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Old 07-30-2020, 08:32 AM   #1
Richard Lorenz
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Default Manifold Gland Rings

These are the rings that go between the block and the manifolds. What experience or recommendations do you have?
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Old 07-30-2020, 09:04 AM   #2
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

I use them to help with alignment of the manifold to the block. If you cannot make them line up, its usually a sign of a warped manifold.
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Old 07-30-2020, 09:06 AM   #3
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

Over time, the rear of the exhaust manifold tends to droop downward due to the weight of the muffler pulling down on it while the manifold is near red-hot. The holes in the manifold and the exhaust ports in the block get out of alignment, and you can't use the gland rings any longer. It seems to work ok with just the gasket if you have the manifolds faces trued up with a mill.
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Old 07-30-2020, 09:58 AM   #4
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

If you're going to put them in, check the width of the rings and the depth of the openings, to be sure that when they're in the gasket will be compressed to make a good seal.
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Old 07-30-2020, 12:25 PM   #5
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

They sometimes migrate to your muffler resulting in a new rattle.
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Old 07-30-2020, 12:42 PM   #6
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

Quote:
Originally Posted by katy View Post
If you're going to put them in, check the width of the rings and the depth of the openings, to be sure that when they're in the gasket will be compressed to make a good seal.
X2 If they fit they are worth using.
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Old 07-30-2020, 12:56 PM   #7
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

Watch this.https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ylGWKvNvbmU
Should cover most of your concerns.
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Old 07-30-2020, 01:52 PM   #8
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Question Re: Manifold Gland Rings

Last muffle change on my roadster. I found "7" gland rings rattling around
in the old muffler! The gland rings that the parts houses sell and I use. Are not the proper dimensions and are more of a generic better than nothing replacement. I believe the Judging Standards give what the proper size and make up of the original rings are. Is anybody making correct gland rings?


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Old 07-30-2020, 05:28 PM   #9
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

I have found that the "nothing" option works really well. After buying the rings I got fed up with trying to make them fit and decided not to use them. No problems so far.
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Old 07-30-2020, 05:52 PM   #10
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

Forget the repro gland rings and get copper manifold gaskets from Bert's. Part A-9448-D Made in USA!
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Old 07-30-2020, 07:56 PM   #11
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

I have used these copper gaskets with the glands built in from MAC's. Part #: 28-24825-1
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Old 07-30-2020, 09:16 PM   #12
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

Except for a short time in I think 1930 (and then on only a few engines) all Model A engines used them. If Ford did not think they were important he would not have used them. all the engines we do get them if they are ported for them.
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Old 07-30-2020, 10:51 PM   #13
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

Ford only used them in 1928. They are worthless in my opinion. Been fixing and driving Model A’s my whole life and never used them or needed them
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Old 07-30-2020, 11:03 PM   #14
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

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Originally Posted by SteveB31 View Post
Ford only used them in 1928. They are worthless in my opinion. Been fixing and driving Model As my whole life and never used them or needed them
I agree -found they made the job harder. Decent copper crush gaskets and clean milled faces and the jobs done
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Old 07-31-2020, 09:43 AM   #15
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

If Ford only used then in 1928 then why are all the blocks and exhaust manifolds machined for them?
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Old 07-31-2020, 09:52 AM   #16
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

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Originally Posted by redmodelt View Post
Except for a short time in I think 1930 (and then on only a few engines) all Model A engines used them. If Ford did not think they were important he would not have used them. all the engines we do get them if they are ported for them.
Quote:
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Ford only used them in 1928. They are worthless in my opinion. Been fixing and driving Model A’s my whole life and never used them or needed them
Quote:
Originally Posted by redmodelt View Post
If Ford only used then in 1928 then why are all the blocks and exhaust manifolds machined for them?
I have heard the same as redmodelt. And redmodelt makes a valid point. Why did they continue to machine the blocks and manifolds if only used in 1928?
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Old 07-31-2020, 09:56 AM   #17
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

I love reading all the comments from the experts and how one tells you to use them and someone tells you they are not needed! ❤️ it!
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Old 07-31-2020, 10:03 AM   #18
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

