PPG Omni Urethane or the Concept DCC

[Model A Ron]

I have decided to paint the 31 Victoria in PPG Concept Urethane but I would like to hear from anyone who used PPG Omni.

I know the Omni is decent but I hear the Concept holds up better over time.

[Oldbluoval]

I’ve only used DCC so probably shouldn’t even be posting …can’t compare
DCC is a really good paint and I find it user friendly.
I do think it is over priced compared to some other brands.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

I have used both quite a bit. The main differences you will find is the UV holdout, and the shell hardness between the two with the DCC having the upper hand. Based on the likelihood of your Vic's usage, either will be fine.

[chrs1961815]

Omni is garbage and none of the products in that line have any place on an antique car. That line is meant for collision shops on cars that will be around for another 10 years.

[Model A Ron]

Originally Posted by chrs1961815

Omni is garbage and none of the products in that line have any place on an antique car. That line is meant for collision shops on cars that will be around for another 10 years.

I tend to think for a Fine Point Restoration like I am doing on the Victoria Omni would be penny wise dollar foolish. Why spend all that time to do the car right and put on collision shop paint.

From what I understand Omni is more of a 5 year paint with 10 pushing it.

[Oldbluoval]

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“From what I understand Omni is more of a 5 year paint with 10 pushing it.“

Please name some that aren’t like that.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Model A Ron

I tend to think for a Fine Point Restoration like I am doing on the Victoria Omni would be penny wise dollar foolish. Why spend all that time to do the car right and put on collision shop paint.

From what I understand Omni is more of a 5 year paint with 10 pushing it.

Who said that?

FWIW, I have some Omni that was painted over 10 years ago, -and probably closer to 15 that still is on the panels and still looks good. As I shared with you above, where Omni does not have a great reputation is its ability to last in the sunlight. UV holdout is not as good as DCC, ...and DCC is not as good as clearcoated DBU. In the situation of a restored vehicle that will see limited exposure to the hard UV rays of the sun in everyday conditions, the longevity of the paint is increased immensely.

One of the things in fine-point that needs to be understood is the term 'over-restoration'. The quality of pigments in Omni are not as good as what you will find in DCC, -however that is not necessarily a bad thing. The original Lacquer paints used on Model-As were very impure and muddy looking. We use the term 'pure' to describe clean rich pigments, and those toner pigments back then were not 'pure'. Someone that deals with colors and paints everyday will see subtle differences whereas the average hobbyist may not.

In the instance of F/P adjudication, too 'pure' of a pigment may come across as too glossy and be receive a deduction for 'over-restoration'. This was the case of a car owned by another Fordbarner on his Sedan the first time we showed it in French Lick. The car had DCC paint and it was slick. The paint on adjacent cars were darker and by comparison this Sedan probably did look like it had clearcoat paint on it. I submitted pictures of the painting process to the captain of Area 14 where he could see a green tint of paint coming out of the gun to prove it was not clearcoated, however by then the incorrect deductions were irreversible. Always remember that if you present a situation where the Judge must make a decision, you have created a 50% chance of them getting it wrong.

[Model A Ron]

I know of a guy who has the Henry Award and his car has PPG Concept wet sanded and buffed to a mirror finish.

[chrs1961815]

I know guys who used DCC on their fine point cars and a guy who used Axalta and got a Henry. The thing with the cheaper paints (especially Omni) that I have noticed is the adhesion doesn't seem to be as good as the top of the line products, thus chipping is more common.

[denniskliesen]

I have concept on my pickup somebody else sprayed on. My Tudor I sprayed on Restoration Shop urethane over epoxy primer. Much happier with the Restoration Shop.

[Keith True]

I used Omni on my 30 roadster pickup around 04-05.I picked the color out of the fleet line,the paint guy I deal with told me it was the regular Omni urethane,but no warranty.I got 6 quarts of sprayable 48 Ford commercial red material for $130.I used it on my A,then six years ago I used up the remainder of it on my Dodge dump truck.The A still looks like the day I put it on,but it is fading on the hood of the dump truck.But,the A is inside when it is not being driven,and the dump truck has never been washed or waxed,and is outside 365 days a year.I did hit a little spot with rubbing compound on my finger,and the shine comes right back.I really can't complain,i used 10 year old paint,and 10 year old activator,all in the cans it came in 10 years earlier.

[Model A Ron]

Originally Posted by Keith True

The A still looks like the day I put it on,but it is fading on the hood of the dump truck.But,the A is inside when it is not being driven,and the dump truck has never been washed or waxed,and is outside 365 days a year.I did hit a little spot with rubbing compound on my finger,and the shine comes right back.

Like was said above the UV protection is not as good on the Omni. For me after spending all the time and money on the project I will go with the Concept. If your on a budget and the car lives inside Omni is just fine.

