The Ford Barn

Karo201 · 01-13-2013, 05:03 PM

Hello,

I´m new in this community and got the hint from Christoph from Frankfurt/ Germany. Since about 4 month I started with Model A and got first a Roadster and soon after that a Phaeton with a G28T engine. It probably was installed still in Uruguay before 1994, but not realy to say. The Phaeton is the car, that really touched my heart. Obviously it was not loved during the last 20 years so since then I´m the first to dive into the car.
Now I thought one of the first things to do is to remove the oil pan to give it a good clean. After removing all visable screws the pan was loose and moved a bit, but didn´t come off. To lever gently with a screw driver didn´t help and I didn´t want to damage the aluminium structure. I was looking for hidden srews even with an endoskope - but no success. By adapting the G28T to the "A" the oil pan was cut just before the fly wheel housing. Comparing to the oil pan of the "A" (remember, I still got the Roadster)the "A" has one pair of screws more that are closer to the crank shaft at the back of the engine. These are not visable at the G28T. Now I assume, that there are screws as well, which are just accessable after removing the fly wheel housing.
Now my quetion: Does anyone have experience with the G28T engine with adapted oil pan?
What can be the reason, that the oil pan doesn´t get off?

I´m thankful for all hints...

Best regards from the beautiful Heidelberg in the southern part of Germany
Peter

P.S. my login name Karo comes from "KAbienenrROller", which was a famous Messerschmitt bubble car in Germany in the fifties. I got my first one, when I was 17, now more than 30 years ago. That´s the one on my avatar.

BRENT in 10-uh-C · 01-13-2013, 05:14 PM

Welcome to Fordbarn!!

lf your G28 engine was installed using a Model-A flywheel housing, you must remove the engine from the car and then remove the flywheel housing to gain access to the bol;ts. This is because the alloy oil pan is shaped differently than the typical Model-A or Model-B pan. Good luck!

juke joint johnny · 01-13-2013, 05:31 PM

Welcome to the Barn Karo !!!!

John Cochran

Joop · 01-13-2013, 05:49 PM

Check out these links also.

Click here: G28T

Click here: Model 'A' Ford Garage ~ Model 'B' Ford Garage

Click here: G28 - The Ford Barn

BRENT in 10-uh-C · 01-13-2013, 06:50 PM

Notice the difference in the two oil pans in the flywheel housing area...

.

Karo201 · 01-28-2013, 05:53 PM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Dear all,

last weekend I took out the engine and it was as assumed: the oil pan is longer towards the gearbox and therefore was stuck in the flywheel housing.

Best regards
Peter

Karo201 · 01-31-2013, 04:27 PM

Here two pictures: the oil pan and the engine aftre I removed the flywheel. You can see the two ribs of the oil pan.

Best regards
Peter

juke joint johnny · 01-31-2013, 04:49 PM

Interesting to see the oilpan photo !!
It is quite different than the normal A or B Steel pans in that rear bearing area.
, What is the condition of the rest of the engine ?

I have the name of a company in Holland who say they can make the main bearings for the G28T but they need the block and crank .
Good Luck with it and keep us posted on your progress

John Cochran

Karo201 · 02-09-2013, 11:09 AM

after cutting the gasket I wanted to reassemble the oil pan. Just a short check in the open engine and clean the oil pump...then I realized, that the oil pump was cracked at several places and it came from a B. Now I try to find out, which oil pump would be the best replacement.
Has anyone experience with the high volume oil pump from Snyders?

About the main bearings I decided not to open the engine any further. It ran before, so I will let it run.

BRENT in 10-uh-C · 02-09-2013, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karo201

after cutting the gasket I wanted to reassemble the oil pan. Just a short check in the open engine and clean the oil pump...then I realized, that the oil pump was cracked at several places and it came from a B. Now I try to find out, which oil pump would be the best replacement.
Has anyone experience with the high volume oil pump from Snyders?

About the main bearings I decided not to open the engine any further. It ran before, so I will let it run.

It has been awhile since I looked inside the G28 but I seem to recall those oil pumps had a pressure relief valve on the side of the housing. Does yours??

Karo201 · 02-09-2013, 05:44 PM

yes, it does!
Due to no mark as G28, I actually believe, this was a B-pump. It also is from zink and I read somewhere, that the G28 oil pump was made from aluminium.

quickchange · 02-09-2013, 06:23 PM

Karo, G28T has cast iron pump, with relief valve , also has the german ford script , I have one out of engine , you can use an A or B pump with mods, seal the top as oil exits before, I cut a relief valve off a V8 pump, drill hole in housing & Brazed the valve on , works great, recently ordered ordered hi vol pump you asked about to test .

