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Old 02-17-2020, 10:19 AM   #1
jec13
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Default Rear Brake Drum: Loose or Tight to Hub?

Hello, this is regarding rear brakes on 31 Model A Roadster. Performing brake inspection and maintenance. After removing the rear wheels, the left side rear brake drum is immediately loose and lifts off easily, leaving the hub and wheel studs on the axle. However, the right side rear brake drum remains tight to the hub. I know I will need a good hub puller tool to remove it as a hub/drum unit. My questions are these: Should the rear brake drum come loose from the hub, as it does on the left side of my car? Or should it stay tight to the hub, as it does on the right side of my car? Thank you for your help.
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Old 02-17-2020, 10:29 AM   #2
TerryO
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Default Re: Rear Brake Drum: Loose or Tight to Hub?

It sounds like someone either didn't swedge the studs or didn't do it correctly.


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Old 02-17-2020, 11:11 AM   #3
Roger V
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Default Re: Rear Brake Drum: Loose or Tight to Hub?

Answering your question, the hub should be tight to the drum unlike some more modern cars. Likely due to TerryO's reason.
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Old 02-17-2020, 11:14 AM   #4
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Default Re: Rear Brake Drum: Loose or Tight to Hub?

The drum should be swedged to the hub and not come off the car without the hub. Unlike later cars/trucks, there is no locating screw to keep the drum clocked to the hub so if it comes off the hub, unless a witness mark is made, it may not be centered to the hub unless installed in the same place. My guess is the studs may have been welded to the hub to keep them in place.
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Old 02-17-2020, 01:29 PM   #5
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Default Re: Rear Brake Drum: Loose or Tight to Hub?

When I sent my rear hubs to Randy Gross, he called and said they couldn't be re-used because a previous owner/mechanic had welded the studs instead of swaging them. Apparently this is a thing.
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Old 02-17-2020, 03:02 PM   #6
jec13
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Default Re: Rear Brake Drum: Loose or Tight to Hub?

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My thanks to each of you who replied for your good knowledge and advice. I'd prefer to have a properly swedged drum/hub setup. What do you suggest? Is it possible to have the loose drum swedged to its hub? Or should I obtain a new hub/drum assembly? What vendor is best for these tasks and parts? I am grateful for your help.
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Old 02-17-2020, 03:13 PM   #7
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Default Re: Rear Brake Drum: Loose or Tight to Hub?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerryO View Post
It sounds like someone either didn't swedge the studs or didn't do it correctly.


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Please pardon my ignorance. What is swedging?


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Old 02-17-2020, 03:37 PM   #8
jec13
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Default Re: Rear Brake Drum: Loose or Tight to Hub?

Has to do with the pressing of parts together in order to fuse them. The rear brake drum, studs and hub are swedged together and become an assembly in this way.
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Old 02-17-2020, 04:03 PM   #9
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Default Re: Rear Brake Drum: Loose or Tight to Hub?

So, swedging is just a really tight friction fit?


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Old 02-17-2020, 04:12 PM   #10
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Default Re: Rear Brake Drum: Loose or Tight to Hub?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swaging

This specific operation:
http://www.fordgarage.com/pages/swaging.htm

(swedging = swaging)
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Old 02-17-2020, 04:26 PM   #11
Jim M
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Default Re: Rear Brake Drum: Loose or Tight to Hub?

Randy Gross is ABSOLUTELY the best person to talk to and do the job! He helped me immensly and turned my old drums.
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Old 02-17-2020, 04:36 PM   #12
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Default Re: Rear Brake Drum: Loose or Tight to Hub?

Quote:
Originally Posted by shew01 View Post
Please pardon my ignorance. What is swedging?


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It is actually pronounced swaging. Think of the stud as a large rivet. The swaging process rivets the drum and the hub together. A swaging tool is needed. Most of the suppliers carry it. It is used with a 20 ton press. There is a skill required that few people today possess. Most commercial machine shops will mess the process up unless they speak Model A. They will warp the hub flange getting the old drum off or crack the drum around the mounting holes swaging the new drum on. Sometimes they will do both.

There are some Model A hobbyist around that know how to do the process. The best choice is to let Randy Gross do the job for you. He sells the drums, installs them on your hubs after he removes the old drums. And if your hubs are trash he has original replacements. His prices are very reasonable, and he has a very good reputation.

Randy is also a great guy to do business with. He is located in Southern California. 714-292-8660.


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Old 02-17-2020, 05:00 PM   #13
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Default Re: Rear Brake Drum: Loose or Tight to Hub?

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Originally Posted by alexiskai View Post


Thanks!


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Old 02-17-2020, 05:02 PM   #14
shew01
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Default Re: Rear Brake Drum: Loose or Tight to Hub?

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Originally Posted by Tom Endy View Post
It is actually pronounced swaging. Think of the stud as a large rivet. The swaging process rivets the drum and the hub together. A swaging tool is needed. Most of the suppliers carry it. It is used with a 20 ton press. There is a skill required that few people today possess. Most commercial machine shops will mess the process up unless they speak Model A. They will warp the hub flange getting the old drum off or crack the drum around the mounting holes swaging the new drum on. Sometimes they will do both.



There are some Model A hobbyist around that know how to do the process. The best choice is to let Randy Gross do the job for you. He sells the drums, installs them on your hubs after he removes the old drums. And if your hubs are trash he has original replacements. His prices are very reasonable, and he has a very good reputation.



Randy is also a great guy to do business with. He is located in Southern California. 714-292-8660.





Tom Endy


This makes better sense now. Thanks.


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