The Ford Barn

PeteVS · 10-27-2022, 09:36 AM

A few years ago, I bought replacement drums and studs for converting my Model A project to hydraulics. All went well until I started buttoning everything up and one of the studs spun in its hole in the hub. I'm planning on putting one or two tack welds on the back side to prevent this happening again. Should I do all five on that side? All ten? (I bought the drums and studs from Richard Lacy and followed his instructions.)

19Fordy · 10-27-2022, 12:58 PM

A Google search reveals that welding on wheel studs is not safe even though the wheel stud looks the same. Wheel studs are made of very high carbon steel and will soften and weaken or snap off under load and torque due to metallurgical changes in the steel if you weld them.
https://mazdaracers.com/topic/1475-b...tuds-to-a-hub/

Also, read this:
https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...ng+wheel+studs

I wonder if it's possible to buy over size wheel studs?

CHECK THE POSSIBILITY OF USING A SCREW IN REPLACEMENT WHEEL STUD.
https://www.google.com/search?q=scre...hrome&ie=UTF-8

PeteVS · 10-27-2022, 04:37 PM

OK. Thanks!

Newc · 10-27-2022, 09:48 PM

Some modern epoxy products may fix this. Newc

Mart · 10-28-2022, 03:38 AM

You could grind a flat on the head of the stud and put a blob of weld on the hub so the blob sits in where the flat is and stops it turning.

Really, though, you need to ask why the stud is turning. Holes oversize? Studs too small? Wrong studs?

It's worth fixing it right.

Mart.

rich b · 10-28-2022, 10:48 AM

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I take it you have the version with the hubs inside the drum.

If you were furnished the studs made to replace the original swedged studs without having to ream the holes; you could take the hole up to .600 and press in a 610-234 stud.

On the other hand; I've come across many welded studs on old Ford stuff I've disassembled.

Tim Ayers · 10-28-2022, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rich b

I take it you have the version with the hubs inside the drum.

If you were furnished the studs made to replace the original swedged studs without having to ream the holes; you could take the hole up to .600 and press in a 610-234 stud.

On the other hand; I've come across many welded studs on old Ford stuff I've disassembled.

Same. I don't think a tack weld on the edge of a stud would cause much of an issue, but I'm also not a metallurgist.

PeteVS · 10-28-2022, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Ayers

Same. I don't think a tack weld on the edge of a stud would cause much of an issue, but I'm also not a metallurgist.

There are still 4 that haven't been welded on. My main concern was about not being able to remove a wheel.

GB SISSON · 10-28-2022, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeteVS

There are still 4 that haven't been welded on. My main concern was about not being able to remove a wheel.

Now that would be me.....Just a hypothetical situation, But.... All 5 snugged down nice even though one seemed to spin some while torqueing. No big deal it did tighten. Now I'm beside the road with a flat and guess what? That would be an awful dillema. I liked Mart's idea with a flat spot and a blob.

Tim Ayers · 10-29-2022, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeteVS

There are still 4 that haven't been welded on. My main concern was about not being able to remove a wheel.

Ah, got it. What hub are you using? If you want to be really sure, I would get some Ford, not repo, '40 hubs. They have a flat cast into the backside of the hub flange where the stud head sits. Grind a flat in the in the replacement stud and when snugged up, the flat in the stud rests against the flat in the hub for another layer of not allowing the stud to spin.

Tim Ayers · 10-29-2022, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mart

You could grind a flat on the head of the stud and put a blob of weld on the hub so the blob sits in where the flat is and stops it turning.

Really, though, you need to ask why the stud is turning. Holes oversize? Studs too small? Wrong studs?

It's worth fixing it right.

Mart.

Good idea, Mart! Agree with fixing it right.

rich b · 10-29-2022, 12:35 PM

Ford hubs are made with a stop to keep the swedged stud from turning and the same stop will keep a replacement stud from rotating if a flat is ground into the head.

The fact that your new stud rotated makes me curious as to what parts you are working with.

Picture shows the notched studs and stops on the Ford hub (disregard the non-Ford drum in the picture).

PeteVS · 10-29-2022, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Ayers

Ah, got it. What hub are you using? If you want to be really sure, I would get some Ford, not repo, '40 hubs. They have a flat cast into the backside of the hub flange where the stud head sits. Grind a flat in the in the replacement stud and when snugged up, the flat in the stud rests against the flat in the hub for another layer of not allowing the stud to spin.

I'm pretty sure that the hubs are '40s. Actually, the stud didn't spin, it just sort of fell out when I went to slide the drum on over it. The studs all have flats but it appeared that there were round cuts in the hub where the studs sit. Anyway, it's all kind of moot now. I have everything put together and I don't have a hub puller to open it up again. This is all on an A rear. I have a '40 rear that I hope to have ready next year. (Actually, that's the rear that my hubs came with. Ah, yes I remember it well.)

10-27-2022, 09:36 AM	#1
PeteVS Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: FP, NJ Posts: 2,770	Rear wheel studs A few years ago, I bought replacement drums and studs for converting my Model A project to hydraulics. All went well until I started buttoning everything up and one of the studs spun in its hole in the hub. I'm planning on putting one or two tack welds on the back side to prevent this happening again. Should I do all five on that side? All ten? (I bought the drums and studs from Richard Lacy and followed his instructions.) __________________ Don't never get rid of nuthin!

10-27-2022, 12:58 PM	#2
19Fordy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Coral Springs FL Posts: 10,950	Re: Rear wheel studs A Google search reveals that welding on wheel studs is not safe even though the wheel stud looks the same. Wheel studs are made of very high carbon steel and will soften and weaken or snap off under load and torque due to metallurgical changes in the steel if you weld them. https://mazdaracers.com/topic/1475-b...tuds-to-a-hub/ Also, read this: https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...ng+wheel+studs I wonder if it's possible to buy over size wheel studs? CHECK THE POSSIBILITY OF USING A SCREW IN REPLACEMENT WHEEL STUD. https://www.google.com/search?q=scre...hrome&ie=UTF-8 Last edited by 19Fordy; 10-27-2022 at 01:36 PM.

10-27-2022, 04:37 PM	#3
PeteVS Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: FP, NJ Posts: 2,770	Re: Rear wheel studs OK. Thanks! __________________ Don't never get rid of nuthin!

10-27-2022, 09:48 PM	#4
Newc Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 2,488	Re: Rear wheel studs Some modern epoxy products may fix this. Newc

10-28-2022, 03:38 AM	#5
Mart Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Solihull, England. Posts: 8,755	Re: Rear wheel studs You could grind a flat on the head of the stud and put a blob of weld on the hub so the blob sits in where the flat is and stops it turning. Really, though, you need to ask why the stud is turning. Holes oversize? Studs too small? Wrong studs? It's worth fixing it right. Mart.

10-28-2022, 10:48 AM	#6
rich b Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Minnesota Posts: 1,827	Re: Rear wheel studs Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) I take it you have the version with the hubs inside the drum. If you were furnished the studs made to replace the original swedged studs without having to ream the holes; you could take the hole up to .600 and press in a 610-234 stud. On the other hand; I've come across many welded studs on old Ford stuff I've disassembled.