Our Model A wreck in Austin, TX

[Onlybackroads]

Got into a bad accident last night, 10/12/2014, in Austin, TX when a guy took a left in front of me while we had a green light. After inspecting the intersection, there is no way for him to turn left without a green arrow. We had a solid green light for a good while. I came out of it bruised up and sore all throughout my body, and a couple scrapes, my buddy Lane who was in the passenger seat has a broken nose and a few bruises and cuts, but we're alive and doing ok. I am very thankful for our seat belts that saved us from anything worse! As you can see below, the car is pretty darn messed up, I have yet to find out what will happen with the insurance companies. We were on a long distance trip, as some of you may have read in a different post, from California to Louisiana to Arkansas. We're stopped dead in our tracks at the moment here in Texas, so I will need to figure out a way to transport the car to my parents' garage, since I hope to keep it and restore it. Just goes to show that no matter how safe you drive, there's still dangers out there, but I won't let that keep me from driving old cars.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Oh WOW, at least you are able to walk away!! There should be many TX folks available to help you get it secured and ultimately transported home. Feel free to call me if you would like some 'personal experience' advice on dealing with the insurance company.

[1930artdeco]

Thank goodness you two are alright. Sorry for the accident though.

Mike

[bart78]

Sorry to hear that. Glad y'all are ok.

[TerryH]

So sorry for your accident, but all of us will be very grateful that you were not seriously injured. There was a Model A accident here locally (Huntington Beach area) just a few weeks ago. A man was driving his 1929 Roadster Pickup through a green light at a major intersection, and was T-boned by a 16 year old, unlicensed driver, with no insurance. Luckily, the man was not critically injured, but the A looked pretty well wrecked. Hard to outguess someone running a red light!

[Brentwood Bob]

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Some experience is always good. You and your buddy were not alone. Be thankful, then reengage.
My best, I am predicting this will not deter you. Find a way. Maybe you can trade some work for help getting back on the road.
You got this far.
Bob

[C26Pinelake]

Thank God you are safe and only have minor injuries. Now the fun with the insurance company begins. Take advantage of Brent's offer quickly.
Wayne

[Don Cavey]

I am so sorry that this happened to you guys. I am glad that you are pretty much OK. Hopefully you can get things sorted out quickly. Bummer...

[Mitch//pa]

as i mentioned in the other thread glad your both ok..
give Brent a call for advice

[Hoogah]

Devastated for you guys, as I've been following your posts and deriving much enjoyment from YOUR enjoyment of this project and trip. As others have said, your lives and safety are the most important things but I know how you'll feel as you gaze upon the wreck that you invested so much of yourself into.
I've got a good feeling that local members of this forum will do whatever they can to get you and the A back to safety, and for what it's worth, our thoughts are also with you from down under.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

I guess my immediate advice is;
1) Get to the hospital and have Sean & Lane thoroughly checked-out by the hospital.

2) Obtain a copy of the Police Report which should establish fault and the other party's Insurance Co. info.

3) Get in touch with Fred Carlton in Georgetown, --or Ross Lilliker in College Station to start learning of options available from local shops/hobbyists.

4) Contact the other party's Ins. Company to determine how they want to proceed. Knowing #3 allows them to know the options too.

5) Let the Ins. Co Adjuster make the next move on how they want to proceed.

6) Explore the options on how Sean & Lane want to proceed, ...and then ask for help here.


Personally, I feel the car is hurt severely and it appears the damages are greater than the market value. With that said, I suspect it could be band-aided up with some outside help from locals and some perseverance where it could complete the trip, ...albeit crippled. Maybe someone knows of a replacement Coupe for sale in the area that Sean could purchase and be on his way??

[Synchro909]

Sorry to hear about your accident but pleased you are OK. I had someone run into me a few years ago. He stopped, looked, then proceeded at a T intersection as I went by. He looked straight at me before he drove into the intersection, then said he didn't see me (I have no reason to doubt that). He worked for GM and his whole life revolved around modern cars. I suspect that he saw my car but it didn't register with him as a car. He may never have seen such a car before. All the more reason to get our cars out there so the public are aware.
Written from Australia so as you can see, we all share the same issues and we all have idiots amongst us.

[Michael M]

Oh, that looks nasty! I'm glad you were not hurt more badly than you were.

Just this morning I was telling a buddy about your trip and how I felt it was a great adventure. Of course, this not the kind of excitement that you want.

Good luck with resolving these issues, and I wish you well getting into a new, or at least repaired, Model A.

[mshmodela]

Gee, happy you're OK, sorry about your car...

[Sixseven]

That you are writing your post and are generally OK for the experience is a blessing, since the car is still recognizable, it is not totaled. Go forth with 90 hp again!

[Slotblog]

Glad you guys are OK but I hate it that your car is so damaged.

This is especially sobering to me as I have bought a 1930 Standard Tudor in OR and plan to drive it back to the Atlanta area starting the middle of next week. I will have a "chase car" along with me, but that's scant comfort.

Your experience will certainly be top of mind the entire distance.

Again, glad you guys are not more badlt injured.

[Greg Jones]

I feel your pain having had this happen to me, nearly killing me. I am happy you are alive. It is sickening to look at - this kind of damage basically totals the car.

[sconnors]

That sucks!! Sorry to hear of your accident, I've been following your trip. They say everything happens for a reason. Perhaps your trip wasn't meant to be now. But you have to make the trip! Don't be deterred!! God bless you and thank God you're both alright!! Good luck with the insurance company and keep us posted.

[SMims]

Devastating! I know y'all will persevere. If we can help, please don't hesitate to contact us.

[glenn in camino]

Terrible. You and your passenger must have wearing seat belts.

[wildwilly]

Sorry to see the bad luck, Thank God ya'll walked or limped away alive. I was watching the post here from South Carolina, an was interested in your trip. If there is a will, there will be a way. Good luck boys. Sounds like Brent will be a great asset at this moment.

