The Ford Barn

Tom Walker · 12-01-2012, 03:27 AM

I have the option to take out my original 32 engine, to preserve it. So I would need to look for a block that would drop straight into a 32 chassis.
Assume I would use "pump in head" heads, and I need to think about bolting to the transmission as well.

Please advise as to which block I should be looking for.

Thanks, Tom.

Mart · 12-01-2012, 04:33 AM

Not quite sure why you would want to do it, but any block 32-48 will virtually bolt right in. Post 36 will not be pump in head, though. Normally this side of the pond it doesn't take too long for a 21stud Pilot/military motor to turn up, and you can either go over to pump in block (Pilot style) or fit blanking plates and run pump in head heads, but they must be for domed pistons. (or you could swap pistons).

Better still would be a nice running 59A style motor, 239 cu in or bigger if bored and a 4" crank fitted.

Lots of cars have had the wrong engine fitted over the years, if yours has the right one, that's a big plus for your car.

Mart.

Gary-UK · 12-01-2012, 04:34 AM

Tom assume you want keep it looking stock looking hence the pump in heads? If so then any later pump in head engine up to 36. The 37 was 21 stud but the heads had the outlets in the centre of the heads and the pumps on the front of the block like later engines. You can use this block and fit pump in head heads and block off the block pumps with a simple plate. These blocks come in two types, the USA style with full floating rod bearings and the English pilot engine which has insert rod bearings, not Babbitt.

So apart from the benifit of an easier rebuild, with this block you also get dome topped pistons with a higher compression. As regards bolting in to your frame, it will go straight in and use the same front mounts. The only other thing to keep in mind is if you use a pilot assembly and keep the flywheel then you will need the matching starter as the USA/UK ring gears were different.

This is just a brief summary really but I have done the exact same thing on my 3w.

*typing same time as mart!

Tom Walker · 12-01-2012, 06:15 AM

Thanks Guys, that is very useful.

Mart, nothing is cut and dried, I am just aware of how rare my 32 block is, and if i want to warm things up a bit, would rather modify a less valuable block.

I am wary of porting the orig block and carving into a water passage!

Same goes for the rear end. If I go ahead and fit the Columbia, I think I will be better changing the whole back axle and torque tube, and put my original on the shelf. That way yr not spoiling the bits if I want to ever sell it as bog standard/original.

Will a 59A drop straight in?

chuck stevens · 12-01-2012, 06:45 AM

Tom I know the shipping is a "killer", but I have several 59a 24 bolt blocks, and a good supply of the 8BA 49 -53 blocks. They are good rebuild-able blocks- no cracks. Just a thought, good luck Chuck.

Gary-UK · 12-01-2012, 07:19 AM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

59a style will go straight in but will involve a bit of work on rad hoses. Inlets are lower on front of block, but there are various ways to overcome that.

Some of the later mercury engines won't go straight in as the crank pulley fouls the crossmember. All flathead blocks have the tapped holes on the front for 32 mounts.

Richard Wilson · 12-01-2012, 09:14 AM

I had similar thoughts as you about removing the original V-8 from my low mileage 1932 coupe to preserve it. I was lucky enough to find another original 1932 engine that had just been rebuilt. Now I have the best of both worlds.

My replacement engine came from a 1932 that had the engine replaced with a 1935 engine. The guy used 1932 heads and pumps on the 1935 engine.

Tom Walker · 12-01-2012, 09:32 AM

Thanks, and heres another one...will any flathead block fit any V8 transmission?

Rowdy · 12-01-2012, 09:39 AM

Yes any 32-48 transmission will fit also, but 1940 and later tranmissions for passenger cars are side loaders. Pickup transmissions up to 1952 are top loaders. Rod