Karo201 · 02-10-2013, 04:18 PM

quickchange: basically you say, that the top must be sealed, right?
I already assumed, that the cam shaft bearings of the G28T is pressurized and therefore do not need the gravity oil; what do you say?
Due to the time pressure to get the car on the road, I´m looking for a quick solution, even if it costs a few bucks...

BRENT in 10-uh-C · 02-10-2013, 05:18 PM

While I am not QC, I will tell you that the Model B oiling system is NOT the same as a G28T engine. On a B engine, the oil pressure galley runs along the the bottom of the valve chamber cover, --and not so on the G28.

I think what you will need to do is convert the B pump by welding (brazing) the upper part of the housing and then machining it round with a groove for an O-ring. Then braze a pop-off valve onto the side. I have seen a small air compressor pop-off valve modified for this use by dropping the pressure down to 30 pounds.

BRENT in 10-uh-C · 02-10-2013, 05:22 PM

One other thought is to contact Bill Stipe or Dan Price and consider purchasing one of the billet aftermarket pumps that has a relief valve already installed. The downside to this is locale of your engine and both of these manufacturers.

quickchange · 02-10-2013, 07:29 PM

Brent is correct , although the G28T pump is not sealed at the top itis a nice fit , If using a B or A with relief valve fitted , you would need to fill the slot on each side there , machine round & a O ring would be nice . I can,t add pictures to here , but can do on a new thread , unless someone tells me how ?? Yes all is preasure fed,

Karo201 · 02-11-2013, 04:51 PM

All of your hints go the same direction and therefore: many thanks!!!
I would believe, that the solution from Snyders might not the cheapest, but here in Germany one of the fastest...
Here the link to what I aim for:
http://www.snydersantiqueauto.com/4709
It is already sealed off at the top and the pressure relieve is also included.

01-13-2013, 05:03 PM	#1
Karo201 Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Heidelberg / Germany Posts: 7	remove the oil pan of a converted G28T Hello, I´m new in this community and got the hint from Christoph from Frankfurt/ Germany. Since about 4 month I started with Model A and got first a Roadster and soon after that a Phaeton with a G28T engine. It probably was installed still in Uruguay before 1994, but not realy to say. The Phaeton is the car, that really touched my heart. Obviously it was not loved during the last 20 years so since then I´m the first to dive into the car. Now I thought one of the first things to do is to remove the oil pan to give it a good clean. After removing all visable screws the pan was loose and moved a bit, but didn´t come off. To lever gently with a screw driver didn´t help and I didn´t want to damage the aluminium structure. I was looking for hidden srews even with an endoskope - but no success. By adapting the G28T to the "A" the oil pan was cut just before the fly wheel housing. Comparing to the oil pan of the "A" (remember, I still got the Roadster)the "A" has one pair of screws more that are closer to the crank shaft at the back of the engine. These are not visable at the G28T. Now I assume, that there are screws as well, which are just accessable after removing the fly wheel housing. Now my quetion: Does anyone have experience with the G28T engine with adapted oil pan? What can be the reason, that the oil pan doesn´t get off? I´m thankful for all hints... Best regards from the beautiful Heidelberg in the southern part of Germany Peter P.S. my login name Karo comes from "KAbienenrROller", which was a famous Messerschmitt bubble car in Germany in the fifties. I got my first one, when I was 17, now more than 30 years ago. That´s the one on my avatar. Last edited by Karo201; 01-13-2013 at 05:27 PM.

01-13-2013, 05:14 PM	#2
BRENT in 10-uh-C Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Eastern Tennessee Posts: 11,520	Re: remove the oil pan of a converted G28T Welcome to Fordbarn!! lf your G28 engine was installed using a Model-A flywheel housing, you must remove the engine from the car and then remove the flywheel housing to gain access to the bol;ts. This is because the alloy oil pan is shaped differently than the typical Model-A or Model-B pan. Good luck! __________________ . BRENT in 10-uh-C . www.model-a-ford.com ...(...Finally Updated!! ) .

01-13-2013, 05:31 PM	#3
juke joint johnny Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: London England Posts: 908	Re: remove the oil pan of a converted G28T Welcome to the Barn Karo !!!! John Cochran

01-13-2013, 05:49 PM	#4
Joop Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Glendale, AZ Posts: 2,953	Re: remove the oil pan of a converted G28T Check out these links also. Click here: G28T Click here: Model 'A' Ford Garage ~ Model 'B' Ford Garage Click here: G28 - The Ford Barn

01-13-2013, 06:50 PM	#5
BRENT in 10-uh-C Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Eastern Tennessee Posts: 11,520	Re: remove the oil pan of a converted G28T Notice the difference in the two oil pans in the flywheel housing area... . __________________ . BRENT in 10-uh-C . www.model-a-ford.com ...(...Finally Updated!! ) .