The original purpose of the gland rings, that are used only in the exhaust ports, is to prevent burnout of the manifold gaskets. The rings expand, so they need to have 1/16th gap when installed. If no gap, the rings will buckle and windup in the ports.
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Old 07-31-2020, 10:08 AM   #19
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

I have had some gland rings to end up in the muffler , that's why I quit using them .
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Old 07-31-2020, 11:05 AM   #20
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

We could possibly distinguish here between "are gland rings needed" and "are gland rings helpful." My understanding is that they're helpful in preventing manifold drop and damage to the gasket from high-temp gases. However, if it is difficult or impractical to procure gland rings that are the correct size, or if the manifold has previously been resurfaced, such that there is no longer sufficient depth to permit the rings to be installed correctly, the benefit provided by the rings may not be enough to justify the cost of modifying the manifold/block or hunting for rings that are the correct size.
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Old 07-31-2020, 12:06 PM   #21
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveB31 View Post
Ford only used them in 1928.
From Bratton's on-line catalog; The 4 rings that seat into the manifold and block to prevent leaks. Ford discontinued using these for a brief time in early 1929. If the manifold or block has been resurfaced, the width of the gland rings will need to be reduced by the same amount.
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Old 07-31-2020, 04:03 PM   #22
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

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Originally Posted by fredski53 View Post
I love reading all the comments from the experts and how one tells you to use them and someone tells you they are not needed! ❤️ it!
Yeah, I am definitely not an expert but I AM staying out of this one even though my opinion aligns with what has been stated above!
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Old 07-31-2020, 07:06 PM   #23
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

The "Green book" show 1928 to 1934 with a B part number. As of it's printing in 1948 they had been discontinued being supplied thru Ford.

Ruth thank you for the correction on the year.
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Old 08-01-2020, 10:29 AM   #24
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

If gland rings are not used it will usually just be a matter of time before the exhaust manifold will begin to sag at the rear and need replacement . I'm fixing to install a new exhaust manifold on our roadster . From now on , I will use gland rings .
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Old 08-01-2020, 07:20 PM   #25
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

New exhaust manifold..use the rings. Old manifold..maybe not. Particularly if it has been milled, etc. The engine block side will be deep enough, old manifold, maybe not.

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Old 08-02-2020, 09:42 AM   #26
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

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Originally Posted by Brian in Wheeling View Post
New exhaust manifold..use the rings. Old manifold..maybe not. Particularly if it has been milled, etc. The engine block side will be deep enough, old manifold, maybe not.

Brian W.
The rings could be skinnied town to compensate.
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Old 08-02-2020, 10:00 AM   #27
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

Here is a third recommendation from a third vendor.

A9440 GLAND RINGS
THESE RINGS GO IN THE EXHAUST PORTS TO HELP WITH MANIFOLD GASKET LEAKAGE. WE RECOMMEND THAT ONLY THE 1ST AND 4TH HAVE THESE INSTALLED

Units per Quanitity ( Set )

In Stock
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Old 08-03-2020, 07:57 AM   #28
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

The timing for this thread couldn't be better. I'm was just in the process of reassembly when this thread started. Didn't even know "gland rings" were a thing. Since my manifolds are new (400 miles on them), and after reading all the comments, I decided that these rings are a good idea so I made some up on my lathe. Henry Ford wasn''t one to spend money where it wasn't necessary so if he thought they were not needed, he wouldn't have included them. Plus, the concept seems sound to me. Time will tell I suppose but pretty easy to remove if, for some reason they don't pan out. The reports of them ending up in the muffler are baffling to me. Unless they had a WAY too big of gap, it doesn't seem possible for them to come out that I can see. I WAS going to just make them solid with a snug fit but decided to make them a few thou oversize and cut them with a hacksaw to give me a little flex for ease of install and still have a snug fit. Ended up with about a .0010 gap. I read somewhere that without a gap (1/16" IIRC) they will expand and buckle and end up in the port. I'm not so sure about that since it seems to me that any pressure would be equal (due too them being round) and if they DO buckle it would be at the gap. If this happens, I can always make new ones, either with more gap for expansion or no gap (Make them a snug fit without cutting them). Anyway, thanks to the OP for starting the thread and thanks to all that responded.
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Old 08-03-2020, 08:58 AM   #29
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

