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Old 11-22-2010, 01:38 AM   #1
Lowsquire
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Default repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

I have been warned off the sleeves sold by various parts houses to do this job, so I went to my local bearing supply, and couldnt find an equivalent roller bearing inner sleeve size. the closest I got was a 2 1/16 "dia outer but it is only 1.5" long, not 2 1/4 " as required.

two Questions..

has anyone used the sleeves available thru Macs, etc? are they properly made and hardened?

If there is anyone who has deciphered a bearing part no. to these parts so i could order a reputable bearing locally,could you let me know it?

Its Kinda hard down here to get this stuff, and ordering just a pair of the sleeves from America gets expensive.
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Old 11-22-2010, 02:06 AM   #2
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Go to one of the heat treatment places in Melb,ask them to recomed a machine shop to make the sleaves from the type of material they would recomend,have the machine shop turn up the sleaves get them heat treated ,get the machine shop to fit them ,then get them to grind to the original size.
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Old 11-22-2010, 03:19 AM   #3
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Thanks Lawrie, but that is a very expensive method, compared to finding the correct size, already hardened part and just turning the bearing faces down to a press fit. this is why I want to find if an inner bearing sleeve 2.0625 " OD and 2.250" long exists.The ID isnt as important, but will probably be 1.750" or 1.8125".

Has anyone in the States used the available sleeves, and had good luck with them?
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Old 11-22-2010, 03:57 AM   #4
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

I have just had a pair done like Lawrie suggests, nice job...$600.00 NZ.
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Old 11-22-2010, 04:14 AM   #5
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

yep I'd imagine that would be close to what I would pay here..

just trying to get better value for money..This diff will hit close to five grand if Im not savvy here and there..(its a Columbia)
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Old 11-22-2010, 06:15 AM   #6
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

I had this done to a '48 rear here in the US. I think it cost me about $400 US with the sleeves (C & G,) annealing (myself,) turning, grinding, pressing on (long threaded rod, myself.) I SHOULD HAVE just swapped the bells left for right which would have put the worn surfaces on the top where there's no load and the good surfaces on the bottom where the load is, but I just couldn't bring myself to that.
PS: Car isn't on the road yet, so I can't say how good they are.
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Old 11-22-2010, 06:29 AM   #7
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Sleeves are listed at about $26-30 each on the various online vintage ford parts sites. I assume they all come from the one supplier.
wish I knew who.. or if they are just a standard catalog bearing part marked up heavily. This is the info I'm digging for.
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Old 11-22-2010, 06:35 AM   #8
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

I have used the Mac's journal repair sleeves you asked about. They worked ok. Not a simple job to install. The sleeves were a mile out of round and required some careful study to select a proper diameter to machine housings for the desired press fit. I am also of the opinion the wall is excessively thick which removes more material from the housing than I was happy with. I checked for straight, rough turned with carbide, finished with grinding wheel. If I do any in the future I will make the sleeves, as recommended above, rather than purchase those with the extra-thick wall. I will also do them in one operation in the crankshaft grinding machine rather than a lathe.
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Old 11-22-2010, 07:25 AM   #9
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Lawrie, Call Johnny Stooksbury 865-690-7585 eastern standard time. If you can call the US, he is the person to talk to, he is the master Columbia machine shop man. He has told me about having to be careful about where the sleaves come from and I do not remember what he said his source is.
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Old 11-22-2010, 08:42 AM   #10
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

John Connelly at Columbia Two Speed Parts did a couple for me. He has his own sleeves made to his specifications:

http://columbiatwospeedparts.com/default.aspx
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Old 11-22-2010, 08:46 AM   #11
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy View Post
John Connelly at Columbia Two Speed Parts did a couple for me. He has his own sleeves made to his specifications:

http://columbiatwospeedparts.com/default.aspx
I believe the Johnny Stooksbury gets his from John Connelly, too.
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Old 11-22-2010, 08:48 AM   #12
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

