The Ford Barn

rockfla · 11-08-2017, 01:01 PM

glennpm
At least IF you find the tops are wonkey you'll have it apart already for repo's if you decide to go that route. Reminder IF you have to replace the tops make sure whoever you get to match the paint "Fits" the sides and accounts for paint thickness at the hinges so you don't chip paint!!!!!

glennpm · 11-08-2017, 07:16 PM

Okay, I pulled the hood and disassembled the panels this afternoon. Each of the panels fits correctly by themselves. The side panels may be a little high but that so far is based on eying the hinge center-line to the depressions in the cowl which accommodate the hinges.

I also called Rootlieb late this afternoon and had a great conversation with Tom there. He suggests hinging the two top sections together now and getting them to fit exactly to the radiator and cowl by bending on a table, fit and bend some more. They should be sitting flat with no bowing with even gaps all around. He said to grind the laps on the front and back edges if required. The laps may break if ground a fair bit and if so they'll have to be tacked back on and finessed.

After this top panel fitting, see how the side panels fit. He finds that it is common to have problems with the side panels. They do offer a service to make panels based on customer provided cardboard templates at additional cost.

We also talked about the "25 Henry Louver Sides" that they offer. These are curved through the panel to match the firewall welting and twisted front to back. My 25 louver is flat as are the 20 louver Fords he said. These seem like an interesting option if I need panels.

http://www.rootlieb.com/ford-1932-36-hoods.html

Krylon32 · 11-08-2017, 07:49 PM

Don't get discouraged, I've done a lot of deuces over the years and hood fit has always been a challenge. I've always used Rootlieb and for the most part have been satisfied. To get the perfect gaps we demand these days I've had to trim, section, lengthen etc several of the hoods for my cars. I have the gennie Henry style 25 louver Hood on my 3 window, delivery, roadster and 5 window with good results although I did surgery to the tops on the delivery and 3 window. My painter says I'm a little to anal about the fit but it can make the car.

glennpm · 11-09-2017, 01:12 PM

Thanks fro the encouragement Krylon, I need it now!

I. concerned that even after fitting the top panels as I mention above, that the hinge sockets are then not going to line up with the side panel. If I slide the hinge pin back in again, I'm back where I started. I'm thinking along the line of sectioning close to the top of the side panel/s but we'll see. No work on it today.

Glenn

DavidG · 11-09-2017, 02:16 PM

In case you are tempted to use another source's top panels or side panels, I'd be willing to bet that the tabs for the tops to sides hinge pins don't line up right.

glennpm · 11-09-2017, 03:02 PM

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Yes David, I had that thought ;-)

I called back Rootlieb last night and asked them about this and they said, "The side panels will fit our tops"

If I can't get something reasonable going with my pieces, I'll bite the bullet and go with the Rootlieb, "25 Henry Louver Sides". They're pricey, may still not fit and then I've got get them painted so two thousand dollars probably if sheet metal tweaking is not required.

I jsut laid the two top panales on with center hinge slipped in back. Both front corners stand up maybe an inch. I'll take them off, remove the hinge and bend in by hand on a table with a blanket first. Once I get them laying flat on the welting, I'll put some tape on the lower edge of both top panels, lay the side panels in on the outside and make some pencil marks as a guesstimate of where the hinge pocket centerlines are in reference to the same on the top panels. No way to do this on the inside easily that I can think of.

DavidG · 11-09-2017, 04:05 PM

Hmmm.... Your last note got me thinking about your center hinge molding. You indicate that it is a reproduction. I have found reproduction hinge moldings do not work well with original hood top panels as they have less space inside the enclosed area on the underside where the side panels pivot than original hinge moldings.

If you haven't done so already, install your hinge molding on one top panel (only) and see if the panel will rotate in the hinge molding at least somewhat more than would be the case with a perfect hood fit. Repeat that test for the other top panel. If both pass with flying colors, repeat the test with both top panels installed in the hinge molding to see if the two sides are in conflict with one another when the top panels are folded down as with a normal fit on the cowl. If all three of those tests pass with flying colors you can at least eliminate that as a contributing factor. If either tests fail, you will have solved at least half of your fit issues.

