The Ford Barn

midgetracer · 06-23-2010, 07:52 PM

Does anyone have some input on putting an F-1 steering box into a Model A? I have a 48 F-1 box that I would like to use in a 30 Coupe I am building with a B engine and a Miller head. I am so over budget that I would like to do as much of the conversion without buying any pre-made kits. I am also planning on using a B tranny so any help there would be appreciated. Thanks

MAG · 06-23-2010, 08:01 PM

I have installed F100 (54-56) steering boxes in Model A's converting both two tooth and seven tooth boxes into the F100 box. However, I have never done that installation using a 48 F100 box. Perhaps someone that has done that will respond.

LeroyM · 06-23-2010, 08:30 PM

I have a 1950 F1 steering box in my 31 coupe. Big difference over the Model A steering box. I took both steering boxes to a pro welder and had it done. The main thing you need to do is cut the mounting flange off the F1 box and weld the Model A mounting flange to the F1 box. Make sure you V both parts so the weld gets in there to hold. Also make sure you measure your angles on how you want the column to sit in the car before you do any cutting.

Here's some links I used when I did mine. Also get the book by Vern Tardel on "How to Build a Traditional Hot Rod", it has some good info on this.

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...teering+column

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...teering+column

Ice man · 06-23-2010, 08:48 PM

I put one in my 29 Pk Up, Lots of work, some one had already cut the shaft, but the worm bearing were shot so a new shaft was need. I had the new shaft cut and the Model A end welded on. Looks just like a 29 set up from the inside of the truck. It fit on the frame after some fitting, but was tight where it passes through the cowl. So I cut a hole in the frame and built a pocket for it to fit in to. Its very strong, and the steering is very easy. I have a customers 30 Ford roadster in the shop now and his complaint is the old Ford box with it built in play and stiffness. He has ordered the new Box from Ohio that is a direct bolt in replacement, but also $800.00. I was able do mine, he is not, but he has the money to do what he wants. I would not ago back to the old Box again, love the improvement. Iceman

Bassman/NZ · 06-23-2010, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeroyM

I have a 1950 F1 steering box in my 31 coupe. Big difference over the Model A steering box. I took both steering boxes to a pro welder and had it done. The main thing you need to do is cut the mounting flange off the F1 box and weld the Model A mounting flange to the F1 box. Make sure you V both parts so the weld gets in there to hold. Also make sure you measure your angles on how you want the column to sit in the car before you do any cutting.

Here's some links I used when I did mine. Also get the book by Vern Tardel on "How to Build a Traditional Hot Rod", it has some good info on this.

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...teering+column

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...teering+column

Another vote for Vern Tardel's and Ron Bishop's book.

midgetracer · 06-24-2010, 08:05 AM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Thank you all very much. I will order the Tardell- Bishop book. I appreciate all the input. Any comments on putting the B transmission in my A coupe?
Rod

kelley's restoration · 06-24-2010, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by midgetracer

Thank you all very much. I will order the Tardell- Bishop book. I appreciate all the input. Any comments on putting the B transmission in my A coupe?
Rod

your going to need a pedal kit and all the brackets to bolt the front wishbone on
other wise its a good swap
i think you can even put 39 gears in it with a little mod to the case
tk

anut · 06-24-2010, 11:11 AM

i am not a pro i did the bishop tardel f i on my av8 high boy 29 roadster cut 1inch off steering arm drives like it has power steering

anut · 06-24-2010, 11:15 AM

i ment to say pitman arm not steering cut off

LeroyM · 06-24-2010, 11:35 AM

Look into a 39 transmission. I think it would be easier then trying to work the B transmission into the Model A frame. They sell a kit which allows you to bolt the 39 transmission up to the Model A flywheel housing. The kit runs about $450 I think and comes with everything you need.

The 39 style transmission can be found all the way up to 1952 in the F1 pickups. Plus the later transmissions have better synchronizers in them which will make it a better shift.

I'm running this setup in my coupe and it works like a charm.

Tom Wesenberg · 06-24-2010, 11:51 AM

If you want easier steering why not just use the shortened pitman arm? It's cheap and easy to install, and everyone that's done it says it really does the job.

I'm happy with my stock steering, and wil like it even better after it's rebuilt.

Pete · 06-24-2010, 11:51 AM

While many people think cutting and welding on steering parts is a routine deal, I just hope I am never on the same road with you folks.
Installing a F1 or F100 steering in an A or any car can be done WITH NO WELDING...
It has been documented many times on these forums.

By the way, even the ones you buy for $800 are welded.
If welding was the best and safest way to build a steering box the factory would have done it that way to save millions of dollars.

LeroyM · 06-24-2010, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete

While many people think cutting and welding on steering parts is a routine deal, I just hope I am never on the same road with you folks.
Installing a F1 or F100 steering in an A or any car can be done WITH NO WELDING...
It has been documented many times on these forums.

By the way, even the ones you buy for $800 are welded.
If welding was the best and safest way to build a steering box the factory would have done it that way to save millions of dollars.

I'm all for safety, but if done correctly how is welding on the steering box going to cause a problem?

When I installed mine I wanted it to bolt up like the Model A steering box did. That away if I ever wanted to undo the changes I could just unbolt it. You can put anything into a Model A if you want to cut and drill new holes.

I was hesitant to do any cutting and welding on the steering box myself for legal reason and from my dad also saying "if the state trooper ever pulled you over and knew that steering box was welded on they would take it off the road".

