Battery keeps dying

[Chris Van]

Hi Boffins

Please can you help: I have a 6 volt gel battery in my A, which is about a year old. My ammeter reads that there is a fantastic charge all the time (unless I am driving with my headlights on of course, and about zero amps when am driving at night in the rain with the wiper motor on with the headlights).

The battery seems to be good - there are about 20 starts available until it dies. Because I use the car every day I have to charge the battery overnight with a lovely little 6V charger that I have.

A friend of mine checked the genny and it is charging (must be, because the ammeter says so too, right?). So how come the battery keeps dying? Where is the current from the genny going to?

I am at my wits end and have to use the crank handle to start the car sometimes, which is painful.

Any suggestions would be most helpful.

Thanks a bunch

Chris Van
Johannesburg
South Africa
(Vice Chairman Model A Club of South Africa)

[captonzap]

Take the cable (+/-) off of the ungrounded battery terminal, and put an ammeter between the cable and the terminal. Does it read anything?
If so, disconnect what ever is at the other end of the cable, hook up the ammeter between that end of the cable and whatever it is hooked to. (Terminal board?) still reading something?
The idea is to go down the distribution path, checking draw at each point, until you find a place that the draw stops.
Back up one step, and check what ever is there.
Common culprits are frayed wires, dash light left on, relay stuck shut.
There are wiring diagrams on this site to guide you.
CZ

[Patrick L.]

Like CZ mentioned, it appears there might be a draw somewhere. After shutdown what does the ammeter show ? Does it show a discharge ? A common culprit is the stop light switch sticking on. Disconnecting a battery terminal and putting a test light between the post and cable end will show if there is a draw if the light lights. If the light lights you do have a draw, keep disconnecting things until it goes out, that'll be the problem.
How much charge are you showing, I don't like to any more than 12 amps from a little ole 'A' generator. 8-10 should be more than enough if driving at night quite a bit and 2-4 if not driving at night very much.

[1931 flamingo]

For what a 6V battery costs I'd just replace it, or take it somewhere and have them ck it, could be a bad cell. JMO
Paul in CT

[Willie Krash]

I too would have the battery evaluated. I would use a light bulb instead of an amp meter. The amp meter can be confusing and depending on the draw the meter may not have the resolution needed to indicate much. If you can light the bulb you have a draw, it you have a draw that does not light the filament it isn't a problem.
Also I have seen batteries with dirty tops in 6V systems self discharge.
If you are using a volt meter that measures current if the draw is too high it will blow a fuse and it it's a Fluke Meter you will find that t be an expensive fuse

[Purdy Swoft]

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Six volt batteries seem to have went up quite a bit in the last few years. It doesn't seem that long ago when I bought new six volt batteries exchange at Auto Zone for less than thirty dollars each. I bought a new six volt battery for my sept 29 a few months ago and it cost $117.95 and its only has a two year warrantee.

If you don't have testing equipment, you can disconnect the ground cable and watch closely for a spark when you touch the ground cable end to the battery terminal. If you see a spark that will indicate that you have a draw somewhere. If there is no spark, the battery will be the culpret. It is a very simple task to convert to a more reliable 12 volt system with the original unmodified generator. We went through three or four new batteries in a very short time in my daughters coupe before we finally got one that would hold a charge. The parts store was good about replaceing the batteries under warrantee with no charge to me. The thing is, its not a fun job removing the floor mats and floor boards to replace a bad battery.

[Charlie Stephens]

Try disconnecting the battery overnight and sees if it runs down. If it runs down you have a battery problem, if not keep looking for your short.

Charlie Stephens

[ctlikon0712]

If you have the original 6V generator with a cutout, the cutout points might be stuck. After you turn off the engine this would cause the generator to try and "motor", the fan belt typically will keep it from turning and overnight will run a battery down. Just something else to consider.

[Mitch//pa]

as willie krash said use a 2.00 testlight to ck it... and as mentioned the cut out could be stuck.....

[SteveB31]

Unhook a cable for a few days. If it still only starts a few times,you need a new battery.

[dumb person]

i had this after the brake light switch got stuck on.

[green30coupe]

Shouldn't a year old gel battery be guaranteed?

[Patrick L.]

It must take these responses a long time to get all the way to South Africa !

[Chris Van]

Hi Guys

@Patrick ... ha ha apologies for taking so long to reply. I checked all the points you guys raised (many, many thanks) and then realized that the battery was just not holding its charge... I had once left the lights on overnite and I think that must have done terminal damage... no pun intended. So I used a CTEK conditioning charger for a whole week (with a friend's good 6V battery in series to make up the 12V) but to no avail.

Not being able to afford the $200 for a new 6V battery I am happily learning how to use the crank handle.... there is enough life in the battery to power the points etc. Still struggling with a warm start... the cold start and hot start are easy... but I guess over time I will learn what the secret is, with my popeye forearm.

Will keep you posted.

With warm regards

Chris

[Patrick L.]

Hmmm, interesting. How much are 12v batteries ?

[H. L. Chauvin]

Hi Chris,

Many times, some 6V alternators for Model A's will drain batteries; however, with a generator this seldom occurs.

FWIW, just a few past experiences with batteries:

1. Years ago, bought a "new" 6 V battery for my Model A from a very reputable service station. Installed it. It did not turn starter. Brought it back. Owner tested it -- one cell completely dead. Got another new battery that worked.

2. Much later, bought a new 12 V from a reputable parts chain store for my modern car. It lasted (2) weeks. Brought it back whereby owner gave a new one.

3. Repeated paragraph 2. (5) times in a year. Met others in same chain store having same problem. Owner kept giving me new batteries. He said it must have been a bad batch.

4. Got tired of wasting time in going back, finally gave up, & bought a new battery at Wal-Mart which lasted.

5. Simple moral of the story also hinted on in above replies:

If one buys a "new" battery & has problems, please remember that "all new" batteries are "not" always perfect; & that many do "not" last for the entire warranty period.

Hope this helps.

[Brentwood Bob]

hope you are only using distilled water, and are regularly checking the battery cells. low electrolyte and a high charge rate can equal a damaged battery. I am guessing all the starts indicate alot of short trips, and it is probably hot and dry in your home area.
Make sure your timing is spot on to give you fast starts. Some think that extended revolutions is not a problem, but the 6volt system draws alot of amps.
Also do you have the properly sized barttery cables, and an auxillary ground cable, and good, clean, contacts? A poor contact can foul things up.
Bob

[Mike V. Florida]

what does the meter actually read? If its much above 4 amps when driving you are cooking the battery. Try one of the three aftermarket regulators for your genny.

[Lee Mitch]

Chris, have you installed or consider installing the fuse that is mounted on the starter. Its a quick and inexpensive way to kill any drain on your battery until you can track down your drain.