About 7 yr's ago I bought sleeves from Snyders Antique Auto for my Model A. I had my crank grinder man do them in his crank grinder and press them on. I don't remember what it cost but wasn't bad. I've put 15K miles on the car, seems fine. Walt
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Old 11-22-2010, 11:35 AM   #13
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

I did this job on my 1946 Lincoln (they have the same size hub, 2 1/16") . I bought the sleeves from Job Lot and had my local machine shop do the job for about $350. My concern was that nearly 1/4" of material has to be removed from the hub to press the sleeve on. I was concerned with the structual integrety of the remaining virgin metal on the hub. The car is nearly finished, but has not been on the road yet.
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Old 11-22-2010, 04:30 PM   #14
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Stupidly I didnt even think to ask John Connelly...of course he would make them himself. his parts are immaculate, I used his stuff to rebuild the Columbia.

Thanks all, It seems from pouring thru online catalogues, the standard bearing inner sleeve I seek isnt actually made, so Ill give John an email.

Thankyou everyone!
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Old 11-22-2010, 05:34 PM   #15
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

I've replaced mine with four sealed ball bearings 2 each side with a spacer between the bearings. Will take pictures of all the parts if anyone is interested in the mod. Much better and more permanent than the original roller bearing set-up.
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Old 11-22-2010, 07:27 PM   #16
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Sounds like some good new zealand ingenuity!

I would love to see this.

did you have to machine the hubs and axles to a stock bearing size?

what was the cost?
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Old 11-22-2010, 08:52 PM   #17
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

We had to:
Turn the axle housings down to the inside diameter of the 2 ball bearings.
Remove the hardened outer bearing from the hub.
Sleeve the hub down to the outside diameter of the ball bearings (very fine sleeve).
Fit two sealed bearings into each hub with spacers between etc.
The bearings, sleeve and spacers are are all held in place with the original hub seal retaining cir-clip. Get the idea?

No modifications to the axle are necessary.

This whole set-up keeps the drum running true and straight with no torsional stress placed on the axle. The engineer who undertook my work found that the alignment on some of the original ford roller bearing centreline to axle taper centreline can be seriously out of alignment and thus cause stress to the axle.

This mod can also make the car so much easier to push around the garage.

It might take a couple of days to get the photos posted, please be patient.
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Old 11-22-2010, 10:54 PM   #18
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

I like the thinking there.
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Old 11-23-2010, 01:22 AM   #19
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

I bought Macs sleeves and threw them away and made my ownand had them hardend.
Macs are WAY too thick for a sleeve.
You weaken the axle housing .

I like meric42s Idea a lot !
I will try that the next time.
Better design and storeboight bearrings.
Sounds like a good idea

Michael
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Old 11-23-2010, 03:58 AM   #20
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Meric42-

Add my name to the list of Fordbarners who are interested in this approach. If you can give us any relative information such as bearing, sleeve and axle hub diameter numbers you used. This would be very helpful. This seems like an idea that is long overdue!

Tom
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Old 11-23-2010, 06:22 AM   #21
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Sounds like a great way to go, especially if your needle roller bearings are toast as well, as they arent cheap either!
I would imagine a few minutes with a hub, and a vernier , and a good bearing catalogue would yield a workable combination..I think I need to ring some bearing Mfgs tommorow and get some catalogues sent out!
On This job I'll probably just use sleeves, as the bearings and outer races are perfect, but next one Ill try this out!
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Old 11-23-2010, 08:08 AM   #22
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

I too, would like to see the bearing mod.
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Old 11-24-2010, 12:19 PM   #23
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Since you are planing to have the housing machined, why not do the machining and convert to the newer ford axles. They sell kits to convert you housings to accept new slide in type ford axles with new bearings. You can also buy new housings already converted to new ford axles.

Hot rod works

Dick Spadaro
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Old 11-24-2010, 10:47 PM   #24
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

meric42,

Lets see those pictures/drawings of your bearing mod.