[SteveB31]

We had a 1929 Model A Pickup in a wreck a week ago here in Denver. Not his fault. On a 4 lane freeway, and a person in the left lane decided to exit right across 4 lanes of traffic. Everyone hit the brakes. All stopped OK, but the 18 wheeler behind them did not stop as quick and hit the Model A and several other cars. 9 cars total. All drivers OK. Model A repairable.

[heneste]

Sorry to hear about your accident. Good to hear that everyone walked away.

I hope everything goes good with the insurance company (especially since the other guy was at fault.)

[MAG]

Onlybackroads, if I can help, let me know. I can make room in my shop if you need temporary storage. I am in Austin. 512-762-1010 Paul

[pgerhardt]

Like all the others I am glad you are OK, but unlike the others I see your poor crunched coupe differently. As sad as it looks all that twisted and crushed Ford steel is your coupe absorbing energy that your body did not have to! Thanks Model A!

[pat59]

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So sad to here of the wreck.But glad to here that you guys didn't get hurt too badly. Hope to here you guys getting back on the road at some point.
-Pat

[Brian SATX]

One of our club memebrs runs a restoration shop and is certified for insurance apprasil. Call Ray if you need him to come up-- 210-445-8485

[Hitchhiker]

Oh man.Glad you guys are okay.

I have a lot of experience fighting with insurance company's as well.

A couple initial pieces of advice:

1) As soon as you talk to the others insurance company inform them you will only correspond through writing. This sets up a paper trail and is a first sign to the insurance company that you mean business.

2) would be to get an appraisal of the vehicle from a reputable source. They will be able to look past the accident damage and give you a replacement value with which to go by. ( for the time being keep this in your back pocket, it's best to let them make the first move.)

3) Start finding all the Highest priced adds for Model A's you can find. Their job is to devalue your car as much as possible, Yours is to make it worth as much as possible.

4) DO NOT TAKE THE FIRST OFFER. Realize it's the adjusters job to pay you the least amount possible. They are not your friend. Do not let them fool you. They can and will lie to your face.

I could literally write a step by step book on how to fight an insurance company.

Please if you have any questions feel free to PM me. I would be happy to walk you through the process and help you maximize the payout for your now totaled car.

[hardtimes]

Bummer, indeed !
Been watching you progress and what good times you guys were having.
Now, you are on 'another trip' ...into the insurance twilight zone.
Glad you two had seat belts on and fairly unharmed...especially when looking at the coupe pics...wow. Youth also helps in such instances.

[Onlybackroads]

Thanks everyone for your support, I am definitely a little nervous about talking to the insurance company knowing that they are gonna try and screw me over, but I will do my best to get what we deserve out of this whole mess. I have talked to my insurance company and gave them my story, and they said they will file a claim with the other drivers company, but I'm going to call them tomorrow and get the ball rolling with them.

Hitchhiker: Thanks for the advice about getting it all in writing, should I ask for them to correspond through e-mail?

MAG: Thanks for the offer, I really appreciate it! It's in a good spot right now, and hopefully I can get it up to Tennessee soon, and hopefully it won't be too expensive.

Brian SATX: Thanks for the number, I will definitely call him tomorrow.

Scott Mimms: I feel so bad about the new fan you just gave us!

[pooch]

Here in OZ, we have specialist insurance companies that give the wreck salvage back to the owner after payout of agreed value.

I hope you have same.

Buy another and have the wreck as a good source of spare parts .

[Hitchhiker]

Originally Posted by Onlybackroads

Hitchhiker: Thanks for the advice about getting it all in writing, should I ask for them to correspond through e-mail?

Yep! No problem.

Email is great.

I'm serious, if you have any questions, just ask. I'm happy to advise you on how to proceed.

Just to let you know how I learned all of this, I have a 1979 Ford F250 Supercab that my Grandpa bought new. It was hit while parked and was deemed "totaled" by the insurance company. I was offered $1500 dollars.

We settled on the truck not being totaled and them paying $6800 dollars to repair it....

Pretty big discrepancy if you ask me.

[Hitchhiker]

also I want to ad that it sounds like your insurance it going to go to bat for you.

That is good.

I had to fight the others insurance myself as I only carried liability on that rig.

[racer32]

Saw the pics of your wrecked car on FB tonight...been following your trip on here.

Hitchhiker's advice is spot on. Don't expect to be paid for your car anytime soon. Last time I had to deal with this kind of situation (modern truck) it took several months before we could reach an agreement just on the value of my truck. Thier initial offer was about 1/2 what the vehicle was worth. Also be aware than you and your travel partner's medical costs, pain, loss of time, and travel expenses need to be covered by the guy that left-turned you. Get a lawyer. You'll need one to get a decent settlement.

[H. L. Chauvin]

Best advice I can give is to get something like a loose-leaf binder & begin documenting an "outline" of each event as it occurs with "times & dates".

Longhand written notes accompanying paper work of any sort & also detailing events will stand up in any court.

In a few weeks it may not be difficult to remember "what" happened, but it gets difficult to remember exactly "when" it happened & "who" said "what."

If this case gets involved, the aggressive, threatening opposing enemies will literally crap when you open your binder & begin spitting out "names" with exact "times & dates."

Like everyone else, thanks for sharing, & we are all most sincerely glad to see it was not worse.

[dumb person]

The fenders, hood, bumper and maybe the radiator shell looks like they'll straighten out (trust me, most sheet metal i start with is worse). Just buy a replacement fan. Bell housing looks like you need to replace it & from there straightening out & repairing the rest should be easy.

[Tom Wesenberg]

H.L. is correct about writing down everything in a notebook. After fighting my brother over the estate business for 5 years I learned you need to record everything, and if your attorney asks for your notebook, you better have a copy because I never got my notebook back. Each attorney said the other one had it.

