggiedog. Or some one that has a good cheap block that I can buy on the cheap but it has to be a good model a block. I think mine is the long block made in late 30/31 for a late 31 delux tudor.

cars56 · 07-27-2011, 06:37 PM

Reggie
Contact a Model A club in your vicinity
See if the tech guru can take a look at the motor before spending a fortune on it.

mantta · 07-27-2011, 06:43 PM

Metal Crafters in Stevens Point, WI does excellent work. Their website is http://www.metalcraftersinc.org/engineshop.html

Bruce,Upstate NY · 07-27-2011, 08:57 PM

Go the simple route first and avoid disassembly. Just pull the radiator and maybe water pump. Sounds like a common front crack. If so, there are likely hundreds on the road now with "bubble gum" repairs. I've seen quite a few.

darrylkmc · 07-27-2011, 09:21 PM

I have repaired many Model A water jacket cracks using solid 1/8" square headed brass pipe plugs. Drill both ends of the crack, tap with pipe tap, thread in the plugs, grind almost flush with the block, drill one half into the crack and one half into the plug, tap the hole, thread in the plug, grind, drill and repeat and work your way to the center. Center punch each plug to assure they are set good and grind flush with the block. When you paint the block you will hard pressed to find the repair.
I have one Model B engine that I repaired 25 years ago and has 50,000 miles on it.

Tom Wesenberg · 07-27-2011, 09:25 PM

I agree with Bruce, just clean the crack well and try some JB Weld. If someone goobered it up with a bad weld just grind it off. Use a Dremel and undercut the crack a bit and fill it with JB Weld. I haven't done it, but have heard of several others that have and say it has worked fine.

29 model-a · 07-27-2011, 09:45 PM

I also agree with Bruce and Tom all you have to lose is alittle time and JB weld. Pete

reggiedog · 07-28-2011, 06:25 AM

HI: For right now I'm just going to use a product called water glass. That's for biolers and check out that LOCK AND STITCH place. But I talked to J and J Machine and got some names that I will call when I get closer to doing the fix and can afford it. But for right now I'm just going to use that water glass stuff that j and j Machine told me to use for now till I can aford to get it fixed the right way. And check out that lock and stitch place and that other place that's in Wisconsin and see what they can do. But for right now I'm just going to use the water glass stuff till I can afford to get it fixed. But I have a lot of other things to get done on the car first. I am going to get most of the car done first. Like get it sand or gead blasted sealed primed and then painted the guys on the barn gave me alot of Ideas for the painting the car and what to do and how to do it. So I'm going to do that first. But thanks for all of the input. reggiedog

Terry, NJ · 07-28-2011, 07:40 AM

Reggie, we can't even begin to calculate shipping charges on a 300+ lbs block of iron. Shipping today is so costly that you can easily double the cost in shipping rates alone.
I don't know J&M (J) machine but I find it hard to believe that their arts and methods of fixing a cracked block are so esoteric that they can't be
duplicated by others at a much lower cost. JB Weld and some judicious grinding with a Dremel seems to be a recognised method. Drilling "Crackstop" holes at the cracks, tapping them and putting a screw plug in them is a beginning. DON"T weld Cast Iron with a MIG gun. MIG welding was never intended to be used on cast iron. Cast iron must be welded with " stick" and with Ni-rod (Nickel). A good welder would probably charge less than $100 to do it. Call around to heavy equiptment operators and large trucking outfits to find out how they do a cracked block. Getting back to JB Weld, I recall this method being used reliably by the guys over at Yesterday's Tractors by tractor restorers. It's not "New and Improved". It has been around for a resonably long time and is well proven.
You seem to be stuck on J&M Machine as the only ones who can repair this block "Correctly", Not so! I will guarantee you that their are many thousands of cracked mod A blocks out there that have been successfully repaired by others, some with less mechanical experience than your own.