Alaska Jim · 11-09-2017, 05:47 PM

everything I ever bought from Howells sheetmetal fit like crap, some I did not even use. cost to much to send back . just my .02

glennpm · 11-09-2017, 07:04 PM

Hi David,

Okay, I pulled the hood and disassembled the panels this afternoon. Each of the panels fits correctly by themselves. The side panels may be a little high but that so far is based on eying the hinge center-line to the depressions in the cowl which accommodate the hinges.

I also called Rootlieb late this afternoon and had a great conversation with Tom there. He suggests hinging the two top sections together now and getting them to fit exactly to the radiator and cowl by bending on a table, fit and bend some more. They should be sitting flat with no bowing with even gaps all around. He said to grind the laps on the front and back edges if required. The laps may break if ground a fair bit and if so they'll have to be tacked back on and finessed.

After this top panel fitting, see how the side panels fit. He finds that it is common to have problems with the side panels. They do offer a service to make panels based on customer provided cardboard templates.

We also talked about the "25 Henry Louver Sides" that they offer. These are curved through the panel to match the firewall welting and twisted front to back. My 25 louver is flat as are the 20 louver Fords he said. These seem like an interesting option if I need panels.

http://www.rootlieb.com/ford-1932-36-hoods.html

glennpm · 11-09-2017, 07:07 PM

Hi Alaska Jim,

Rootlieb told me that Howell's doesn't and didn't make hoods. It could have been Hooiser's in the mid-west if not Rootlieb. I think but can't confirm that the hood I have is from Rootlieb, bought maybe 30 years ago.

Floyd · 11-09-2017, 07:45 PM

You could try an original Henry hood and center hinge strip. Chances are the problems will go away. See if you can borrow a hood assembly to try. If you need to buy one, they are out there and the cost is not that great considering all the aggravation you are going through. My experience is that original center hinge strip is way better than the best of the repros. Some repros don't work at all, they just bind up and make life miserable. Remember that a 33 hinge strip will work by cutting off 1 inch.
My opinion

Rusty1932 · 11-09-2017, 08:02 PM

Had a similar problem, found out the frame was bent forward of the firewall. Have you checked this?

glennpm · 11-10-2017, 06:52 AM

Hi Rusty,

Frame is fine. It has been checked.

glennpm · 11-10-2017, 07:33 AM

Hi Karl,

Well I found a receipt for my side panels. I bought them from your shop in 1980! I also have a note that the top panels are stock Ford. Do you know if your panels came from Rootlieb or whom at that time?

Thanks

PS I have a LOT of receipts from your shop.

glennpm · 11-10-2017, 03:11 PM

Hi,

I used my other hood center hinge strip and the hood tops lay down quite well now. I also laid up the lower panels over the top and the front hinge pockets are about 3/8" low on the driver's and 7/16" on the passenger's side. From the picture attached you can see that the front corner by the grill needs to be raised to align with the top panel hinge pockets.

I may be able to fix this by slotting and then sliding the bottom of the radiator bracket out about a little less than that due to the shorter height to length dimensions. I'll figure the trig out later. (figured about 11/32")

Could someone tell me what they have for an inside dimension from the bottom inside edge of the cowl to the inside of the radiator stainless strip please? It is the dimension indicated on my marked up pic below.

Thanks

glennpm · 11-12-2017, 08:03 AM

Anyone of the lower hood opening dimension requested above in thread #35 please?

Any other new suggestions?

Thanks

birdball · 11-21-2017, 03:51 PM

Hi Glenn- the other degrees of freedom you have here are the ability to move the grill fore and aft (I had to slot my radiator feet to allow more adjustment). You can also shim under one or both feet to move the hood center left or right, as well as shimming under the body to move the rear up relative to the front. Also don't forget the radiator steady rods- they can over constrain your system if not adjusted right.

Best of luck!
Matt

glennpm · 11-21-2017, 04:03 PM

Hi Matt,

I have slotted the grill shell support tabs on the after market radiator since I last posted. This made a substantial difference. Its still not great for gaps, little too close on front and a little too big on back edges, but good for now. No more hump on the passenger's side and the reveals all line up quite well.

Thanks for your input!