When I first saw the picture, my first thought was that the other guy's insurance company will blame you, because your car hit his. In fact I've seen where they can blame you claiming it's your fault because if you weren't on the road, the accident wouldn't have happened. As dumb as that sounds, I was in court years ago and that's exactly what I heard.

[NCDave]

Originally Posted by H. L. Chauvin

Best advice I can give is to get something like a loose-leaf binder & begin documenting an "outline" of each event as it occurs with "times & dates".

Longhand written notes accompanying paper work of any sort & also detailing events will stand up in any court.

In a few weeks it may not be difficult to remember "what" happened, but it gets difficult to remember exactly "when" it happened & "who" said "what."

If this case gets involved, the aggressive, threatening opposing enemies will literally crap when you open your binder & begin spitting out "names" with exact "times & dates."

Like everyone else, thanks for sharing, & we are all most sincerely glad to see it was not worse.

This right here----excellent advice to follow. Dates, times, and details tend to fade from memory sooner than we think. I'd also go photograph that intersection from several viewpoints. Very sorry to see this incident--I was enjoying following the trip.

[Brother Hesekiel]

The car has frame damage, even if "oh so slightly" which requires to take it down to the bone and start from scratch. This translates into a total. In your case, and I hope you have agreed value insurance, you call your insurance company and tell them that you had an accident. They will want an estimate in writing and if it's a good company, you'll have your money within 2 weeks, minus the residual value of perhaps $500. Even if the other party is at fault, or partially at fault, you deal with your company, and let your company see how much they can retrieve from the other party's insurance company.

[lookin-backtexas]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

I guess my immediate advice is;
1) Get to the hospital and have Sean & Lane thoroughly checked-out by the hospital.

2) Obtain a copy of the Police Report which should establish fault and the other party's Insurance Co. info.

3) Get in touch with Fred Carlton in Georgetown, --or Ross Lilliker in College Station to start learning of options available from local shops/hobbyists.

4) Contact the other party's Ins. Company to determine how they want to proceed. Knowing #3 allows them to know the options too.

5) Let the Ins. Co Adjuster make the next move on how they want to proceed.

6) Explore the options on how Sean & Lane want to proceed, ...and then ask for help here.


Personally, I feel the car is hurt severely and it appears the damages are greater than the market value. With that said, I suspect it could be band-aided up with some outside help from locals and some perseverance where it could complete the trip, ...albeit crippled. Maybe someone knows of a replacement Coupe for sale in the area that Sean could purchase and be on his way??

Brent: I have had six phone conversations with Sean so far this morning and have provided him with the telephone number of a certified antique car appraisal firm in Austin. We'll take care of these "vagabonds" and hopefully get them to their original destination in time to perform. I have offered to store the "remains" in my barn until they can retrieve them. One of our local Lone Star Model A Ford Club members is also a bluegrass mandolin player and performs at venues like they were trying to get to in Louisiana so they have kindred spirits locally who can come to their rescue.

I told Sean his story reminds me of why we all love Model A'ing and how others become part of your "extended family". When I was editor of The Restorer I published an article about a guy from southern California who was driving his Model A from California to Virginia to attend his 50th high school reunion. He had owned an A when in high school and it was important to him that he show up driving a Model A at the reunion. He made it as far as Arkansas and had engine problems. He looked in the MAFCA roster (always carry one in your car!) and called a guy he had never met and told him where he was - in 30 minutes or so the guy showed up with a flatbed trailer, loaded the car and took it to his house. They evaluated the situation, he told the story of where he was going and why it was important to be there in a Model A and the guy said, "I've got a spare engine over here, let's swap engines." He ended up spending the night at the Samaritan's home, they installed the new engine and he was on his way. He made it to the 50th reunion and when he was enroute home, he stopped at the guy's house in Arkansas and by that time the Samaritan had repaired his original engine - they swapped engines and he made it safely back to California.

Fred Carlton
Georgetown, Texas (just outside Austin)

[700rpm]

Sean, let us know who your insurance company is, if you don't mind, and how they treat you. My cars are covered for agreed value through Hagerty, and when my coupe was hit last month, they determined it was my fault. I didn't agree, but it didn't matter; they paid my full repair costs in less than two weeks, and dealt entirely with the other fellow. Once I had reported the accident to them, I was done. Hagerty is a good insurance company.

[Onlybackroads]

Hey Ray, I have AAA, and it's fairly basic, pretty much basic liability plus some medical coverage for me and a passenger. They are willing to pay out $2000 to each of us for medical expenses, and I'm going to find out about a proposed sum for travel interruption/delay today. I just sent a statement, written in e-mail form, to the other insurance companies adjuster. They have Zurich American Insurance. I found an appraisal company here in Austin, who will do a full inspection right here where the car is, evaluation, and even deal with the insurance company for $450. If the other insurance company doesn't have a certified classic car inspector, I will try and get them to pay for this. But before I think about getting any money, I need to make sure everything is ok with the police report. We found out that the other party is disputing fault, so I've got some fighting to do. Glad to hear you were compensated, hope you're doing well!

[Mitch//pa]

Originally Posted by Onlybackroads

On another note, I don't have collision coverage through my insurance policy...

OUCH:::
i am sure you know this already
if the police report is not 100% in your favor your screwed..thats what they will use to determine liability..if it is determined a percentage fault driver A and a certain percentage driver B they will tuck and roll //weasel out
i hope it is in your favor:::

[Lona]

Sorry about your accident but glad you both are ok. Looks like your seat belts saved you from more serious injury. Hope all A'ers without belts in their cars understand that as careful as they are, it's often the other guy you can't do anything about. Shoulder belts in addition to laps might have prevented any injury at all. There are posts on the forum regarding installing shoulder belts if you're interested as your car is being repaired.