Terry

Quote:

Originally Posted by reggiedog

HI: I need some help is there any one around Eau Claire Wisc. That could help me to take a 31 model a motor apart. So I can send it out to Mass. To have a crack fixed in the block that was repaired years ago. But it leaks a little when it;s hot and I don't want to have it heat up screw up the motor any more then it already is. So if there some one that could help me take it apart I'm NOT a machanic and I'm disabled but I do know alittle about macanics alittle. But I need some one to do it on the cheap and put it back together again when it comes back in about three to four weeks. I'm on S.S. So you know where I am can't aford crap. I've been working on this car for about 10 to 15teen years. I just can't aford to buy to much at any one time. I have most of the stuff to get the car back together but I do buy parts from time to time. The crack in the motor is on the front water way and it's going to cost me about 1200.00 to have it shipped out there and fixed and sent back. I'm NOT going to do this until I can aford it probably this winter . I have to save up for it so I need some one that I can call when I'm ready to take the motor apart. So Please let me know if theres any one around that is willing to take the motor apart on the cheap. I just can't aford to much as I said before I'm on S.S. so I have little money to pay much and I would like to do it at my house. Thanks let me know reggiedog

reggiedog · 07-28-2011, 09:02 AM

YOU know Terry your right there are alot of places around that can fix the blocks of motors that's why I'm going to put that water glass in the crack for now until I find some one some where that can fix the crack the right way. Until then I will just keep fixing the body of the car until I can aford to fix the crack. If you read of the stuff on here and the H.A.M.B. there are people that have givin me some great advice and I'm for now going to use a lot of them. Til I can aford to fix the crack in the motor and still keep looking for some one that can fix it right. But you and alot of other people have given me alot of advice on here and I thank all of you guys could not have done it with out your advice. Thanks again reggiedog

07-26-2011, 08:34 PM	#1
reggiedog Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 890	Help: model a motor HI: I need some help is there any one around Eau Claire Wisc. That could help me to take a 31 model a motor apart. So I can send it out to Mass. To have a crack fixed in the block that was repaired years ago. But it leaks a little when it;s hot and I don't want to have it heat up screw up the motor any more then it already is. So if there some one that could help me take it apart I'm NOT a machanic and I'm disabled but I do know alittle about macanics alittle. But I need some one to do it on the cheap and put it back together again when it comes back in about three to four weeks. I'm on S.S. So you know where I am can't aford crap. I've been working on this car for about 10 to 15teen years. I just can't aford to buy to much at any one time. I have most of the stuff to get the car back together but I do buy parts from time to time. The crack in the motor is on the front water way and it's going to cost me about 1200.00 to have it shipped out there and fixed and sent back. I'm NOT going to do this until I can aford it probably this winter . I have to save up for it so I need some one that I can call when I'm ready to take the motor apart. So Please let me know if theres any one around that is willing to take the motor apart on the cheap. I just can't aford to much as I said before I'm on S.S. so I have little money to pay much and I would like to do it at my house. Thanks let me know reggiedog

07-27-2011, 12:51 AM	#2
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: Help: model a motor There should be a shop close to home that can fix that crack. We have some shops in the Twin Cities, and that would save you a lot on shipping.

07-27-2011, 01:29 AM	#3
Craig Lewis Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Parksville B.C. Canada Posts: 880	Re: Help: model a motor $1200xx? ...sounds a mite high don't cha think? So...is that a crack on the outside waterjacket behind the oil filler tube? There's a few people who have covered this common crack with JB weld and had it last for years. Not telling you how to spend your money....just saying... I think for $1200 I'd desire a guarantee including freight and dissassembly and ABOVE ALL you'll want some assurance that they aren't going to heat the block enough to damage the babbit bearings or that'll add another $2000 aprox. to the total. Based by your apparent financial limitations I'd suggest spending $8xx on the JB weld and use the balance towards finishing your car.

07-27-2011, 05:22 AM	#4
reggiedog Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 890	Re: Help: model a motor I was going to do thee patch thing first. But it still needs to be fixed the right way. And no they don't heat the motor and the crack is in the front of the water way just under the water pump. And every thing is to be taken out of the motor so it's just the block and the only ones in the u.s. that fixes the crack the way it's garenteed.

07-27-2011, 07:19 AM	#5
Bill in NJ Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,159	Re: Help: model a motor Its sounds a lot cheaper if you buy a good used motor or buy one rebuilt for $ 2,000 or so. What happens when you take the motor apart and find the rear main cracked, timing gear worn, you have a bad valve seat, to much end play in crankshaft, need a new gasket kit, get head shaved etc etc?? You end up spending more money then a rebuilt woud cost.