I'm getting impatient, sorry.
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Old 11-25-2010, 06:45 AM   #25
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Moore View Post
meric42,

Lets see those pictures/drawings of your bearing mod.

I'm getting impatient, sorry.
Ralph: Sorry for the delay! Here's a link to Hot Rod Works. They do this kind of work.

http://www.hotrodworks.com/

Go to the Catalog section, Axle Upgrades and then either for Early Fod Brakes OR Modern Brakes.
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Old 11-25-2010, 07:07 AM   #26
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

I had a pair of early 32 axles done and then went a different route. I would be glad to part with them for $ 300. + S&H kc
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Old 11-29-2010, 07:03 PM   #27
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Finally here are the pictures I promised, sorry for the delay.

In the first pic you can see the inner spacer held in place by the factory inner hub seal cir-clip and the two ball bearings between which is another spacer @ 1/2" wide. There is a third spacer identical to the inner spacer but fitted on the out side of the outer bearing. The second pic shows the inner seal cir-clip and the inner spacer and the third pic is a close-up of the inner/outer spacer

The width of the spacers is not particularly critical, the complete set-up should be sized to fill the space right out to the seal retaining clip grove. The inner hub seal is no longer required as sealed bearings are used and should require no further lubrication.

Remember the bearings used are only a loose fit into the hub so a thin sleeve is required between the outside of the bearing and the inside of the hub. I have used loctite on mine to secure the bearings and prevent movement in the hub.

I hope the above explanation is clear, if not then please feel free to ask any questions. If anyone is interested I may be able to supply the bearings and spacers in the form of a kit with full instructions, just let me know if interested and I will price up the parts.

Kind regards, Meric42
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Old 11-29-2010, 08:02 PM   #28
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Well, about time!

Thanks for that, of course now, it seems so simple!
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Old 11-29-2010, 08:17 PM   #29
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Thanks Meric42 for the pictures, I like it but it is to late for me now, if I do another banjo I would sure look at you solution.

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Old 11-29-2010, 08:22 PM   #30
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Wink Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Quote:
Originally Posted by X38 View Post
Well, about time!

Thanks for that, of course now, it seems so simple!
All good things take time, thanks for your patience.
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Old 11-29-2010, 08:31 PM   #31
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Used the races that Macs sell installed as instructed ie machined and a press fit. working quite well approx. 6000 miles no issues have machines buddy so lathe work was very reasonable he makes repairs like this for all types of machinery. this is probably just as strong as restubbing a large truck axle! Laurie
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Old 12-10-2010, 04:34 PM   #32
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Meric42,

Do you have the #'s for those bearings? How do these work out on the road? I mean have you put some miles on them and noticed any improvement?

Ralph
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Old 12-20-2010, 09:32 PM   #33
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

We use The 2 bearing system here quite a lot, it works well but there's still machining involved ,
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Old 12-20-2010, 11:50 PM   #34
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

pics please.

Fourdy
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Old 12-21-2010, 04:20 AM   #35
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Can someone that has done this twin bearing conversion be so kind as to quote the bearing numbers please??
Thanks.
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Old 12-21-2010, 03:21 PM   #36
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Sorry, I can't quote the numbers without removing my bearings and I cannot give personal report as I have not yet driven my car with this mod. However I can report that a friend of mine had the same mod done to his '33 3 window coupe in 1995 and has had no problem with it and he is really happy with the end result.

Hope this helps.

Seasons's Greetings to you all.
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Old 08-19-2013, 02:50 PM   #37
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

OK...just fired up the air compressor and blew the dust off this ole thread........anyone find a bearing number for this mod?

-Ron
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Old 08-23-2013, 08:57 PM   #38
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Some of you blokes worry too much.

The sleeves from Macs Etc are ok to use BUT you must have someone do the job who understands Limits and Fits. I think the reason that they make them thick is to accommodate those Backyarders who are not good machinists and use an old lathe to get the required size on the axle "close enough" and then press them on.
If the interference fit is excessive it puts a lot of tension in the sleeve and it will split if its not thick enough.