We all tend to think "it won't happen to me" but, indeed, it can happen to everyone of us. Our thoughts are with you as you recuperate, fight the insurance people, and work to get your car back on the road. Good luck.

Glen

[Lona]

Sorry about your accident but glad you both are ok. Looks like your seat belts saved you from more serious injury. Hope all A'ers without belts in their cars understand that as careful as they are, it's often the other guy you can't do anything about. Shoulder belts in addition to laps might have prevented any injury at all. There are posts on the forum regarding installing shoulder belts if you're interested as your car is being repaired.

We all tend to think "it won't happen to me" but, indeed, it can happen to everyone of us. Our thoughts are with you as you recuperate, fight the insurance people, and work to get your car back on the road. Good luck.

Glen

[Tom Wesenberg]

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Originally Posted by Onlybackroads

On another note, I don't have collision coverage through my insurance policy...

I don't have collision on my modern car, but I thought collision was part of the package for any antique car insurance.

[Onlybackroads]

Tom, it is normal car insurance, this Model A is, well was for now, my daily driver and only car

I was not able to get antique auto insurance for it since you need a daily driver to begin with, already ruled that out, and the mileage is limited to parades, event and going to make repair, definitely ruled that out! Although, my journey was definitely an event!

[darrylkmc]

Originally Posted by Onlybackroads

Hey Ray, I have AAA, and it's fairly basic, pretty much basic liability plus some medical coverage for me and a passenger. They are willing to pay out $2000 to each of us for medical expenses, and I'm going to find out about a proposed sum for travel interruption/delay today. I just sent a statement, written in e-mail form, to the other insurance companies adjuster. They have Zurich American Insurance. I found an appraisal company here in Austin, who will do a full inspection right here where the car is, evaluation, and even deal with the insurance company for $450. If the other insurance company doesn't have a certified classic car inspector, I will try and get them to pay for this. But before I think about getting any money, I need to make sure everything is ok with the police report. We found out that the other party is disputing fault, so I've got some fighting to do. Glad to hear you were compensated, hope you're doing well!

Can you disclose if the other driver was cited for a violation, or if anyone received a citation. This will make a difference regardless of the fact that the other Party is disputing fault, post accident.

Darryl in Fairbanks

[Rex_A_Lott]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

I don't have collision on my modern car, but I thought collision was part of the package for any antique car insurance.

I believe that all the insurance regulations are set by the state you live in. When I was in the Navy we heard all kinds of differences, depending on whether you had your home state's tags/insurance or whether you had it in the state where your duty station was located.
I dont have collision on my old cars either.
I hate to hear about the wreck, and to be honest, am thankfully surprised no one was hurt very badly. That looks like a pretty good lick in the all-steel Henry.Good Luck finding a replacement and finishing your trip!

[Tiny]

If they start to jerk you around about it just being an old car here is you $1000 use the phrase "I do not feel as though you are acting in good faith, I am hanging up the phone to call the insurance review board and my lawyer". I guarantee they will call right back with their tail tucked. It sucks to have to play hardball but sometimes you have too. Good luck. I'm sad to see your trip cut short, I've been rooting for you as I watched the progress on your blog. Glad you guys are ok though. That Model A will buff right back out

[Onlybackroads]

Got the police report, doesn't say who's at fault, just says both of us claimed we had a green light. Now, I'm certain we had a green light, and his left-turn only lane was dictated by arrow. So do I have a good chance still? The report also says there were no witnesses, even though a sheriff told me they got a witnesses number. I was planning to call the deputy tomorrow and talk to him about it and try to give him the number, although I don't know if it'll do anything.

[hardtimes]

Some GOOD advice being offered to you here ! I see that you say that you have AAA insurance. I have same and know others that have same with old cars. AAA has a good reputation here as standup outfit in these old car matters. As an example, a friends entire huge shop with inventory and couple As were burned up. AAA gave one coupe owner 35K for HIS COUPE ! Yeah, I found it hard to believe. They paid entire bill for newly built shop and inventory !! So, keep at it and positive thoughts.
One here says...'doesn't matter' ..relative to who's fault it is. Bull...if your found at fault...YOUR insurance rate will increase, it goes on your record, etc...and that matters !! Do not let anyone get away with ascribing any blame to you...at all, if it was not your fault that you were in this accident.
It's hard to remember things, because of trauma and inexperience and youth. So, take seriously to heart the advice to document, i.e.- written statements (did the guy say anything at all at the scene of accident?), notes, photos, diagrams of incident, pictures of location from various angles, notations/timing of lights in intersection and written statement of passengers, hospital records, etc...on and on ! Police officer responding name/badge #, statements , reports copy and his/her drawings/photos !
Was the other driver drunk and or under the influence otherwise and was he tested and/or ASKED by the officer ...if he had been drinking/use drugs...even prescription.

Here's the deal..if you are not a lawyer and you have ALL of above, your eventual lawyer will love you as a client. You will be best served in preserving your rights also with detailed documentation. Tooo much work to do this, then problems will follow.

[pooch]

Was the other dude on his own ?

At least you have a back up witness for you on the green light dispute.

I suppose it was not a red light camera intersection , or you would have that available.

Check if there are any CCTV cameras pointing to intersection maybe ?

This green light dispute and you having no collision insurance sucks.

[Onlybackroads]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DzKwGQJnt8M

[Onlybackroads]

Anyone know any good lawyers around Austin that could help us out in case we need one? Please let me know if so, would be greatly appreciated.

[P.S.]

Be careful what you post here and on your blog. A lawyer for the opposition will find this and will try to twist it and/or use it against you.

[darrylkmc]

Originally Posted by Onlybackroads

Got the police report, doesn't say who's at fault, just says both of us claimed we had a green light. Now, I'm certain we had a green light, and his left-turn only lane was dictated by arrow. So do I have a good chance still? The report also says there were no witnesses, even though a sheriff told me they got a witnesses number. I was planning to call the deputy tomorrow and talk to him about it and try to give him the number, although I don't know if it'll do anything.