Charlie Stephens · 12-01-2012, 12:09 PM

First “it is easy”, second “don’t do it”. The 21 stud engine short blocks through 1938 will drop right into your car. The holes for the motor mounts are there and the transmission bolts right up. I say short blocks since you need to be careful about using domed pistons on heads designed for flat top pistons. With the correct pistons your '32 parts will bolt right onto the later engine. Ford actually made a plate to block off the water pumps location on the front of the ’37-’38 engines. These frequently show up on EBAY but are easy to make. Probably the best choice, and most expensive is the 1936 block with insert bearings (referred to as the “LB” block) as it has insert bearings and looks most like the original engine. Note some 1936 engines were babbitt and some were inserts. My second choice would be the 1937-38 engines either with the ’32 bolt on parts or the 1937-38 parts which would give you an additional 20 hp. I wouldn’t spend time on the 1933-36 (babbitt) engines. Later flat heads will work with slight modifications/parts. …and now for don’t do it. You are changing your car from “wow it’s even has the original engine (vertical pet cocks)”, to “it’s got the wrong engine”. I would hold out for a backup ’32 engine if you feel it is necessary to have one. You could probably get a backup ’32 engine for what it would cost to rebuild and install a later engine. Maybe even consider a later engine instead of the ’32 under the bench as a backup. As an interesting aside the 21 stud engine in my ’37 coupe was built by the British military and eventually sold as surplus to Joe Mac of Ford Parts Obsolete in Los Angeles during the sixties. One final thought, be sure to check with your insurance agent about installing a later engine.

Charlie Stephens

Tom Walker · 12-01-2012, 06:05 PM

Good advice thank you. It reminds me of when I rang the agent to tell him I'd put my OHV Model A engine in the old chain drive GN. Mind you he wasnt as pissed off as the guy in the AC!

Capn John · 12-02-2012, 03:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary-UK

59a style will go straight in but will involve a bit of work on rad hoses. Inlets are lower on front of block, but there are various ways to overcome that.
.

Do you need to make a new FRONT motor mount or will the ones on the 59a work??

Gary-UK · 12-02-2012, 08:48 AM

I hear what you are saying but my observation is based on the fact that 32 mounts would be to hand, as in the case of the question by the thread starter. In that case you just bolt the 32 mounts to the block and cut the redundant mounting lugs off the later water pumps., Which is what I have done. Saves welding on the frame if its painted etc.

If you don't have original 32 mounts and wanted to use the 59a mounts then yes you would have to put mounts on the frame rails.

Mart · 12-02-2012, 09:37 AM

Because of the lower positioning of the water pumps, if you use the 32 style mounts on a later motor you have to trim the web for fanbelt clearance. Probably better to make some copies and save the originals.

Mart.

Mart.

Tom Walker · 12-02-2012, 11:14 AM

I definitely do not want to cut the frame. Making engine mounts is relatively easy.

I want to retain the pumps in the heads, and my current heads are not 32 so I could use them but I love the Eddie Meyer heads. They would be my ideal, with an Isky 88 cam. Also I don't have original intake or carb, so can use them too.

I will lighten the flywheel in my lathe, but want to find a light clutch. Is there a good Borg and Beck that will do the job?

Thanks,

Tom.

Charlie Stephens · 12-02-2012, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom Walker

I definitely do not want to cut the frame. Making engine mounts is relatively easy.

I want to retain the pumps in the heads, and my current heads are not 32 so I could use them but I love the Eddie Meyer heads. They would be my ideal, with an Isky 88 cam. Also I don't have original intake or carb, so can use them too.

I will lighten the flywheel in my lathe, but want to find a light clutch. Is there a good Borg and Beck that will do the job?

Thanks,

Tom.

Another thing to keep in mind is that speed and engine dress up equipment is more expensive for a 21 stud than for a 24 stud.

Charlie Stephens

Brian · 12-03-2012, 01:41 AM

Another thing to keep in mind is that speed and engine dress up equipment is more expensive for a 21 stud than for a 24 stud.

Yes, but infinitely more satisfying when that 21 stud eats the big 24 stud!

Brian · 12-03-2012, 01:45 AM

I will lighten the flywheel in my lathe, but want to find a light clutch

Advertise on here for a 9" Auburn pressure plate. Old time rodders favourite, and with good reason.

