12-16-2015, 09:00 PM | #1 |
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8BA Starter
How to remove? I've decided to try taking the starter off and can't seem to find mounting bolts under the thick and solid layer of oil soaked dirt from the past 66 years. Pretty sure it is not the two long bolts that go right through the starter. Pictures in my catalogue do not give any help for details. Guess I need to do some more dirt scraping to find these bolts. This is on the 49 Mercury M68 truck.
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12-16-2015, 09:24 PM | #2 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
Yes indeedy, I do believe that those long bolts screw into the bellhousing and hold the starter in place. Plus, there is a little bracket bolted to the starter and an oil pan bolt that supports the rear end of the starter.
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12-16-2015, 09:26 PM | #3 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
It's the 2 long bolts. Don't remove them from the starter as they hold it together. Also don't drop it on you. It's heavy.
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12-16-2015, 09:36 PM | #4 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
ditto on the 2 long bolts and heavy. and the starter drive likes to hang up on the bell housing plate causing the starter to fall apart. have to hold your tongue just right while holding a 15 pound starter.
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12-16-2015, 10:31 PM | #5 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
Thanks all. Sounds like fun. Especially laying under the truck on a piece of cardboard in the snow at 20 degrees.
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12-20-2015, 06:53 PM | #6 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
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it only needed a fiber spacer everything else was ok old time guy has a shop under his house the cost $5.00 cant beat that |
12-20-2015, 09:40 PM | #7 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
when you do get it out, it's a good idea to put a nut on each long bolt so the starter doesn't fall apart on you when you are moving it around.
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1949 F-1 Flatrod II (flat paint, flat motor) Keeping one more flathead alive It smoked, but gave it up 7/26/2013 East Glenville NY |
12-20-2015, 10:41 PM | #8 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
When you go to replace the starter, remove the nuts that you used to hold it together and get a couple of pieces of wire (like electric fence wire) and wrap three turns of so on the threads. Leave a few inches of wire hanging down from the threads. After getting the threads started into the housing use pliers and pull the wire off the threads. Also if you have the front of the car jacked up off the ground turn the steering arms so they are under the starter to help hold the heavy thing if you get tired.......Good Luck
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12-21-2015, 12:57 AM | #9 | |
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Re: 8BA Starter
Quote:
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12-21-2015, 07:03 AM | #10 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
Ralph,
Have you tried putting the truck in gear and rocking it back and forth to free the engine? After some good doses of Marvel mystery oil in the cylinders and down the intake? |
12-21-2015, 09:13 AM | #11 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
X2...I think I'd hold off on the pry bar on the ring gear.
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12-21-2015, 10:17 AM | #12 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
Had a rear wheel jacked up and rocked it back and forth with a wheel wrench in gear. Probably loosened up everything except the engine. I've poured the usual stuff down the carb and in spark plug holes to soak but so far no results. Diesel fuel, penetrating oil, varsol, so far no results. Got the fan and gen off and a big wrench on the crank pulley but no results there either. I though I'd get more leverage in both directions if I can get a pry bar on the ring gear.
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12-21-2015, 10:21 AM | #13 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
If the engine is that tight you are going to damage something prying on it!! Need to find the issue, not apply more force. There could be something in a cylinder (mice nest, etc), lots of possibilities.
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12-21-2015, 01:13 PM | #14 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
Stuck valves and corroded cylinders can both lock an engine up. I wouldn't take any chances on pull starting until I knew all the valves were free. I've seen cams busted and holes poked into cam followers due to this. Pulling the heads & intake costs you some clean up work and a few gaskets but it will damn sure let you know whats going on in there. As was mentioned before, mice love these old engines and they can get in through the exhaust or the intake if a valve is open far enough. On 8BA engines, they come right up the crankcase vent pipe and make a home in the follower valley.
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12-21-2015, 07:18 PM | #15 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
What are the chances on re-using the head and manifold gaskets if I do get it apart and unstuck?
I never touched the truck today. Busy playing with the one that runs.
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12-21-2015, 07:36 PM | #16 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
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12-21-2015, 10:06 PM | #17 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
Ralph,
i just went through on my 8BA what you are going through. i hoped for the best and expected the worst. My engine was stuck petty good. after soakings with MMO and rocking it back and forth and bumping the starter, it finally broke loose. then i had a bunch of valves stuck. was able to free the valves without taking the heads off and actually had it running pretty good but it had very low compression on a couple of cylinders. zero on #3. My engine is now being rebuilt. had a bunch of broken rings and a hole down the side of #3 piston. if you want to take some time, be patient and keep soaking it with oil and rocking it. a pipe wrench will just booger up your crank pulley.. if you get it to spin over, do a compression check to see which cylinders have stuck valves or other issues. you can see one of the valves really good through the spark plug hole. check to make sure all those are closing. if they arent, use a hard wood dowel and tap on them gently to see if they will close. just have to make sure the valve is supposed to be closed when tapping on it (ie: compression stroke) if you get them all to close and still have no compression, put a tablespoon or so of motor oil in the cylinder and recheck compression. also known as the "wet test" if the compression comes up a little, you probably have stuck/broken rings or a hole down the side of a piston. if it doesnt come up all, then you still have a valve problem or a big hole in a piston. you can just see the edge of the other valve through the plug hole with a flashlight to see if it is closing. i had a few of these stuck open and was able to stick the short end of an allen wrench it the plug hole, turn it so its on top of the stuck valve and tap on the long end to get the valve to close. Rodents can get in that vent pipe on the front of the intake pretty easy and fill it full of anything you can imagine. It would be good to at least pull the intake manifold to check. pulling the heads can be alot of work if you have some stubborn bolts. an air impact wrench with the pressure turned down so it just rattles works pretty good. work the bolt in and out once it starts to turn and it should come. if you have some that just wont start, one trick is to drain the coolant, plug the holes on the water pumps and fill the entire engine water jacket with some kind of penetrating oil, diesel fuel, etc. the reason for this is all but 3 head bolts on each side goes through the block and in to the water jacket thus soaking the threads of the headbolt from the inside to help free it. hope some of this helps on where you go from here. good luck, Chris |
12-21-2015, 10:23 PM | #18 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
Hi Chris. I dealt with stuck valves last year on the other two flatheads and got lucky unsticking them and getting back to compression on all 8. Using methods similar to what you describe. This old truck has been sitting longer I think,about 40 years since it ran. The engine was tired even back then so likely low compression. I might just pull the heads and manifold . Not much to lose as it certainly won't run as is. If it looks worth saving when I get it apart I guess new gaskets are available.
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12-21-2015, 10:31 PM | #19 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
How about wiring the starter to run backwards?
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12-22-2015, 03:17 PM | #20 |
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Re: 8BA Starter
Would it even engage???
Ralph, if its been sitting that long, probably a good idea to pull the intake and heads.. Absolutely the gaskets are still available. Pull the intake first and see if you want to go further. Might be 40 years worth of mouse nests in there jamming things up. When I mentioned rocking the truck in gear, I had the tires on the floor and rocked it using the weight of the truck to free it. Chris |
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