Sean,

I am saddened to hear of this turn of events, the fact that both of you are here to tell of the events is the most important part. I feel for you, I had a similar thing happen about thirty years ago, someone pulled out in front of me and in the hast to avoid a collision I ended up Rolling my '31 Pick-Up onto its Top. The other driver made a quick get away, leaving me in the middle of the road.

As H. L. said, documentation is everything, and make everything of it that you can to help out your situation. Ask for the Sheriff to continue the investigation, if possible, interview the witness(') and encourage the department to issue a citation. Find out what you can about the drivers being switched, get a statement from the Tow Truck driver regarding his contact with the other individual. Although the Tow guy's impression may be considered hearsay, it may help sway things in your favor.

Best of luck.

Darryl in Fairbanks

[ericr]

it's heartwarming to see how much empathy, moral support and tangible help has been extended by our Model "A" family to a fellow member at a time of real need.

It is less pleasant and downright scary to read how many owners have had similar experiences, It makes me leery of driving a Model "A" Ford in these times except under narrow, optimal circumstances, no matter how many lights, turn signals etc. have been installed. Driving courtesy has faded and while I used to think the mere appearance of a Model "A" attracted attention, curiosity and caution from other drivers, that does not seem to be the case.

[darrylkmc]

Originally Posted by ericr

It is less pleasant and downright scary to read how many owners have had similar experiences, It makes me leery of driving a Model "A" Ford in these times except under narrow, optimal circumstances, no matter how many lights, turn signals etc. have been installed. Driving courtesy has faded and while I used to think the mere appearance of a Model "A" attracted attention, curiosity and caution from other drivers, that does not seem to be the case.

ericr,

It is a personal choice, I have had some things scare me, before and since my circumstance, but I am not scared to drive my Model A's. I, at least until it snowed, drive a stock '30 Standard Phaeton.
I drive a lot more defensively.

In fact, while driving this Phaeton, people looking at me have driven right into parked cars, so I guess it works both ways.

Darryl in Fairbanks
34 degrees, drain the water

[Maclab58]

Guys, it makes me sick to see the pics of your car but I'm so glad you are ok. You stopped at my sister and brother inlaws house in San Angelo, Jan and Scott for repairs. Scott was so excited you were stopping by and text me earlier in the day to tell me about it. I am guilty of infecting him with the bug, he has my 31 Victoria now allowing me to get my Cabriolet. Good luck on fixing the car and please keep the blog going to keep us informed. I admire your sense of adventure and sheer guts to make the trip! KEEP GOING!!!!!!!!!

[Onlybackroads]

Hey Maclab58, it was great to meet Jan and Scott, they are such wonderful people! The vicky looks great by the way, a solid driver for sure. I really appreciate Scotts enthusiasm for Model A's too, being new to it he had so many questions, even from a young guy like me! I sure appreciated them letting us stay there and make our repairs, and Scott seemed tickled to death to watch us and help us put on that new head gasket. Thanks for your kind words, I know this will all pan out one way or another. One thing for sure is that I can't wait to get back on the road in a Model A again!

[denis4x4]

While perusing this thread, I got a pop up for a personal injury attorney located in Texas!

Quite frankly, I find that far more objectionable than politics here!

[Model A Man]

I think you said that a moped hit the rear of the model a. To me that would suggest that you had a green light as the moped would have been also moving forward before the accident. Also couldn't the moped driver be considered a witness for you?

[Onlybackroads]

No, the moped was strapped to the back of my Model A.

[al's28/33]

That's terrible....thanks for sharing this news!! At least Thank God you and your friend could walk away but the idiot that crossed into you should be SHOT!!!

[pooch]

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Originally Posted by Model A Man

I think you said that a moped hit the rear of the model a. To me that would suggest that you had a green light as the moped would have been also moving forward before the accident. Also couldn't the moped driver be considered a witness for you?

No, the moped was strapped to the back of my Model A.

Model A Man, that makes your statement correct on two counts.... the moped WAS moving forward and it HAD a green light too....

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by al's28/33

That's terrible....thanks for sharing this news!! At least Thank God you and your friend could walk away but the idiot that crossed into you should be SHOT!!!

I agree, what this country needs is open season on stupid drivers.
That would also help clean up road congestion.

There are a lot of stupid moves on the road that should be ticketed, but never are. Two days ago I was driving through a long tunnel with 3 lanes in each direction, and solid white lines for all lanes. You are not supposed to change lanes while driving through the tunnel, but many people do, and the other day the semi in front of me changed lanes in the middle of the tunnel. Not too bright, and I was afraid he was going to casue an accident. Semi rollovers are an almost daily thing here in the Twin Cities.

[Slotblog]

Yeah, there's no fixing stupid.

Just this morning I was pulling out of my subdivsion in the pre-dawn darkness, turning left onto a four-lane road, and came THAT close to hitting a black car with no headlights on whatsoever... grrr...

[ericr]

W. C. Fields was in a movie called "If Had A Million", revolving around various people being given one million dollars and what they did with the money. Fields and his girlfriend bought entire used car lots (usually touring cars) and went around crashing into road hogs. There are clips of it on You Tube.....makes you sick seeing those old cars demolished.

[Hoogah]

I know you guys are musos with a bent for old time stuff. I have the same bent, so for a bit of inspiration, here's a Big Bill Broonzy song sung by a mate of mine downunder about going to Arkansas (which I know is where you were headed). Music is a healer. I hope this one helps to propel you forward and keep you positive!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKgT...4&noredirect=1

[HotRodHell]

Haven't been on in a few days and just saw this. Glad to hear your ok, but this this just plain sucks! I hope there's a positive outcome.
Dean

[1921Runabout]

Sorry to hear about your accident. I came across this affordable sedan for sale that may work for parts and get your car back on the road.

http://lawton.craigslist.org/cto/4718775719.html


I wish you the best.