07-27-2011, 08:14 AM	#6
reggiedog Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 890	Re: Help: model a motor Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) NO what happened is it is a brand new rebiult model a motor that is all counter balenced> and we had it put in the car and that winter my Dad never told me that all it had in it was water. It was still his car and it was in his garage not mine and the motor cracked that first winter. We had it taken back out and I took it some where to have it fix. The guy that welded it was to stitch weld it but he never did that. All he did was took a mig welder and welded the crack now it leaks out the weld. So now the only way to fix it is to have it taken apart and magafluxed and the crack pined together. And to do that is to take it apart and send it out to Mass. And have it fixed out there. But I need help taking the motor apart I'm not a macanic but I do know a little about macanics and how to fix thing but I'm disabled and can;t do it any more. So I need some one to take it apart and put it together when it comes back in about three to four weeks. J and M Machine is the only place in the U.S. that can do that kind of work to make a peice for the motor and pin it to the motor and magaflux and presure test it. So if any body can help me Please let me know. thanks reggiedog. Or some one that has a good cheap block that I can buy on the cheap but it has to be a good model a block. I think mine is the long block made in late 30/31 for a late 31 delux tudor. Last edited by reggiedog; 07-27-2011 at 08:19 AM.

07-27-2011, 06:37 PM	#7
cars56 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Queens, NYC Posts: 212	Re: Help: model a motor Reggie Contact a Model A club in your vicinity See if the tech guru can take a look at the motor before spending a fortune on it.

07-27-2011, 06:43 PM	#8
mantta Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Keweenaw Bay, MI (Michigan's Upper Peninsula) Posts: 218	Re: Help: model a motor Metal Crafters in Stevens Point, WI does excellent work. Their website is http://www.metalcraftersinc.org/engineshop.html

07-27-2011, 08:57 PM	#9
Bruce,Upstate NY Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Odessa, NY Posts: 385	Re: Help: model a motor Go the simple route first and avoid disassembly. Just pull the radiator and maybe water pump. Sounds like a common front crack. If so, there are likely hundreds on the road now with "bubble gum" repairs. I've seen quite a few.

07-27-2011, 09:21 PM	#10
darrylkmc Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Fairbanks, Alaska Posts: 767	Re: Help: model a motor I have repaired many Model A water jacket cracks using solid 1/8" square headed brass pipe plugs. Drill both ends of the crack, tap with pipe tap, thread in the plugs, grind almost flush with the block, drill one half into the crack and one half into the plug, tap the hole, thread in the plug, grind, drill and repeat and work your way to the center. Center punch each plug to assure they are set good and grind flush with the block. When you paint the block you will hard pressed to find the repair. I have one Model B engine that I repaired 25 years ago and has 50,000 miles on it.

07-27-2011, 09:25 PM	#11
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: Help: model a motor I agree with Bruce, just clean the crack well and try some JB Weld. If someone goobered it up with a bad weld just grind it off. Use a Dremel and undercut the crack a bit and fill it with JB Weld. I haven't done it, but have heard of several others that have and say it has worked fine.

07-27-2011, 09:45 PM	#12
29 model-a Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Iron River Wi Posts: 172	Re: Help: model a motor I also agree with Bruce and Tom all you have to lose is alittle time and JB weld. Pete

07-28-2011, 06:25 AM	#13
reggiedog Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 890	Re: Help: model a motor HI: For right now I'm just going to use a product called water glass. That's for biolers and check out that LOCK AND STITCH place. But I talked to J and J Machine and got some names that I will call when I get closer to doing the fix and can afford it. But for right now I'm just going to use that water glass stuff that j and j Machine told me to use for now till I can aford to get it fixed the right way. And check out that lock and stitch place and that other place that's in Wisconsin and see what they can do. But for right now I'm just going to use the water glass stuff till I can afford to get it fixed. But I have a lot of other things to get done on the car first. I am going to get most of the car done first. Like get it sand or gead blasted sealed primed and then painted the guys on the barn gave me alot of Ideas for the painting the car and what to do and how to do it. So I'm going to do that first. But thanks for all of the input. reggiedog

07-28-2011, 09:02 AM	#15
reggiedog Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 890	Re: Help: model a motor YOU know Terry your right there are alot of places around that can fix the blocks of motors that's why I'm going to put that water glass in the crack for now until I find some one some where that can fix the crack the right way. Until then I will just keep fixing the body of the car until I can aford to fix the crack. If you read of the stuff on here and the H.A.M.B. there are people that have givin me some great advice and I'm for now going to use a lot of them. Til I can aford to fix the crack in the motor and still keep looking for some one that can fix it right. But you and alot of other people have given me alot of advice on here and I thank all of you guys could not have done it with out your advice. Thanks again reggiedog