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Old 07-31-2014, 03:44 PM   #1
ericr
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Default What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

A recent post seems to indicate that parts dealers regularly read this blog, which is understandable and actually helpful to our hobby. I know that some dealers get a tongue-lashing here, but you know, after all is said and done, it is hard for me to believe that anyone would engage in that business without some level of interest if not affection for Model "A" Fords.

Anyway, perhaps it would be of value if dealers got some feedback from owners as to what part they want to see reproduced, or made in a higher-quality form.
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Old 07-31-2014, 04:28 PM   #2
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Headlight bulb sockets....oh yes and good '30-'31 wind wing clamps

Good thread. Look at the response to Walt Bratton's headlight reflectors!!
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Old 07-31-2014, 05:37 PM   #3
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

I guess, as mentioned on another thread, new gas tanks would be awesome!

That is on the dream list.
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Old 07-31-2014, 05:58 PM   #4
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

This is a real subjective post for me but there is one MAJOR factor that many just do not seem to comprehend regarding quality. The majority of the time each & every reproduction item boils down to Costs to Produce, and R.O.I. It is just a matter of Economics 101.

Folks here can make lists a mile long of "dream items" and their peers will jump on the bandwagon. Then someone will jump in and say these vendors need to make better quality however the brutal truth is most people will not pay. I can cite example after example of quality items that were available yet the R.O.I. was so poor, the production was halted. The reason the R.O.I. was bad was because the manufacturer listened to hobbyists who said "if only XXX was offered, it would fly of the shelf!" ...but guess what, it didn't. Folks always seem to find an excuse why they can not step-up and pay the manufacturer's price. "My car is just a driver." or "I'm retired and I can't spend that kind of money."

In the defense of the vendors/manufacturers who do lurk here, most of them are very savvy business operators and they learn quickly about their market. Trust me when I say there is a reason why they manufacture a product to a certain level.

Now here is a thought, ...how many reproduction parts would not be necessary to manufacture if a typical Model-A Restorer could actually restore parts instead of replace parts?? That one kinda 'stings' don't it? My thought is show gratitude for whatever reproduction item is available, and buy the best quality you can afford if you cannot restore what you have.
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Old 07-31-2014, 06:00 PM   #5
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

How about more RHD parts. Throttle linkages, steering arms, brake cross shafts, clutch/brake pedals and bushes and shaft, bell housings, inlet manifolds, hand throttle levers and many more.
Oh, and another thing - rewrite instructions so that they refer to left or right side of the car, not driver's or passenger's side. We have to be alert when assembling things that we DON"T follow the instructions. I asked Snyder's one day "What happens if we assemble an engine as your instructions say and have the oil scoops on the co rods facing the driver's side? The engine would fail very quickly and because the instructions were followed, you would be responsible." The person to whom I spoke had no clue there would be a problem and there has been no change to their (or anybody else's) literature. This is an issue I have also raised about the Les Andrews books which for a right hand car are full of errors.
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Old 07-31-2014, 06:03 PM   #6
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Well I guess it is all in fun I would say for most a good set of steel fenders
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Old 07-31-2014, 06:05 PM   #7
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Agree Brent about the viability of small production runs of slow moving items but my comment about instructions are valid regardless of volume. I would not be the owner of a Model A if it weren't for the ready supply of parts. Please don't get me wrong, I do appreciate the availability of parts even though we have to repair more items than you guys.
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Old 07-31-2014, 06:08 PM   #8
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

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Well I guess it is all in fun I would say for most a good set of steel fenders
Yes, this has my vote... steel fenders that FIT!!
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Old 07-31-2014, 06:11 PM   #9
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Years ago I sold a NOS 1930's Chevrolet door handle to a vendor at Hershey thas was going to add it to his line of reproductions. I asked him what R&D and tooling would cost to make the first one, the number he mentioned was mind boggeling. How anyone makes any reproduction part AND a profit amazes me. Bob
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Old 07-31-2014, 06:13 PM   #10
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

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Yes, this has my vote... steel fenders that FIT!!