Orlando

[Onlybackroads]

Thanks guys. At this point nothing is really affordable so the car is on the back burner for now, until either I hear good news from the insurance company or I can scrape up enough dollars to start buying various parts here and there. I also don't even have a car now, the Model A was my daily driver! I would love to get the car on the road again before the big national banquet in Little Rock this December, but we'll see how it goes.

[Maclab58]

I have a set of headlights I will donate to the rebuild. I'm sure I have other parts too

Jim

[Onlybackroads]

Wow Jim, that's awesome, I'd really appreciate that! I'll end up making a list at some point of everything that's damaged to see if anyone has any of it lying around that they won't use or couldn't sell. I know before I moved out of California I had all kinds of extra parts that I didn't need at the time so I ended up giving a bunch of stuff away.

[Maclab58]

If you come through Wichita Falls Tx on your way back home I will load you up. Have a bell housing and a complete front axle assembly. Have a 31 grill shell too.

[Onlybackroads]

Oh boy that'd sure help me out! As of now, I'm hoping to load the car up on a haul trailer and head towards Louisiana and up into Tennessee to drop the car off at my parents' house. But I will be living in Fayetteville, AR so maybe if I can borrow a truck I can shoot down there this fall/winter if I don't find anything by then. Thanks for the offer!

[Maclab58]

You bet. If you can make a list of your needs I will help you out.

[kenparker]

I have a front bumper and might have the front bumper brackets. Why dont us Texicans pool our resources and get this fellow Fordbarner back on the road.

[Maclab58]

I agree! Since some dumbass here in Texas caused this. (Notice I didn't call him a Texan) I might know where I can get a frame also. Let's all kick in and get this A back on the road !

[Slotblog]

The members of this forum are truly an inspiration!

[Onlybackroads]

I can't imagine being in any better community than the Model A community, you may also read "community" as "family"

[BlueSunoco]

I too am very sorry to hear of your accident.

But, don't let emotions override a business decision. It will sink you every time. My feelings are, settle with the Insurance company, take what you can get, and go shopping for another 1930 Model A Ford Coupe. They ain't rare. Good, complete, restored ones can be easily had.

Your car needs to be totally dis-assembled and every original piece needs to be sold off for another restoration, original hardware, everything. Not trying to be cruel but if you rebuild this car it will never be 'right'.

[dumb person]

Originally Posted by BlueSunoco

Not trying to be cruel but if you rebuild this car it will never be 'right'.

People like you tell me my car should be crushed. Your ideas are outdated and belong in last century, the world has moved on, if this century is to be better than the last then he should rebuild his car using technology to solve problems (that is why we invent technology in the first place afterall) you know, solving problems, that thing everyone else thinks someone else will do for them.
You also sound like a used parts dealer.

[Onlybackroads]

Originally Posted by BlueSunoco

I too am very sorry to hear of your accident.

But, don't let emotions override a business decision. It will sink you every time. My feelings are, settle with the Insurance company, take what you can get, and go shopping for another 1930 Model A Ford Coupe. They ain't rare. Good, complete, restored ones can be easily had.

Your car needs to be totally dis-assembled and every original piece needs to be sold off for another restoration, original hardware, everything. Not trying to be cruel but if you rebuild this car it will never be 'right'.

I am keeping myself from saying many things. So I will just say: Anyway!

[H. L. Chauvin]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

In my opinion, only one way to be successful when in a tough bind is to maintain flexibility & never give up.

Appears you have more courage than 99% of today' s American couch potatoes who would have given up by now ..... just keep it up with great vigor.

All battles I experienced were won merely through extemporization -- the hell with advice .... a damn fool does not follow it, an intelligent person does not need it.

Just hope this helps.

[Onlybackroads]

Well said H.L. I'm not here to push what I think is "right" on other people. There are a lot of different opinions between everyone here, and that's just fine.

[Onlybackroads]

But aside from all of that, not much going on here, just waiting to hear back from the insurance companies to see what's going on.

I'd like to thank Tom Foster for donating a right front fender and wishbone to me, I really appreciate it Tom and I hope you enjoy our music CD!

[Tom Foster]

Thanks for the good words, Sean, and I'm enjoying the CD right now... Your current neighborhood in Austin would be a great place to 'camp' for the winter, but I know you have other plans. We hope our parts help.
Fearless

[BudP]

I would say the Model A and especially the genius of the management/mechanical engineering/electrical engineering that developed the production processes to produce such a widely accepted mode of transportation qualify it as a unique vehicle in the history of world and U.S.A., second only to the Model T. Further, it's industrial capabilities directly led to this country being able to relatively quickly achieve a wartime capacity when needed. It might not be rare but it is the quintessential product of the second generation of automobile production in the world. That qualifies it for uniqueness and respect, no matter what shape it is in.

[Onlybackroads]

BlueSunoco, you obviously have a different view on my car than I do. Thank you for your sympathy, I will stick to my plan and you can stick to your opinion of what you'd do in my situation and what you think is "correct."

P.S.
"Those sort of re-builds are done to AC Cobra's and Ford GT40's, NOT Model A's. Cars that are unique and rare and a Model A Ford sure doesn't fit that category.........….."
-This attitude is just uncalled for. I'd appreciate if you left out comments like this. You're acting like someone is asking you to choose whether or not to rebuild this car. Please try and appreciate the fact that I care a lot about my car, enjoy the challenge of bringing it back to life, and have a lot of well-earned pride behind it. And please don't assume that I have the money to just go buy another one, I am in the middle of dealing with insurance companies and do not know the outcome of the whole situation yet. All I know is that this car is savable, and that's what I plan to do.

[Tom RSA]

I agree that the car is savable. With the availability of "A" parts (original and reproduction) in your part of the world, it can be done but I would suggest finding a replacement frame and starting rebuilding from there, closely examining every part salvaged. Please keep us posted on your progress.