11-08-2017, 01:01 PM	#21
rockfla Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Jacksonville FL Posts: 3,946	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 glennpm At least IF you find the tops are wonkey you'll have it apart already for repo's if you decide to go that route. Reminder IF you have to replace the tops make sure whoever you get to match the paint "Fits" the sides and accounts for paint thickness at the hinges so you don't chip paint!!!!!

11-08-2017, 07:16 PM	#22
glennpm Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Wiscasset, Maine Posts: 1,980	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 Okay, I pulled the hood and disassembled the panels this afternoon. Each of the panels fits correctly by themselves. The side panels may be a little high but that so far is based on eying the hinge center-line to the depressions in the cowl which accommodate the hinges. I also called Rootlieb late this afternoon and had a great conversation with Tom there. He suggests hinging the two top sections together now and getting them to fit exactly to the radiator and cowl by bending on a table, fit and bend some more. They should be sitting flat with no bowing with even gaps all around. He said to grind the laps on the front and back edges if required. The laps may break if ground a fair bit and if so they'll have to be tacked back on and finessed. After this top panel fitting, see how the side panels fit. He finds that it is common to have problems with the side panels. They do offer a service to make panels based on customer provided cardboard templates at additional cost. We also talked about the "25 Henry Louver Sides" that they offer. These are curved through the panel to match the firewall welting and twisted front to back. My 25 louver is flat as are the 20 louver Fords he said. These seem like an interesting option if I need panels. http://www.rootlieb.com/ford-1932-36-hoods.html

11-08-2017, 07:49 PM	#23
Krylon32 Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 4,470	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 Don't get discouraged, I've done a lot of deuces over the years and hood fit has always been a challenge. I've always used Rootlieb and for the most part have been satisfied. To get the perfect gaps we demand these days I've had to trim, section, lengthen etc several of the hoods for my cars. I have the gennie Henry style 25 louver Hood on my 3 window, delivery, roadster and 5 window with good results although I did surgery to the tops on the delivery and 3 window. My painter says I'm a little to anal about the fit but it can make the car.

11-09-2017, 01:12 PM	#24
glennpm Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Wiscasset, Maine Posts: 1,980	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 Thanks fro the encouragement Krylon, I need it now! I. concerned that even after fitting the top panels as I mention above, that the hinge sockets are then not going to line up with the side panel. If I slide the hinge pin back in again, I'm back where I started. I'm thinking along the line of sectioning close to the top of the side panel/s but we'll see. No work on it today. Glenn

11-09-2017, 02:16 PM	#25
DavidG Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: southeastern Michigan Posts: 10,094	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 In case you are tempted to use another source's top panels or side panels, I'd be willing to bet that the tabs for the tops to sides hinge pins don't line up right.

11-09-2017, 03:02 PM	#26
glennpm Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Wiscasset, Maine Posts: 1,980	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Yes David, I had that thought ;-) I called back Rootlieb last night and asked them about this and they said, "The side panels will fit our tops" If I can't get something reasonable going with my pieces, I'll bite the bullet and go with the Rootlieb, "25 Henry Louver Sides". They're pricey, may still not fit and then I've got get them painted so two thousand dollars probably if sheet metal tweaking is not required. I jsut laid the two top panales on with center hinge slipped in back. Both front corners stand up maybe an inch. I'll take them off, remove the hinge and bend in by hand on a table with a blanket first. Once I get them laying flat on the welting, I'll put some tape on the lower edge of both top panels, lay the side panels in on the outside and make some pencil marks as a guesstimate of where the hinge pocket centerlines are in reference to the same on the top panels. No way to do this on the inside easily that I can think of. Last edited by glennpm; 11-09-2017 at 07:03 PM.

11-09-2017, 04:05 PM	#27
DavidG Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: southeastern Michigan Posts: 10,094	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 Hmmm.... Your last note got me thinking about your center hinge molding. You indicate that it is a reproduction. I have found reproduction hinge moldings do not work well with original hood top panels as they have less space inside the enclosed area on the underside where the side panels pivot than original hinge moldings. If you haven't done so already, install your hinge molding on one top panel (only) and see if the panel will rotate in the hinge molding at least somewhat more than would be the case with a perfect hood fit. Repeat that test for the other top panel. If both pass with flying colors, repeat the test with both top panels installed in the hinge molding to see if the two sides are in conflict with one another when the top panels are folded down as with a normal fit on the cowl. If all three of those tests pass with flying colors you can at least eliminate that as a contributing factor. If either tests fail, you will have solved at least half of your fit issues.