Rowdy · 12-03-2012, 01:49 AM

Do you have pic's of one of these?? Just curous as I have a bunch of vintage pressure plates that I have no clue what they are off of. Some simular to the smaller falthead pressure plates, but slightly smaller and several holes that appear to be just to trim off weight. Thanks Rod

12-01-2012, 03:27 AM	#1
Tom Walker Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Leicester. UK Posts: 404	Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? I have the option to take out my original 32 engine, to preserve it. So I would need to look for a block that would drop straight into a 32 chassis. Assume I would use "pump in head" heads, and I need to think about bolting to the transmission as well. Please advise as to which block I should be looking for. Thanks, Tom.

12-01-2012, 04:33 AM	#2
Mart Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Solihull, England. Posts: 8,755	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? Not quite sure why you would want to do it, but any block 32-48 will virtually bolt right in. Post 36 will not be pump in head, though. Normally this side of the pond it doesn't take too long for a 21stud Pilot/military motor to turn up, and you can either go over to pump in block (Pilot style) or fit blanking plates and run pump in head heads, but they must be for domed pistons. (or you could swap pistons). Better still would be a nice running 59A style motor, 239 cu in or bigger if bored and a 4" crank fitted. Lots of cars have had the wrong engine fitted over the years, if yours has the right one, that's a big plus for your car. Mart.

12-01-2012, 04:34 AM	#3
Gary-UK Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Parkgate, England Posts: 106	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? Tom assume you want keep it looking stock looking hence the pump in heads? If so then any later pump in head engine up to 36. The 37 was 21 stud but the heads had the outlets in the centre of the heads and the pumps on the front of the block like later engines. You can use this block and fit pump in head heads and block off the block pumps with a simple plate. These blocks come in two types, the USA style with full floating rod bearings and the English pilot engine which has insert rod bearings, not Babbitt. So apart from the benifit of an easier rebuild, with this block you also get dome topped pistons with a higher compression. As regards bolting in to your frame, it will go straight in and use the same front mounts. The only other thing to keep in mind is if you use a pilot assembly and keep the flywheel then you will need the matching starter as the USA/UK ring gears were different. This is just a brief summary really but I have done the exact same thing on my 3w. *typing same time as mart!

12-01-2012, 06:15 AM	#4
Tom Walker Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Leicester. UK Posts: 404	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? Thanks Guys, that is very useful. Mart, nothing is cut and dried, I am just aware of how rare my 32 block is, and if i want to warm things up a bit, would rather modify a less valuable block. I am wary of porting the orig block and carving into a water passage! Same goes for the rear end. If I go ahead and fit the Columbia, I think I will be better changing the whole back axle and torque tube, and put my original on the shelf. That way yr not spoiling the bits if I want to ever sell it as bog standard/original. Will a 59A drop straight in? Last edited by Tom Walker; 12-01-2012 at 06:19 AM. Reason: .

12-01-2012, 06:45 AM	#5
chuck stevens Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: upstate new york Posts: 758	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? Tom I know the shipping is a "killer", but I have several 59a 24 bolt blocks, and a good supply of the 8BA 49 -53 blocks. They are good rebuild-able blocks- no cracks. Just a thought, good luck Chuck.

12-01-2012, 07:19 AM	#6
Gary-UK Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Parkgate, England Posts: 106	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) 59a style will go straight in but will involve a bit of work on rad hoses. Inlets are lower on front of block, but there are various ways to overcome that. Some of the later mercury engines won't go straight in as the crank pulley fouls the crossmember. All flathead blocks have the tapped holes on the front for 32 mounts.

12-01-2012, 09:14 AM	#7
Richard Wilson Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: NC Posts: 908	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? I had similar thoughts as you about removing the original V-8 from my low mileage 1932 coupe to preserve it. I was lucky enough to find another original 1932 engine that had just been rebuilt. Now I have the best of both worlds. My replacement engine came from a 1932 that had the engine replaced with a 1935 engine. The guy used 1932 heads and pumps on the 1935 engine.

12-01-2012, 09:32 AM	#8
Tom Walker Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Leicester. UK Posts: 404	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? Thanks, and heres another one...will any flathead block fit any V8 transmission?

12-01-2012, 09:39 AM	#9
Rowdy BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: Gothenburg Nebraska Just off I-80 Posts: 4,893	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? Yes any 32-48 transmission will fit also, but 1940 and later tranmissions for passenger cars are side loaders. Pickup transmissions up to 1952 are top loaders. Rod __________________ Do the RIGHT thing - Support the H.A.M.B. Alliance!!!!