[Tom Wesenberg]

Can you tell if the frame is damaged more than just the front horns? At Thursdays night's club meeting it was announced a club member has two free frames to give away.

[Onlybackroads]

The frame is definitely damaged more than the horns. Both front sections of the rails are twisted and kinked badly, one horn sheared off, and one motor mount started to rip out of the frame. I can also tell from the back that the alignment of the rails is off slightly.

[Onlybackroads]

Here's a list of what I can tell is damaged, I know some of it may possibly be straightened, this is just for my records:

• Right front fender
• Left front fender
• Hood (entire)
• Frame
• Front bumper
• Front bumper brackets
• Headlights (both)
• Headlight bar
• Headlight bar brackets
• Radiator
• Radiator shell
• Radiator splash apron
• Radiator stabilizer rods (both)
• Radiator hoses
• Front brake rods
• Crankshaft pulley
• Motor mounts, front and rears
• Wishbone
• Clutch housing
• Flywheel housing
• Choke rod
• Outside fuel line
• Fan
• Front shocks
• Front leaf springs
• Front axle assembly
• Tie rod
• Drag link
• Throttle assembly
• Cowl band
• Dent in cowl
• Tail light lenses (both)
• Timing gear cover

[BlueSunoco]

Originally Posted by Onlybackroads

BlueSunoco, you obviously have a different view on my car than I do. Thank you for your sympathy, I will stick to my plan and you can stick to your opinion of what you'd do in my situation and what you think is "correct."

P.S.
"Those sort of re-builds are done to AC Cobra's and Ford GT40's, NOT Model A's. Cars that are unique and rare and a Model A Ford sure doesn't fit that category.........….."
-This attitude is just uncalled for. I'd appreciate if you left out comments like this. You're acting like someone is asking you to choose whether or not to rebuild this car. Please try and appreciate the fact that I care a lot about my car, enjoy the challenge of bringing it back to life, and have a lot of well-earned pride behind it. And please don't assume that I have the money to just go buy another one, I am in the middle of dealing with insurance companies and do not know the outcome of the whole situation yet. All I know is that this car is savable, and that's what I plan to do.

Good luck. Comment deleted.

[Tom Wesenberg]

That's quite a list and more damage than I first thought. I'd be looking for another frame rather than repair this one.

[Onlybackroads]

Yep. New frame indeed.

[Barry B./ Ma.]

Another straight frame is a good place to start then build up a good chassis. The body looks pretty good so it should be clear sailing after that. Sounds like a fun project then you can use the old frame for a doodlebug. Make sure the frame you get is a 30/31.

[Onlybackroads]

Yeah Barry, and if this axle is definitely bent I can practice narrowing it for a doodlebug!

[Mitch//pa]

dont buy two frt axle assys you have it listed twice
that would be cool if you could get all the parts from the barners to rebuild your car... i can definitely help out also. it will be in perfect condition when done..

[Onlybackroads]

Haha, didn't notice that Mitch. Well you never know when you might need an extra right? Thanks for the kind words, I appreciate it!

So since the axle was bashed towards the back of the car on the passenger side, and was pretty much detached, I jacked the car up today and moved the axle forward so that I can back it up onto a trailer when I rent one. Otherwise, the car could only steer to the right. I jacked the whole front end up, pulled on the front wheel until I got it fairly straight, then lashed the remaining leaf spring attached to the shackle to the upper leaves, and then lashed that all to the frame. Boy, what on earth would I do without baling wire? I also jacked up the wishbone and tied it up to the frame so it wasn't dragging on the ground anymore.

Sorry for the blurry pictures, my camera lens got beat up during the wreck. In the last picture, you can see how bad the front of my frame is. Also note the nice bend on my tie rod!

[Tom Wesenberg]

The tie rod and brake rods are easy to straighten. I can't tell what's bent on the front axle, but that might also be an easy job to straighten with the right tools.

[pooch]

Starting with another chassis and dismantling your car and transferring bits, you may be surprised what you can straighten out and get it going again.

[Onlybackroads]

Yeah, I am very antsy to start working on it, but first I have to get it to Tennessee, then I have to wait and see if the other insurance company will accept liability so I can get the car inspected before I start messing with it. What a drag!

[Jay's Model A's]

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

If you need to transport your car to Tenn. give me a call 210-867-3257..ASAP Jay

[Onlybackroads]

Headin out of Austin tomorrow, finally, towards Lafayette, LA as planned. No word yet on insurance, but we can't live in Austin forever, so shove on we must. We had to wait around for Lane to get his nose fixed up anyway. See you soon Louisiana!

Jay, I really appreciate your offer for transport, but it just makes more sense for us to rent a u-haul since there's other things we need to do along the way.

[Mitch//pa]

safe travels sir..

[armchair67]

Man I am sure sorry to see that happen to you guys. Glad you are alright, though. I too bought my '31 Model A Tudor to drive daily-I sold my Cadillac CTS-V and replaced it with this. I own a plumbing service company with 8 vans-3 of which are restored '73'-79 VW Buses (I chose 73-up since they have a vastly safer front structure complete with crush zone). Well a few years ago, I put that crush zone to the test, when I pulled out from a light into the path of a semi. Not the vehicle to pull out in front of. This guy clipped me really good doing about 30mph. Needless to say, my veedub sustained considerable damage (having said that, this is one tough SOB-even with heavy damage, I was only half hour late to my first service call!). I fought the insurance company as my Bus was a super clean panel van, in perfect mechanical and body condition prior to my little incident. They ended up covering it. $7500 in damage. New drivers door, complete front clip, pulled the front floor.etc etc. I took it to a shop that normally does work on Ferraris, Rolls Royce, Aston Martin, six figure vintage muscle cars-and they did an absolutely amazing job getting this car back together. It is almost as though they took an eraser to the accident-no matter where you look, there is just no sign of it.