+ 2 Amen
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Old 07-31-2014, 06:37 PM   #11
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C View Post
This is a real subjective post for me but there is one MAJOR factor that many just do not seem to comprehend regarding quality. The majority of the time each & every reproduction item boils down to Costs to Produce, and R.O.I. It is just a matter of Economics 101.

Folks here can make lists a mile long of "dream items" and their peers will jump on the bandwagon. Then someone will jump in and say these vendors need to make better quality however the brutal truth is most people will not pay. I can cite example after example of quality items that were available yet the R.O.I. was so poor, the production was halted. The reason the R.O.I. was bad was because the manufacturer listened to hobbyists who said "if only XXX was offered, it would fly of the shelf!" ...but guess what, it didn't. Folks always seem to find an excuse why they can not step-up and pay the manufacturer's price. "My car is just a driver." or "I'm retired and I can't spend that kind of money."

In the defense of the vendors/manufacturers who do lurk here, most of them are very savvy business operators and they learn quickly about their market. Trust me when I say there is a reason why they manufacture a product to a certain level.

Now here is a thought, ...how many reproduction parts would not be necessary to manufacture if a typical Model-A Restorer could actually restore parts instead of replace parts?? That one kinda 'stings' don't it? My thought is show gratitude for whatever reproduction item is available, and buy the best quality you can afford if you cannot restore what you have.
well, yes and no, isn't it? I just posted a comment where I returned a US made open car door lock that was substantially more expensive than foreign made but no greater in quality. On the flip side, Brattons's new headlamp reflectors seem to be gathering praise (and hopefully sales) and are substantially higher in cost than the former ones. Am I to think Walt doesn't know what he is doing or never heard of ROI?

Members have commented on who sells better running boards and trim, better nuts and bolts, carb jets, points, condenser and many other things and I think you advise people where to buy better fender welting.

I think nature, size, complexity and ultimate price of the part at issue might also be involved in the mix. Surely no one expects sellers to take a risk of loss but I also suspect there is some pecking order of parts dealers, some of whom can afford to take greater risks of ROI than others.
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:34 PM   #12
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Short and sweet for me .... Gas tank !
Wayne
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:42 PM   #13
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Dammit, I'm not a multi millionaire and a SS check will only stretch so far. And as Brent says, we should be restoring the parts where possible. But somehow I've been made to feel as though restoring parts is like dumpster diving, "Put in a new one!" is the hue and cry of those with better retirement plans. Meanwhile I get to scrounge. I bought my fenders for $150 a pair, I did a helluva work on them (See my my profile "My 30 T.S.") All the while I was thinking of the guys who can afford new ones. OH Well! Such is life. My seat frames and springs are made from an old mattress and a Ash tree I cut down in the backyard. Dimensionally, it is identical to the old spring, so why should I care? Well....,It's... It's... HOMEMADE! Therefore it can't be any good, can it? Right? That's the thinking isn't it? Somehow using our skills only turns out substandard parts at best. SIGH!!!!
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:48 PM   #14
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

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Originally Posted by Terry,NJ View Post
Dammit, I'm not a multi millionaire and a SS check will only stretch so far. And as Brent says, we should be restoring the parts where possible. But somehow I've been made to feel as though restoring parts is like dumpster diving, "Put in a new one!" is the hue and cry of those with better retirement plans. Meanwhile I get to scrounge. I bought my fenders for $150 a pair, I did a helluva work on them (See my my profile "My 30 T.S.") All the while I was thinking of the guys who can afford new ones. OH Well! Such is life. My seat frames and springs are made from an old mattress and a Ash tree I cut down in the backyard. Dimensionally, it is identical to the old spring, so why should I care? Well....,It's... It's... HOMEMADE! Therefore it can't be any good, can it? Right? That's the thinking isn't it? Somehow using our skills only turns out substandard parts at best. SIGH!!!!
Terry
free parts are also helpful
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Old 07-31-2014, 07:49 PM   #15
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Short and sweet for me .... Gas tank !
Wayne
It would be much "CHEAPER" to clean your Original the right way !!
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Old 07-31-2014, 08:33 PM   #16
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