12-01-2012, 12:09 PM	#10
Charlie Stephens Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Southern California Posts: 7,033	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? First “it is easy”, second “don’t do it”. The 21 stud engine short blocks through 1938 will drop right into your car. The holes for the motor mounts are there and the transmission bolts right up. I say short blocks since you need to be careful about using domed pistons on heads designed for flat top pistons. With the correct pistons your '32 parts will bolt right onto the later engine. Ford actually made a plate to block off the water pumps location on the front of the ’37-’38 engines. These frequently show up on EBAY but are easy to make. Probably the best choice, and most expensive is the 1936 block with insert bearings (referred to as the “LB” block) as it has insert bearings and looks most like the original engine. Note some 1936 engines were babbitt and some were inserts. My second choice would be the 1937-38 engines either with the ’32 bolt on parts or the 1937-38 parts which would give you an additional 20 hp. I wouldn’t spend time on the 1933-36 (babbitt) engines. Later flat heads will work with slight modifications/parts. …and now for don’t do it. You are changing your car from “wow it’s even has the original engine (vertical pet cocks)”, to “it’s got the wrong engine”. I would hold out for a backup ’32 engine if you feel it is necessary to have one. You could probably get a backup ’32 engine for what it would cost to rebuild and install a later engine. Maybe even consider a later engine instead of the ’32 under the bench as a backup. As an interesting aside the 21 stud engine in my ’37 coupe was built by the British military and eventually sold as surplus to Joe Mac of Ford Parts Obsolete in Los Angeles during the sixties. One final thought, be sure to check with your insurance agent about installing a later engine. Charlie Stephens

12-02-2012, 08:48 AM	#13
Gary-UK Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Parkgate, England Posts: 106	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? I hear what you are saying but my observation is based on the fact that 32 mounts would be to hand, as in the case of the question by the thread starter. In that case you just bolt the 32 mounts to the block and cut the redundant mounting lugs off the later water pumps., Which is what I have done. Saves welding on the frame if its painted etc. If you don't have original 32 mounts and wanted to use the 59a mounts then yes you would have to put mounts on the frame rails. Last edited by Gary-UK; 12-02-2012 at 09:15 AM.

12-02-2012, 09:37 AM	#14
Mart Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Solihull, England. Posts: 8,755	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? Because of the lower positioning of the water pumps, if you use the 32 style mounts on a later motor you have to trim the web for fanbelt clearance. Probably better to make some copies and save the originals. Mart. Mart.

12-02-2012, 11:14 AM	#15
Tom Walker Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Leicester. UK Posts: 404	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? I definitely do not want to cut the frame. Making engine mounts is relatively easy. I want to retain the pumps in the heads, and my current heads are not 32 so I could use them but I love the Eddie Meyer heads. They would be my ideal, with an Isky 88 cam. Also I don't have original intake or carb, so can use them too. I will lighten the flywheel in my lathe, but want to find a light clutch. Is there a good Borg and Beck that will do the job? Thanks, Tom.

12-03-2012, 01:41 AM	#17
Brian Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Masterton, New Zealand Posts: 3,834	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? Another thing to keep in mind is that speed and engine dress up equipment is more expensive for a 21 stud than for a 24 stud. Yes, but infinitely more satisfying when that 21 stud eats the big 24 stud!

12-03-2012, 01:45 AM	#18
Brian Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Masterton, New Zealand Posts: 3,834	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? I will lighten the flywheel in my lathe, but want to find a light clutch Advertise on here for a 9" Auburn pressure plate. Old time rodders favourite, and with good reason.

12-03-2012, 01:49 AM	#19
Rowdy BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: Gothenburg Nebraska Just off I-80 Posts: 4,893	Re: Which blocks will fit my 32 chassis? Do you have pic's of one of these?? Just curous as I have a bunch of vintage pressure plates that I have no clue what they are off of. Some simular to the smaller falthead pressure plates, but slightly smaller and several holes that appear to be just to trim off weight. Thanks Rod __________________ Do the RIGHT thing - Support the H.A.M.B. Alliance!!!!