They made millions of VW vans, yes. Panels van versions are not common here in the USA. But they are not making any more of them (Germany stopped in'79 and Brazil stopped earlier this year), and above all, I LIKE the van, so I had it fixed. Three years later, she is still running great 20,000 miles a year running calls. So you know my vote is, if you like that car, Fix her up-she deserves another shot.

[Onlybackroads]

Great story armchair! I agree, she does deserve another shot. We brought her back to life after sitting for so long with the previous owners, didn't wake her up to just put her back down!

[Tom Foster]

[
I hope you enjoy our music CD![/QUOTE]

The music is great -- I played it at full volume during the Devine Fall Festival parade yesterday. Got lots of good comments. Where do I send the royalty payments?
Y'all need to get some square dance calls on a couple of those (if anybody knows what they are). I've got a 1928 78rpm record called "Hell Among the Yearlings."
"Circle eight, and don't be late,
All go left like swingin on a gate..."
and so on...
Fearless

[somethingspecial]

Glad that you both are safe the, car can and will be fixed.

[Onlybackroads]

Update: Drove down to Wichita Falls, TX and picked up a bunch of parts generously donated by Jim Adams. Thanks a whole lot Jim, I can't thank you enough!

I will be driving the parts over to my parents' house over in Tennessee this week, still can't pull the car apart to fix it yet, need to wait until insurance business is done with. In the meantime, I can't afford to buy many parts right now, so if anyone else has any parts laying around that they'd like to donate, I would greatly appreciate it! Contact me if you'd like, and I can give a list of what I still don't have.

[Onlybackroads]

Resurrecting an old post here, just thought I'd update it in case anyone was curious. We got a lawyer and they're working on our case to hopefully settle the matter once and for all. With springtime getting closer, I'm getting more and more excited to finish up hunting down all of the parts I need to rebuild the car. Thanks to Jim Adams, most of it has been graciously taken care of. I am also looking forward to making it out to the Chickesha Pre War swap meet, I hear it's a good one. Also, my friend is looking for a not-so-shiny '29 tudor sedan, for a driver. We plan to drive around this spring picking up whatever else I need and trying to find him a car, so if anyone vaguely close to Arkansas/Tennessee knows of anything, let me know!

And for anyone who's interested in antique motorcycles, here's what I've been doing for a living in Arkansas, and hopefully will have a decent amount of money saved up to put into the rebuild of my car in the next year or two. I build motorbikes themed after antique motorcycles, I don't say replicas because they aren't exact copies, but they still honor most of the styling of early motorcycling:

[Maclab58]

Look forward to seeing you in Chickasha in a few weeks Sean. Will do my best to bring the frame with me. You will be impressed with what will be there! Ford Barners, if y'all have any parts you could donate to this young man's resurrection drop him a message. He's a great guy and could use our help. PM me if I can be of assistance.

Jim Adams
Wichita Falls, Tx

[Hoogah]

Have not forgotten about you Sean, and remained subscribed this thread in the hope of finding out how you are getting on. Good luck with the legals! For every downside, there's an upside - in your case the generosity of Jim. If I ever crash my car, I'm gonna do it in Wichita Falls TX, which will be no mean feat given where I live!

Those motor bikes in your post and blog look suitably fun and dangerous!!

[Dodge]

Good to see your still at it. Yes we have been wondering about your progress. Glad
to see you posting again. I haven't seen a new list for any items still needed.

Dodge

[Redbird]

Everyone should have an antique auto policy with "agreed value" coverage. I have mine through the Corvette Museum and insured by American Modern subsidiary in Texas.

[Onlybackroads]

Agreed, wish I could go back and do that but I was pinching pennies with a low budget. Big mistake, for it wouldn't have cost much more per month and obviously would have been well worth it, but it's always a little tricky to predict the future.

[Onlybackroads]

Looking for a frame around Tennessee! Looking to rebuild the car in March!

[700rpm]

Sean, please fill us in on the final insurance fight outcome.

[john charlton]

So pleased to hear you were not seriously injured, that was a close call for sure !!! . Twice in a 15 mile trip a lunatic pulled out of a side road straight in front of me how I missed coliding with both cars is a mystery .Luckily my pickup has very good brakes and on both occasions I locked up, no time for cadence braking !!! Both drivers faces showed complete astonishment .I suppose they had seen me but assumed I was making a steady 20 MPH not the 45 MPH I was .As a previous poster said maybe they just did not compute an actual motor vehicle was coming their way. I keep a very wary eye out nowadays . When I arrived at my buddies house he said maybe someone is out to get me !!!

John in rain showers no sunshine Suffolk County England .

PS I checked your list and I have every single part you need in my "stores".Mail your car to me !!!

[Synchro909]

Just had another look at your original pictures. With a whack like that on the front of the water pump. you might very well need a new head. Check to see that the WP shaft hasn't been pushed back into the head, destroying the web in there that takes up the rearwards play in the shaft.

[John Kuhnast]

Synchro 909 has what I think is a good thought. After stoping at a red light I had a car come very close to hitting me. Im sure they saw me. Could it be that it did not dawn on them that I was a car? I have a pair of fog lights on the front bumper. Think Ill run with them on during the day from now on.

[Onlybackroads]

Ray, no results with the lawyers yet...

Yes I do think people just don't realize that the Model A's are moving! I get the same experience on my small old motorcycles, people see or... Don't see... A small yellow headlight and don't think you'll actually hit the intersection when you do. I broke my hand dodging a car that pulled in front of me on my motorcycle last spring, no matter how careful I am there's always still chance of bad drivers not paying full attention...

I checked play on the water pump and it seemed fine, but have yet to actually take it off to fully inspect. I plan to put a high comp head on anyway. I have to do my valves anyway!