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Old 06-22-2020, 08:42 PM   #81
Zeke3
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Default Re: 1951 Ford overdrive

Very nice looking Victoria.
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Old 06-22-2020, 09:12 PM   #82
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I think the Victoria is by far he best looking of all the "shoeboxes". I really wanted one and looked for one for several years. In the end, I ended up settling for a Club Coupe.
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Old 06-29-2020, 07:00 AM   #83
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Well the beast is out. Now for the teardown. I have recently had a very helpful private message and subsequent phone conversation with a member who has repaired these transmissions for 20 years. It is his feeling that the failure of the OD to engage is due to the balk ring being improperly positioned. I will provide follow-up information as I have it. Thanks to all who have provided advice and help.
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Old 06-29-2020, 07:33 AM   #84
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Great! I'm very interested to see what you find and hope you get it resolved soon. Ken
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Old 06-29-2020, 11:04 AM   #85
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I too am interested in how your repair goes. I have a 52 setup out of the car. The wiring and electrical parts work. I would be interested to know any transmission tests that can be done before reinstalling into the car. With transmissions, I have always figured they can't be tested other than checking bearings and running through the gears manually. The OD adds a level of complication.
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Old 06-30-2020, 01:02 PM   #86
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Default Re: 1951 Ford overdrive

This is what I have found so far. I am not sure about the balk ring tension yet.
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Old 06-30-2020, 07:18 PM   #87
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Default Re: 1951 Ford overdrive

See that notch in the upper middle of the picture. The pawl is supposed to engage in that. Try turning it to see if it moves. What the balk ring does is slows it down enough to engage the overdrive. I may be wrong it's been a while since I too one apart.
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Old 06-30-2020, 09:13 PM   #88
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Default Re: 1951 Ford overdrive

I have a real soft spot for the 51 vickies as that was my first car. It was a blue/green color with a white top...lots of memories.
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Old 06-30-2020, 09:16 PM   #89
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I think several of us are breathlessly waiting for the next episode!
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Old 07-01-2020, 10:13 AM   #90
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In the above picture it appears that the balk ring is significantly abraded. The shot today is after cleaning off much of the lubricant. What appeared to be scoring was apparently due to the lighting and streaking of the grease. Today's picture shows the ring and gear after some cleaning. I did test the balk ring with a kitchen scale and to get movement of the two ends towards each other required at least 10 pounds ( the scale maxed out; and I heard my wife approaching). moving the ends apart was very easy. I made this check after cleaning the part with carburetor cleaner which may have contributed to the excessive drag. i'll try repeating the test after applying some lubrication. The other picture shows what is in fact some abrasion of the governor/ speedometer drive gear. I am hoping that this can be cleaned up with a file. I'm also not sure whether this is a recent issue or preexisted the last rebuild.
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Old 07-01-2020, 02:04 PM   #91
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The answer!!

With the very patient help of fellow Ford Barn member Gary Duff the problem has been solved. With the stationary gear plate removed and the solenoid , pawl and sun gear in place and the solenoid energized the pawl moves to the first notch on the balk ring. While maintaining electrical connection and the with the sun gear being rotated clockwise, the pawl drops into the deeper notch on the balk gear. When the adapter plate was put in place with the large snap ring and the above procedure repeated, the pawl would not fully engage. The attached pictures show the area of binding on the backside of the adapter plate.
There is a ridge which is catching and preventing the pawl from fully engaging. I will do some judicious filing to eliminate the problem. I will do a followup post when that is finished and the system is working properly. Again I thank everyone for their help with a very special thanks to Gary.
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Old 07-02-2020, 11:00 AM   #92
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Default Re: 1951 Ford overdrive

The plate and trough assembly appears to have some significant wear there. I think I'd consider replacing that to maintain clearances on the output shaft.
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Old 07-02-2020, 03:36 PM   #93
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I have a replacement coming. Thanks for the advice.
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Old 07-04-2020, 01:42 PM   #94
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Default Re: 1951 Ford overdrive

The replacement plate and trough is in place. When there is no power supplied to the solenoid, the solenoid plunger is fully retracted and the pawl disengaged. Applying power to the number 4 terminal on the solenoid results in the pawl moving about an 1/8" into the upper slot on the balk ring. With the power continuing to be supplied to the solenoid, the output shaft is turned clockwise, the pawl travels a further 3/8", fully engaging the balk gear. It was the ridge worn into the original plate which "caught " the pawl and was prevented its full travel.

Incidentally, it was Gary Duff who walked me through the above steps and also mentioned that the balk ring used by Ford was modified to prevent it from becoming improperly aligned . Because of this modification, the steps outlined in the Borg Warner manual to realign the ring without removing the transmission ( which I tried unsuccessfully) will not work on the Ford transmission. I hope this information will be helpful to others. Thanks again to everyone who has offered advice on this issue.
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Old 07-04-2020, 02:39 PM   #95
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Default Re: 1951 Ford overdrive

Thank YOU for keeping us in the loop! Let us know when it is back in the car and operating.
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Old 07-04-2020, 05:22 PM   #96
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Will do. I have learned a lot from other's posts on various subjects. I'm disappointed when a thread just ends without resolution. Like a good book without the last few chapters.
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Old 07-04-2020, 06:07 PM   #97
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Default Re: 1951 Ford overdrive

Laserman: I'm following this, too. Do you suppose that was just wear from a hard used transmission, or maybe started with a defect?
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Old 07-05-2020, 06:35 AM   #98
mrlaser
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It appears to be a groove worn into the surface rather than a manufacturing defect. I purchased the car in 2003 and the OD wasn't working at that time. I also plan to replace the speedometer gear and I have a replacement.
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Old 07-05-2020, 07:30 AM   #99
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Default Re: 1951 Ford overdrive

The 1951 version of the transmission has no lockout switch, in contrast to the 49/50 circuit. I wonder if operating the transmission in the locked out mode (with the solenoid trying to engage but mechanically restricted from doing so) can cause this kind of wear?
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Old 07-05-2020, 09:17 AM   #100
mrlaser
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Default Re: 1951 Ford overdrive

I don't know what caused the "gouging" The plate is hardened steel so whatever caused it probably took some time.

As long as I am typing, I have two additional questions. 1. Is the drain plug for the transmission 1" npt? 2. I am also having real difficulty removing the snap ring which holds the speedometer gear in place. I have tried several types of USA made snap ring tools without success. Only one side of the ring moves and not enough to begin to move it up on the output shaft. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
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