On the fender not fitting, I have a friend 93+ years of age that asked one of the major manufacturers of the 30/31 front fenders why they don't make them to fit the car. He was told, "Because you guys buy 'em the way they are." Why change the ROI when we don't demand the quality, and if quality is offered, we don't support the price? It is what it is.
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Old 07-31-2014, 08:41 PM   #17
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It would be much "CHEAPER" to clean your Original the right way !!
Some of us are not looking for cheap, we are looking for convenience and I don't personally care if it is original. And sometimes they are rusted through and how do you clean holes ???
Wayne
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Old 07-31-2014, 08:46 PM   #18
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Patch panels with the right contour. Since they've been made wrong for 40 years.

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Old 07-31-2014, 08:56 PM   #19
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As a life long businessman and investor I have to agree completely with Brent. He hit the nail squarely on the head.
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Old 07-31-2014, 09:35 PM   #20
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Some of us are not looking for cheap, we are looking for convenience and I don't personally care if it is original. And sometimes they are rusted through and how do you clean holes ???
Wayne
You will learn how to, Real Fast, When you go to buy your new Re-pop tank & then it wont fit !!
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Old 07-31-2014, 09:36 PM   #21
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

This is a great topic. I currently own 3 model A's. One is a great 31 Roadster, my second a 31 Roadster Pickup which I purchased and was claimed to be restored and I am correcting many items. The third is my dad's car which I started to restore.
I love working on these cars and this Forum is key in helping me work on them.
The most frustrating thing is when you get ready to do a project and the new parts you purchase do not fit properly. Vendors should make it a point to test what they sell on an actual car and if it does not fit demand from the manufacturer better quality and fit.

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Old 07-31-2014, 09:39 PM   #22
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Well, I'm thankful BillS is making me some new shocks... I'm hopeful new engine blocks will be available as there a limits on how long these 83+ year old engines will run... Fuel tanks would be very helpful but those are likely harder to make than an engine block.
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Old 07-31-2014, 09:56 PM   #23
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You will learn how to, Real Fast, When you go to buy your new Re-pop tank & then it wont fit !!

And why would you think it won't fit ! I am the eternal optimist, not a pessimist ! A great majority of repop parts fit fine. And as I asked before how do you clean holes in a rusted out tank ? Wayne
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Old 07-31-2014, 10:04 PM   #24
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Correct '28/'29 truck outside door handles. Correct AA side view mirrors and mounts for all years.
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Old 07-31-2014, 10:16 PM   #25
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And why would you think it won't fit ! I am the eternal optimist, not a pessimist ! A great majority of repop parts fit fine. And as I asked before how do you clean holes in a rusted out tank ? Wayne
SAND BLAST !!
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Old 07-31-2014, 10:20 PM   #26
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SAND BLAST !!
So now we are talking a little more than cleaning. I have been down your road and it was not fun. I prefer to spend a few bucks and buy quality reproduction and if you look the original post did say quality. In my book quality means it fits !
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Old 07-31-2014, 10:58 PM   #27
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Really nice fenders.
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Old 07-31-2014, 11:20 PM   #28
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Gas tanks; 28/29 and 30/31.
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Old 07-31-2014, 11:27 PM   #29
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28-29 hood shelves.
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Old 07-31-2014, 11:45 PM   #30
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

I think this is a good thread. A wish list is never a bad thing. As for "why not just restore what you have?" Well, not every one has the equipment to do such things. "Sandblasting" needs what equipment? Fender repair, what equipment is needed? wheel lugs and truing the drums, what equipment is needed?