01-28-2013, 05:53 PM	#6
Karo201 Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Heidelberg / Germany Posts: 7	Re: remove the oil pan of a converted G28T Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Dear all, last weekend I took out the engine and it was as assumed: the oil pan is longer towards the gearbox and therefore was stuck in the flywheel housing. Best regards Peter

01-31-2013, 04:49 PM	#8
juke joint johnny Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: London England Posts: 908	Re: remove the oil pan of a converted G28T Interesting to see the oilpan photo !! It is quite different than the normal A or B Steel pans in that rear bearing area. , What is the condition of the rest of the engine ? I have the name of a company in Holland who say they can make the main bearings for the G28T but they need the block and crank . Good Luck with it and keep us posted on your progress John Cochran

02-09-2013, 11:09 AM	#9
Karo201 Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Heidelberg / Germany Posts: 7	Re: remove the oil pan of a converted G28T after cutting the gasket I wanted to reassemble the oil pan. Just a short check in the open engine and clean the oil pump...then I realized, that the oil pump was cracked at several places and it came from a B. Now I try to find out, which oil pump would be the best replacement. Has anyone experience with the high volume oil pump from Snyders? About the main bearings I decided not to open the engine any further. It ran before, so I will let it run.

02-09-2013, 05:44 PM	#11
Karo201 Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Heidelberg / Germany Posts: 7	Re: remove the oil pan of a converted G28T yes, it does! Due to no mark as G28, I actually believe, this was a B-pump. It also is from zink and I read somewhere, that the G28 oil pump was made from aluminium.

02-09-2013, 06:23 PM	#12
quickchange Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Nelson. New Zealand Posts: 2,009	Re: remove the oil pan of a converted G28T Karo, G28T has cast iron pump, with relief valve , also has the german ford script , I have one out of engine , you can use an A or B pump with mods, seal the top as oil exits before, I cut a relief valve off a V8 pump, drill hole in housing & Brazed the valve on , works great, recently ordered ordered hi vol pump you asked about to test .

02-10-2013, 04:18 PM	#13
Karo201 Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Heidelberg / Germany Posts: 7	Re: remove the oil pan of a converted G28T quickchange: basically you say, that the top must be sealed, right? I already assumed, that the cam shaft bearings of the G28T is pressurized and therefore do not need the gravity oil; what do you say? Due to the time pressure to get the car on the road, I´m looking for a quick solution, even if it costs a few bucks...

02-10-2013, 05:18 PM	#14
BRENT in 10-uh-C Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Eastern Tennessee Posts: 11,520	Re: remove the oil pan of a converted G28T While I am not QC, I will tell you that the Model B oiling system is NOT the same as a G28T engine. On a B engine, the oil pressure galley runs along the the bottom of the valve chamber cover, --and not so on the G28. I think what you will need to do is convert the B pump by welding (brazing) the upper part of the housing and then machining it round with a groove for an O-ring. Then braze a pop-off valve onto the side. I have seen a small air compressor pop-off valve modified for this use by dropping the pressure down to 30 pounds. __________________ . BRENT in 10-uh-C . www.model-a-ford.com ...(...Finally Updated!! ) .

02-10-2013, 05:22 PM	#15
BRENT in 10-uh-C Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Eastern Tennessee Posts: 11,520	Re: remove the oil pan of a converted G28T One other thought is to contact Bill Stipe or Dan Price and consider purchasing one of the billet aftermarket pumps that has a relief valve already installed. The downside to this is locale of your engine and both of these manufacturers. __________________ . BRENT in 10-uh-C . www.model-a-ford.com ...(...Finally Updated!! ) .

02-10-2013, 07:29 PM	#16
quickchange Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Nelson. New Zealand Posts: 2,009	Re: remove the oil pan of a converted G28T Brent is correct , although the G28T pump is not sealed at the top itis a nice fit , If using a B or A with relief valve fitted , you would need to fill the slot on each side there , machine round & a O ring would be nice . I can,t add pictures to here , but can do on a new thread , unless someone tells me how ?? Yes all is preasure fed,

02-11-2013, 04:51 PM	#17
Karo201 Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Heidelberg / Germany Posts: 7	Re: remove the oil pan of a converted G28T All of your hints go the same direction and therefore: many thanks!!! I would believe, that the solution from Snyders might not the cheapest, but here in Germany one of the fastest... Here the link to what I aim for: http://www.snydersantiqueauto.com/4709 It is already sealed off at the top and the pressure relieve is also included.