[old ugly]

i still own a car painted in Omni single stage. the paint job is older and is still as nice as the day it was sprayed. the car has a good 2 stage hi-solids primer over which the omni was sprayed. when it was sprayed there were a few imperfections which wet sanded and polished up real nice and invisible.
i have also used omni on 8 1970s enduro motorcycle tanks and parts, i have never had any issues with the product.
like any paint the prep work dictates what the end product will be like.
my opinion. don't fear the omni.

[Dick M]

I have the DCC on my coupe. It was painted 20 years ago. It has held up extremely well and still looks great. I have never waxed or buffed out the paint.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Model A Ron

I know of a guy who has the Henry Award and his car has PPG Concept wet sanded and buffed to a mirror finish.

Ron, yes you can win a Henry using Concept. You can also win a Henry using Deft Semi-Gloss Clear from Home Depot as one friend of mine did on his Pick-up. My point is, -and was, is that it takes a knowledgeable restorer that comprehends what the goal is in F/P adjudication. The goal in Area 14 is to replicate the aesthetics of the paint in exacting detail just as it would have looked 90 years ago when it was driven out the door of the Branch building. Any deviation from this (-no matter how minute or petty it may seem) is subject to receiving a deduction from either 'Over-restoration'. -or 'Quality of Workmanship'. For those who are experienced in judging Area 14 understand the visual differences between a Nitrocellulose Lacquer (-as was originally used) and Single-stage Urethane paint (-as you are proposing to use). They also can spot excessive use of substrates under the vehicle finishcoat. If your goal is to win Best of Show -or be within 10 points, you might want to consider using synthetic Lacquer in lieu of the DCC.



And a FWIW, adhesion issues generally are not from the paint quality, but in the surface prep. If the paint's ability is not there to have a good mechanical bond, there will be adhesion issues. Additionally, 'chipping' is not from the paint quality, but generally has more to do with excessive MIL thickness.

[Gary Karr]

Originally Posted by Model A Ron

I know of a guy who has the Henry Award and his car has PPG Concept wet sanded and buffed to a mirror finish.

Let's see. My Tudor and early 28 Coupe both have DCC Concept on lower sheet metal. Dean's A495 Phaeton is all DCC. Bob Martino's early Phaeton is all DCC. Mark Williamson's 30 Tudor is all DCC. These are all Henry winners that come to mind.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Gary Karr

Let's see. My Tudor and early 28 Coupe both have DCC Concept on lower sheet metal. Dean's A495 Phaeton is all DCC. Bob Martino's early Phaeton is all DCC. Mark Williamson's 30 Tudor is all DCC. These are all Henry winners that come to mind.

Yes exactly my point. Gary, there were two trucks at your meet that I am curious if you know what they used because they as I recall were flattened. I think they were both friends of yours. One, I think was a '30 AA Cab & Chassis that had a 82A cab that was satin finished. Also, there was a AA that was a Duck Hunting body that as I recall had semi-gloss paint. Do you remember what these guys used??

[Model A Ron]

Originally Posted by Gary Karr

Let's see. My Tudor and early 28 Coupe both have DCC Concept on lower sheet metal. Dean's A495 Phaeton is all DCC. Bob Martino's early Phaeton is all DCC. Mark Williamson's 30 Tudor is all DCC. These are all Henry winners that come to mind.

I have a mentor hear in North Carolina who won the Henry Award and his finish looks amazing. Its Concept DCC wet sanded and buffed to perfection. I looked over every square inch of the car and could not find anything wrong with it. To top it all off he sprayed the car in his garage in a make shift spray booth made of plastic. He did spend countless hours on it but it goes to show you that if you want to take on a job like that it can be done. In addition it sure saves a lot of money and for me the satisfaction of doing it yourself if worth all the effort.

[chrs1961815]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

Yes exactly my point. Gary, there were two trucks at your meet that I am curious if you know what they used because they as I recall were flattened. I think they were both friends of yours. One, I think was a '30 AA Cab & Chassis that had a 82A cab that was satin finished. Also, there was a AA that was a Duck Hunting body that as I recall had semi-gloss paint. Do you remember what these guys used??

They probably used the universal matting agent from PPG like most who use PPG paint do. Problem I have noticed with painting vehicles semi gloss like that is you cannoy buff it as it will bring it to high gloss.

[Gary Karr]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

Yes exactly my point. Gary, there were two trucks at your meet that I am curious if you know what they used because they as I recall were flattened. I think they were both friends of yours. One, I think was a '30 AA Cab & Chassis that had a 82A cab that was satin finished. Also, there was a AA that was a Duck Hunting body that as I recall had semi-gloss paint. Do you remember what these guys used??

The early 30 AA Cab and Chassis is Ron Avakian's and he did spray it in Concept with a flattening agent. The other is a 29 AA with a special body used for duck hunting in the LA area. It belongs to Dr. Karl Wehrley and did receive a Henry at the 2011 San Diego MARC Meet. I'm not sure if it is painted in Concept.