I suspect someone here has the Ford drawings/specs.
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Old 08-03-2020, 09:00 AM   #30
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

I'm with Steve Becker..no modern application uses them.If your worried about your manifold drooping you need to rethink your priorities,that shouldn't even register on the list of worries driving a model a..

high temperature silicone sealant will help those with manifolds that aren't perfectly flat,tightening the nuts a few times,like torquing a head after a head gasket replacement, helps too.
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Old 08-03-2020, 09:40 AM   #31
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

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Originally Posted by Jack Shaft View Post
I'm with Steve Becker..no modern application uses them.
I can think of no modern application where 4 bolts hold both the exhaust and intake manifolds in the center and leave the end (with no support) to hold up the weight of the muffler and pipe.

And where did Steve state that "no modern application uses them".
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Old 08-03-2020, 09:42 AM   #32
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

"I'm with Steve Becker..no modern application uses them.If your worried about your manifold drooping"

Steve said Ford only used them in 1928. Modern applications used more bolts/studs through holes in the castings, not 4 studs and washers to support both manifolds leaving the tail end of the exhaust manifold more or less hanging.
If there is something in the Service Bulletins or the archives about them not being used after X date between 1927 to 1934, besides the info later in the 1948 Green Book, that would be different story.



Re the rings found in the exhaust pipe; there were some poor copies made years back that just kinda rolled themselves into a ball when got hot and dropped down in.
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Old 08-03-2020, 09:42 AM   #33
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

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Originally Posted by Jack Shaft View Post
I'm with Steve Becker..no modern application uses them.
If that were true, why is my brand new manifold ported for them?.

Quote:
If your worried about your manifold drooping you need to rethink your priorities,
Putting the rings on a "priority" list would suggest that there is a BETTER reason to NOT use them. Even if you don't believe there is an upside to using them, what would be the down side to using them?.

Quote:
that shouldn't even register on the list of worries driving a model a..
Again, what's the downside. What am I missing??.

Quote:
high temperature silicone sealant will help those with manifolds that aren't perfectly flat,tightening the nuts a few times,like torquing a head after a head gasket replacement, helps too.
In my case, my manifolds are dead flat, retorqueing the nuts is just good practice for anything that goes through heat cycles IMO and silicone is a bandaid solution. It was not a big deal to make and install them and I am not aware of any downside to use them so, unless I am missing something (entirely possible) I don't understand the objection. Of course, after I run it for awhile perhaps I may, that remains to be seen but so far I haven't seen anything posted that would suggest that it's a BAD idea.
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Old 08-03-2020, 10:23 AM   #34
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Default Re: Manifold Gland Rings

Easy boys its just my opinion,I tolerate yours...the gland ring does not increase clamping force,it holds alignment.Droop is an issue? Sure, but not a major issue

Silicone is a modern solution to many issues with early
engines if used correctly.

One of the reasons I raised compression,added fuel,run a header and use a mechanical advance distributor is increased efficiency, my engine and exhaust run cooler than a stock engine.A cooler exhaust doesn't burn gaskets or warp.

Last edited by Jack Shaft; 08-03-2020 at 11:21 AM.
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Old 08-03-2020, 11:17 AM   #35
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Easy boys its just my opinion,I tolerate yours...
Don't misunderstand. I wasn't offended or meant any offence. Just asking for clarification on your statements.

Quote:
the gland ring does not increase clamping force,it holds alignment.Droop is an issue? Sure, but not a major issue
I don't think anyone was suggesting that they increase clamping force, in fact, if anything they may hinder it. While the "drooping" may be an issue, to my way of thinking, they afford a steel barrier keeping heat/flame away from the gasket and should help with gasket longevity especially when the lack of adequate clamping points is considered. there really should be a mounting stud on the outside of the two outer exhaust ports IMO.

Quote:
Silicone is a modern solution to many issues with early engines if used correctly
Absolutely but to remedy a warped manifold is, IMO a bandaid solution. Not saying I've never done it, I have (not on a model A) but resurfacing the manifold is the proper solution IMO. If I gave the impression that I was/am being hostile in any way, I apologize. It certainly his NOT the case. I don't only tolerate your opinions (as well as others) I appreciate them even when/if I may not agree.
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