For those who worry about "weakening the axle housing" have a look at the cross sectional area of the wishbone extension where the front and rear springs attach, it would take just as much loading as the axle housing and you end up with still a lot more metal on the housing after turning /grinding them down.

Incidentally the housing should be turned and finally ground to give a suitably smooth and round surface to press the sleeves onto. Grinding produces a smooth surface while a lathe must always leave small grooves where the cutting tool moves along the surface. I've been a machinist in an aircraft factory and college teacher for 45 years

If the sleeves are "out of round" they will round up again when pressed on. They must have been round when they were machined in the first place.

I've used them and they are excellent.
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Old 08-24-2013, 03:51 AM   #39
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Just some info on the rear hub roller bearings. The original genuine ford bearings had hardened end plates. Some modern replacement brands are not hardened on the end plates which causes metal to wear off them and mixed with the wheel bearing grease makes a lovely abrasive paste. Got a pair of new german made bearings supplied by macs which were not hardened. So ask the question before you buy them. Regards, Kevin.
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Old 07-28-2020, 08:22 AM   #40
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Meric 42
would you please add my name also. Thanks
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Old 07-28-2020, 08:39 AM   #41
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Meric42
I found the pictures and your explanation .
Thanks Tony.
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Old 07-28-2020, 10:02 AM   #42
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy View Post
John Connelly at Columbia Two Speed Parts did a couple for me. He has his own sleeves made to his specifications:

http://columbiatwospeedparts.com/default.aspx
I second that. This is the way to go!
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Old 07-28-2020, 11:47 AM   #43
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Columbia Two Speed has the good races!
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Old 07-28-2020, 03:18 PM   #44
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lowsquire View Post
Stupidly I didnt even think to ask John Connelly...of course he would make them himself. his parts are immaculate, I used his stuff to rebuild the Columbia.

Thanks all, It seems from pouring thru online catalogues, the standard bearing inner sleeve I seek isnt actually made, so Ill give John an email.

Thankyou everyone!
Since I'd retired, John has done all of mine. Always top rate quality at a reasonable choice. You won't go wrong with the man...
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Old 07-28-2020, 03:19 PM   #45
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

This is one I did a while back with a full bearing brought of the shelf , The hub race on the axle is a slid fit no machining needed except it needs a sleeve on the OD of the Axle . also a thin sleeve on the ID of the hub ,I have no significant miles on it as yet ,Merc 42 maybe a better way .
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Old 07-28-2020, 05:18 PM   #46
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

I do a similar mod but use two NU 1010 roller bearings, machining required, one good thing is the old axle tube bearing area only has to go down to 50mm .
machine the hub bearing area true, press in a sleeve ,then machine to 80mm
Have done two ,
the roller bearings take WAY more load than a ball bearing, the 2 NU 1010 take a static load of 9500 KGs per side so they will handle 19 tones on the back end .
Also the speed of the rollers is way slower than a needle roller.
BUT they are costly.
I have a set on my bench now so will post some pics, or look up a post I did way back on them .
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Old 07-28-2020, 05:24 PM   #47
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

I don't know how to load the old post but is on 04-03-2017, 06:54 AM by Lawrie
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Old 07-28-2020, 09:40 PM   #48
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Default Re: repairing rear axle housing bearing races..

Here is the link Lawrie.

https://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showt...highlight=axle

I have just done the second bearing repair mod for my spare 33 rear end.
This fixes the worn bearing area in the hub and on the axle area also.
I machined the hub out to 82.5 mm, then shrunk in a sleave, bored that to 80mm.The hub was easy to machine out after I used a new insert on the boring bar. BUT it is very hard.
machine the axle OD down to 50mm and press on the bearing inner.
The bearings are two roller ones with a total load capacity of 9.6 tons each side and a limiting speed of 9500rpm ,so should be safe there.
Only draw back of this, I have to remove the brake drum from the hub to machine it as my lathe is not quite big enough to do it with it on.
Lawrie
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