11-09-2017, 05:47 PM	#28
Alaska Jim Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Palmer, Alaska Posts: 1,575	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 everything I ever bought from Howells sheetmetal fit like crap, some I did not even use. cost to much to send back . just my .02

11-09-2017, 07:04 PM	#29
glennpm Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Wiscasset, Maine Posts: 1,980	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 Hi David, Okay, I pulled the hood and disassembled the panels this afternoon. Each of the panels fits correctly by themselves. The side panels may be a little high but that so far is based on eying the hinge center-line to the depressions in the cowl which accommodate the hinges. I also called Rootlieb late this afternoon and had a great conversation with Tom there. He suggests hinging the two top sections together now and getting them to fit exactly to the radiator and cowl by bending on a table, fit and bend some more. They should be sitting flat with no bowing with even gaps all around. He said to grind the laps on the front and back edges if required. The laps may break if ground a fair bit and if so they'll have to be tacked back on and finessed. After this top panel fitting, see how the side panels fit. He finds that it is common to have problems with the side panels. They do offer a service to make panels based on customer provided cardboard templates. We also talked about the "25 Henry Louver Sides" that they offer. These are curved through the panel to match the firewall welting and twisted front to back. My 25 louver is flat as are the 20 louver Fords he said. These seem like an interesting option if I need panels. http://www.rootlieb.com/ford-1932-36-hoods.html

11-09-2017, 07:07 PM	#30
glennpm Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Wiscasset, Maine Posts: 1,980	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 Hi Alaska Jim, Rootlieb told me that Howell's doesn't and didn't make hoods. It could have been Hooiser's in the mid-west if not Rootlieb. I think but can't confirm that the hood I have is from Rootlieb, bought maybe 30 years ago.

11-09-2017, 07:45 PM	#31
Floyd Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 468	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 You could try an original Henry hood and center hinge strip. Chances are the problems will go away. See if you can borrow a hood assembly to try. If you need to buy one, they are out there and the cost is not that great considering all the aggravation you are going through. My experience is that original center hinge strip is way better than the best of the repros. Some repros don't work at all, they just bind up and make life miserable. Remember that a 33 hinge strip will work by cutting off 1 inch. My opinion

11-09-2017, 08:02 PM	#32
Rusty1932 Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: USA Posts: 72	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 Had a similar problem, found out the frame was bent forward of the firewall. Have you checked this?

11-10-2017, 06:52 AM	#33
glennpm Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Wiscasset, Maine Posts: 1,980	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 Hi Rusty, Frame is fine. It has been checked.

11-12-2017, 08:03 AM	#36
glennpm Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Wiscasset, Maine Posts: 1,980	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 Anyone of the lower hood opening dimension requested above in thread #35 please? Any other new suggestions? Thanks

11-21-2017, 03:51 PM	#37
birdball Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Milford, MI Posts: 56	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 Hi Glenn- the other degrees of freedom you have here are the ability to move the grill fore and aft (I had to slot my radiator feet to allow more adjustment). You can also shim under one or both feet to move the hood center left or right, as well as shimming under the body to move the rear up relative to the front. Also don't forget the radiator steady rods- they can over constrain your system if not adjusted right. Best of luck! Matt __________________ 1932 2 door sedan/ Merc Flathead 1932 5W 1932 Roadster/ SCoT Flathead 1932 Roadster Cadillac power

11-21-2017, 04:03 PM	#38
glennpm Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Wiscasset, Maine Posts: 1,980	Re: Hood Ill Fit-up - 1932 Hi Matt, I have slotted the grill shell support tabs on the after market radiator since I last posted. This made a substantial difference. Its still not great for gaps, little too close on front and a little too big on back edges, but good for now. No more hump on the passenger's side and the reveals all line up quite well. Thanks for your input! Last edited by glennpm; 11-22-2017 at 07:13 AM.