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Old 03-11-2020, 03:39 PM   #21
Merc Cruzer
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

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Originally Posted by KGS View Post
Do you mean hydraulic instead of vacuum?
Good catch, you are correct, they were hydraulic and not vacuum. That's what I get for reading the Motors Manual on electric, hydraulic and vacuum power tops, prior to my post. I need to disengage before shifting.

Last edited by Merc Cruzer; 03-11-2020 at 03:48 PM.
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Old 03-14-2020, 12:42 AM   #22
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

Many thanks 41Ford1 and Supereal for the scans.

I have attached the schematic I got from Supereal via PM to go with the 41Ford1 scans

I hope this is OK, someone (poor intrepid 41 convert owner) may find this useful in the future.

Thanks again Barners!
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Old 03-14-2020, 12:49 AM   #23
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

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Just wondering, in 53', the Mercury used two screw jacks and a single motor. How similar were the systems?
From what I can see, the systems looks very similar, but the 41 has two motors of course. What threw me was that the system installed in my car has no relays, just a large multi pole switch.
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Old 03-14-2020, 05:33 AM   #24
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

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Old 03-14-2020, 01:25 PM   #25
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

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From what I can see, the systems looks very similar, but the 41 has two motors of course. What threw me was that the system installed in my car has no relays, just a large multi pole switch.

I can assure you that there are no relays in the original '41 electric lift system.
The '41 system in my '36 is a dead stock unit, all of the wires are still contained within the original fabric covered loom.
None of the original wires have ever been removed/disturbed from the original Ford switch.
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Old 03-14-2020, 03:15 PM   #26
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

I hate to be argumentative, but how do you justify using an obviously modified system to justify how a "stock" system was configured.

You may be right, but there is no basis for your statement in actual fact. This is how "Urban Legends" get started.
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Old 03-15-2020, 02:39 AM   #27
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

The autolite spec sheet rates the motors as 2 oz.ft, 4000-5000 RPM and 29-34 amps each on 6v.

This is probably full load or locked rotor current, but the system is pulling a lot for a simple switch. I have a simple switch BTW. There were a lot of running changes to the 41 over the model year. It wouldn't surprise me if having relays or not was one of them.

I tried to measure the total current, but my cheapo 快乐的幸运公鸡 (Ghong Whah Happy Lucky Rooster Brand - TM) meter got Alzheimer's at 15A and went on holiday. I should have kept my old AVO-8

I'm trying to size a voltage drop resistor for a 12V conversion. The motors will probably be OK on 12V due to their short duty, but if I fry them, I'm in a world of expense.

Last edited by fortyonerag; 03-15-2020 at 06:21 AM.
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Old 03-15-2020, 09:43 AM   #28
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

Do you have a picture of the motors and how they attach? If they are the configuration I think they might be, a 12 volt window motor, from a mid 50's car might be able to be adapted, if you are gong 12 volt conversion.

Otherwise, you are right, the 6 volt motors will be expensive and had to find. I was lucky to find another one for my car a while back. It just sits in a box, waiting to be used. My theory is that if you have a back up you will never need it, but is you don't....
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Old 03-16-2020, 04:56 PM   #29
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

I'll get a pic in the next day or so. The 12V window motor is a good idea. I'll have to check the torque rating.

Many thanks.
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Old 03-17-2020, 12:43 PM   #30
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

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I hate to be argumentative, but how do you justify using an obviously modified system to justify how a "stock" system was configured.

You may be right, but there is no basis for your statement in actual fact. This is how "Urban Legends" get started.

I wonder, how do you interpret anything I said in my write-up that inferred the '41 system I used was "obviously modified"?


As a side-bar, many years ago someone tried to break into the trunk of my '36. It appeared that they used some kind of a pry bar, inserting the bar into the space between the lid and the body. A lot of damage was done to the body, put the lid did not come open. Amen for having the two '41 screw jacks attached to the lid and floor of the trunk.
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Old 03-17-2020, 02:47 PM   #31
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

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I wonder, how do you interpret anything I said in my write-up that inferred the '41 system I used was "obviously modified"?
A '41 system used in a '36 car is not a modification? I sure hope you're not a judge at any V8 meets i attend (or for any our venues as well).
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Old 04-01-2020, 11:06 PM   #32
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

OK, lets see how good my memory is (it's been a while since I have done any electrical figgerin').

As I said earlier, I'm looking to do a12V conversion and don't want to damage the 6V top motors. They should be OK on 12V given the short duty cycle, but I'm risk averse and it could get expensive If I damage them.

Using a DC current clamp meter, I get a reading of 27A for both motors when the top is commencing to rise. I'll call this Full Load current. When lowering the top, I get a reading of 19A for both motors - I'll call this low load.

Ohm's Law specifies: Resistance=Volts/Amps so if I want a 6V drop:

Full load R= 6/27 = 0.22 Ohm resistor.

Low load R= 6/22 = 0.27 Ohm resistor

I'll assume a 0.25 Ohm resistor which should give me anywhere between 5.25V at the motors on full load and 6.5V at the motors at low load.

So, a 0.25 Ohm resistor should do it?

What power rating? Ohms Law specifies Power = Current squared X Resistor, so:

Full load Power = 27X27X0.25 = 182W. The resistor is going to get 'real warm'.

If I parallel two 0.5 Ohm resistors I get 0.25 Ohm. Each will share the power so will dissipate 91W of heat each.

If I parallel two 0.5 Ohm 200W resistors I should be OK?

What say you? I'm a little rusty, so if anyone can run a flinty eye over these numbers I'd appreciate it.

Last edited by fortyonerag; 04-02-2020 at 01:08 AM.
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Old 04-03-2020, 08:21 PM   #33
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

Nothing to say, huh?




C'mon, spill

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Old 04-04-2020, 10:01 AM   #34
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

Your numbers look OK. I would make a vented enclosure for the resistors, They will get hot.
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Old 04-04-2020, 06:18 PM   #35
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Default Re: Electrical schematic request - 41 Convt. electric top

Many thanks
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