I made a call to the Virginia state police and talked to one of the troopers who knew the law and knew about inspections. He told me welding on the steering box is fine, but do not weld on anything that moves. Tierods, steering arms and so on.

modelaonly.com · 06-24-2010, 03:00 PM

modelaonly.com bolt in f100 box

jetmek · 06-24-2010, 08:44 PM

nothing wrong with welding steering components if its done by a COMPETENT welder. ive got over 20k miles hard use on mine with no trouble. make sure the column will clear the starter/ bellhousing as the column comes out of the box below the sector. i had to fab a column drop for mine so the angle of the steering wheel would look right

midgetracer · 06-25-2010, 12:44 AM

Thanks for all the info. I am hoping to get this car done for the spring 2011 driving season and all your comments really help.

06-23-2010, 07:52 PM	#1
midgetracer Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bismarck ND Posts: 1,189	F-1 steering box in Model A Does anyone have some input on putting an F-1 steering box into a Model A? I have a 48 F-1 box that I would like to use in a 30 Coupe I am building with a B engine and a Miller head. I am so over budget that I would like to do as much of the conversion without buying any pre-made kits. I am also planning on using a B tranny so any help there would be appreciated. Thanks

06-23-2010, 08:01 PM	#2
MAG Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 925	Re: F-1 steering box in Model A I have installed F100 (54-56) steering boxes in Model A's converting both two tooth and seven tooth boxes into the F100 box. However, I have never done that installation using a 48 F100 box. Perhaps someone that has done that will respond. __________________ I noticed the harder I work the luckier I get!

06-23-2010, 08:30 PM	#3
LeroyM Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Virginia Posts: 276	Re: F-1 steering box in Model A I have a 1950 F1 steering box in my 31 coupe. Big difference over the Model A steering box. I took both steering boxes to a pro welder and had it done. The main thing you need to do is cut the mounting flange off the F1 box and weld the Model A mounting flange to the F1 box. Make sure you V both parts so the weld gets in there to hold. Also make sure you measure your angles on how you want the column to sit in the car before you do any cutting. Here's some links I used when I did mine. Also get the book by Vern Tardel on "How to Build a Traditional Hot Rod", it has some good info on this. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...teering+column http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/s...teering+column

06-23-2010, 08:48 PM	#4
Ice man Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Southern Pines, N.Carolina Posts: 210	Re: F-1 steering box in Model A I put one in my 29 Pk Up, Lots of work, some one had already cut the shaft, but the worm bearing were shot so a new shaft was need. I had the new shaft cut and the Model A end welded on. Looks just like a 29 set up from the inside of the truck. It fit on the frame after some fitting, but was tight where it passes through the cowl. So I cut a hole in the frame and built a pocket for it to fit in to. Its very strong, and the steering is very easy. I have a customers 30 Ford roadster in the shop now and his complaint is the old Ford box with it built in play and stiffness. He has ordered the new Box from Ohio that is a direct bolt in replacement, but also $800.00. I was able do mine, he is not, but he has the money to do what he wants. I would not ago back to the old Box again, love the improvement. Iceman

06-24-2010, 08:05 AM	#6
midgetracer Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bismarck ND Posts: 1,189	Re: F-1 steering box in Model A Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Thank you all very much. I will order the Tardell- Bishop book. I appreciate all the input. Any comments on putting the B transmission in my A coupe? Rod

06-24-2010, 11:11 AM	#8
anut Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 47	Re: F-1 steering box in Model A i am not a pro i did the bishop tardel f i on my av8 high boy 29 roadster cut 1inch off steering arm drives like it has power steering

06-24-2010, 11:15 AM	#9
anut Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 47	Re: F-1 steering box in Model A i ment to say pitman arm not steering cut off

06-24-2010, 11:35 AM	#10
LeroyM Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Virginia Posts: 276	Re: F-1 steering box in Model A Look into a 39 transmission. I think it would be easier then trying to work the B transmission into the Model A frame. They sell a kit which allows you to bolt the 39 transmission up to the Model A flywheel housing. The kit runs about $450 I think and comes with everything you need. The 39 style transmission can be found all the way up to 1952 in the F1 pickups. Plus the later transmissions have better synchronizers in them which will make it a better shift. I'm running this setup in my coupe and it works like a charm.

06-24-2010, 11:51 AM	#11
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: F-1 steering box in Model A If you want easier steering why not just use the shortened pitman arm? It's cheap and easy to install, and everyone that's done it says it really does the job. I'm happy with my stock steering, and wil like it even better after it's rebuilt.

06-24-2010, 11:51 AM	#12
Pete Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Wa. Posts: 5,409	Re: F-1 steering box in Model A While many people think cutting and welding on steering parts is a routine deal, I just hope I am never on the same road with you folks. Installing a F1 or F100 steering in an A or any car can be done WITH NO WELDING... It has been documented many times on these forums. By the way, even the ones you buy for $800 are welded. If welding was the best and safest way to build a steering box the factory would have done it that way to save millions of dollars.

06-24-2010, 03:00 PM	#14
modelaonly.com Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 67	Re: F-1 steering box in Model A modelaonly.com bolt in f100 box

06-24-2010, 08:44 PM	#15
jetmek Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: albany Posts: 466	Re: F-1 steering box in Model A nothing wrong with welding steering components if its done by a COMPETENT welder. ive got over 20k miles hard use on mine with no trouble. make sure the column will clear the starter/ bellhousing as the column comes out of the box below the sector. i had to fab a column drop for mine so the angle of the steering wheel would look right

06-25-2010, 12:44 AM	#16
midgetracer Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bismarck ND Posts: 1,189	Re: F-1 steering box in Model A Thanks for all the info. I am hoping to get this car done for the spring 2011 driving season and all your comments really help.