1933 V8 Freeze Plugs????

[Doug 845]

While installing my oil pan back on, I took off the old pan gasket and noticed that there seems to be 4 small round plugs located under the gasket on the block (2 on each side). Are these freeze plugs? The center of one metal cap is gone and another one seems to be leaking. How do I fix this? Should I replace all 4 since I have everything apart? Please see pics. I tried to attach the pics - I will try again with a new post.
Thanks

[42merc]

Actually they are core plugs. Used to let core sand out after casting.
Replace all four. Measure & then go to NAPA, not a big deal.

[alanwoodieman]

can be a big deal, as there are no real auto parts stores anymore just computer aided parts list readers. plugs should be 3/4" dorman 500-007. I tried napa and had trouble, found them at oreilly, had to order them and buy a pack of ten. 29 cents each!!

[Zeke3]

Sounds like you found them at the right time, instead of when the coolant is running down the outside of the oil pan. There are also several discussions about this topic with a John Deere part number for the plugs.

http://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showth...ght=john+deere

I may not have copied the link correctly, I am new at this. If not, search the forum for John Deere, you'll find it.

It is amazing how much crud you can dig out of those four holes.

[jimTN]

Just went thru this and used pennys which fit and then dobbed them with Indianhead shellac. Worked great. I went the round of parts stores with no luck and a lot of wasted time.

[redmodelt]

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I needed some 3/4 inch domed non lipped welch plugs for an engine I was working on, had to make the rounds of the better parts stores to find the disk type I needed. Found them at one of the older stores. The other stores had them but they were all the cup type that wouldn't work for what I needed. (got extras for my stock)

[Ken/Alabama]

I use them also to seal the transmission countershaft by cutting about 1/8 inch off the shaft and put a dab of RTV under it

[Terry,OH]

Your local John Deere dealer has them. 3/4"

[mercman from oz]

Here is a photo of a 1934 V8 Engine showing the 4 Welsh Plug Holes. While you have them out, make sure that you clean out the block with a wire coat hanger or similar. I got half a jar full of scale when I cleaned mine out.

[mercman from oz]

Here is the picture enlarged so that you can see these 4 Welsh Plugs. Actually, the original picture should appear with the front pulley at the top. It is mounted in an "old time" Ford? Engine Stand.

[dads34ford]

I just put a new oil pan gasket on 34 coup today I didn't notice these plugs. Should I drop the pan look for these and replace them???

[mercman from oz]

It is definitely worth replacing these Plugs. A few years ago, I had water in the Oil. I didn't know where the leak was? It could have been the Heads, but I didn't want to disturb them. I thought that I would start at the bottom, so removed the Sump Pan while the Engine was still in the car. Sure enough, one of these Plugs was leaking. I removed all 4 and started poking an old screwdriver up the holes, followed by a bent wire coat hanger. All up, I got half a jar of scale etc from these holes. Definitely, replace these Welsh Plugs while you have the Engine down, and make sure you scratch around inside to remove all this scale. You will be surprised at how much scale you get out of the block.

[mercman from oz]

Here are some pictures of the scale etc that came out of my 1934 Ford V8 while the Engine was out for a rebuild. It is definitely worth while attending to this while the Sump Pan is off.

[dads34ford]

You have convinced me I am dropping the pan again.will I need to drill these to get them out?? Do you know if Mac carries these plugs?? Do they just drive in like a regular freeze plug??

[David J]

John Deere part number 30H9 as you can see . Put them in hump down and hit the hump in the center with a ball peen hammer to set them .

[alanwoodieman]

how about hump up and hammer the hump to set them also use some permatex #1 or even #2

[mercman from oz]

To remove these Plugs, I just punctured them with a screwdriver and levered them our. You can see the damaged one with a hole in it on the paper.

[David J]

Originally Posted by alanwoodieman

how about hump up and hammer the hump to set them also use some permatex #1 or even #2

Hump down is installed position .

He is doing this in car .

I just give them a decent pop with a smaller ball-peen hammers round end .

Agree on the permatex .

I just smear the brush on stuff on them and the pan rails .


Drill and dent puller are the best way to remove them with as little lip damage as possible .

IMHO of course .

[cas3]

drive a small screw driver thru it and then cock it sideways to remove

[Doug 845]

I removed 3 of them by just poking a screwdriver in the center and twisting. The last one was leaking but barely there. After I poked at it with the screwdriver - a bunch of dirt followed by a gallon of antifreeze came out. This last one seems to be missing the shoulder to set the plug on. It isn't perfectly round and seems like someone used JB Weld or something previously. What is the best way to fix this right?

[David J]

Originally Posted by Doug 845

This last one seems to be missing the shoulder to set the plug on. It isn't perfectly round and seems like someone used JB Weld or something previously. What is the best way to fix this right?

That's the reason I mentioned the dent puller as it does not mess up the lip . If the lip is gone drill and tap the hole and put an allen head plug in there . You can actually do this with all 4 if you like .

[dads34ford]

After scratching out as much scale as I can get out would it be possible to lightly blow air through the pet cocks to remove any loose stuff? I value any thoughts and opinions....

[dads34ford]

After I rod out as much scale as I can get out could air be lightly blown through the pet cocks to blow out anything loose?? I value your opinion....

[David J]

If you don't mind the mess run water into the radiator fill till it comes out clean from all 4 holes .

[dads34ford]

i dropped my pan my block has no plugs?? the edge of the block is streight from one end to the other it is not swollen out where the plugs are in the above pic that mercman posted above. now i am wondering if i have a 34 block?? am going to do get the books out.

[revkev6]

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info from charlie stephens:

little identification info from charlie stephens:
If there are 21 studs the block was built 1932 to 1938. The transition to 24 studs was late in 1938. Check the water petcocks on the front of the block next to where the lower hose from the radiator enters either an inlet fitting (1936 and earlier) or the water pump (1937 and later). It the petcocks point straight down it is a 1932 block. If the block is not a 1932 next look for a vent from the crankcase area out through the front corner of the oil pan. If there is no vent the block is 1933-34. If there is a vent it is 1935 or later. As a matter of interest, the 1936 engines were the first to use insert bearings. Both insert and babbitt bearings were used throughout 1936. The insert bearing engines can be identified by LB cast at the top of the left front face of the block or by the letters LB stamped into the surface where the intake manifold attaches. Some engines were not stamped and in other cases people tried to inflate the price of their blocks by stamping LB into them when they were sold. Be careful. Now check for the location of the water pumps. If the water pumps mount on the block the engine is 1937 or later. All engines beginning in 1937 were inserts. Frequently you will encounter a 1937 block with factory block off plates held on by two bolts over the water pump passage at the front of the block as it was common for Ford dealers to install this engine as a replacement in the earlier cars.

[David J]

38coupe did a good thread here " engine block ID " that should answer all your questions .