All the time in the world and all the money in the world.
All the time in the world and no money.
All the money in the world and no time.
No time and no money.

Where do you fit in?

Why can't there be people that have the talent and equipment to do the restoration work and people that can install what is already ready to be installed?
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Old 08-01-2014, 04:18 AM   #31
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Thank you Eric for this thread

I am 100% with Mike (even i am a no4 ).

There is an additional point in the fact that in some countries on
this planet there are no old parts available. As having to do all
"repairs" during night time and growing to old to do so, i urgently
want to keep my car running. As so i cant take out broken parts
and do long-lasting (?) repairs.
I want to buy a new part (plug and play) and decide later on, what
to do with my original (but broken) parts.
For sure i dont scrap them
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Old 08-01-2014, 06:01 AM   #32
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well said Mike.

Why dont we send our fenders and tanks to McPherson and support the school?

hows about them apples....?

plenty of practice for the students and nice product turn around......
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:26 AM   #33
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

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well said Mike.

Why dont we send our fenders and tanks to McPherson and support the school?

hows about them apples....?

plenty of practice for the students and nice product turn around......
If they would accept parts for training and we could get them back, I would think many would be wiling to do so. As the labor is "free" for them it might even prove to be a profit center for them. Do the restoration work to a level where those without special tools can finish the work and pay them?!
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:27 AM   #34
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how about a quality amp gauge?
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:35 AM   #35
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Steel 26 27 turtle deck quarters. That's my vote.
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:55 AM   #36
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Well the range of parts thats available now days is mind boggling compaired to when I got my first Model a nearly 50 years ago. Back then over here you had to break up a few cars to build up a stock of parts to keep the old daily driver running. Some of the cars I broke up back then would get restored today.
As for what I would like to see reproduced would be new front axel beams. Good ones are now impossible to find here. I have a few and they are all worn out in the perch bolt eyes or the axel eyes ( where the king pin goes). It is most important to have these holes tight as looseness in these areas is a cause of the dreaded shimmy, Sure you can bore these out and sleave back but its expensive and if it is not done properly the geometary of the steering can be changed, resulting in further problems. There seems to be no shortage of new droped style front axels for hot rodders but no new stock ones for restorers. Next would be some new stub axels (spindels I think you call them). Good ones of them are getting harder to find overhere. Happy Motoring
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Old 08-01-2014, 08:18 AM   #37
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ericr;919977 said;


Well, yes and no, isn't it? I just posted a comment where I returned a US made open car door lock that was substantially more expensive than foreign made but no greater in quality. On the flip side, Brattons's new headlamp reflectors seem to be gathering praise (and hopefully sales) and are substantially higher in cost than the former ones. Am I to think Walt doesn't know what he is doing or never heard of ROI?
No, Walt & Jeff are pretty smart guys who have traveled down this road many miles however most folks do not realize the behind-the-scenes obstacles they had to overcome just to manufacture reflectors. If I recall correctly, these have been 3-4 years in the making trying to find a manufacturer that will take on the project, produce in small (-affordable) quantities, and supply with Q/C from batch to batch. It goes without saying that if it were not for Walt's "depth" of his other parts, the reflectors would likely have never came to fruition by him. In other words, an average small businessman could not take the same idea and manufacture reflectors, and survive off of the sales. So what does that say about the parts manufacturing business in general?

Members have commented on who sells better running boards and trim, better nuts and bolts, carb jets, points, condenser and many other things and I think you advise people where to buy better fender welting.
Ok, you DO realize there is a magazine that is supposed to offer this very information to hobbyists.

The thought to ponder is how do folks here REALLY know which is better quality? How many on forums offer/give that advice based on hearsay but have no first-hand experience with the advice they are giving you? You mentioned running boards, ...so how many posters here actually get to personally install a pair from both vendors within a short amount of time to be able to say why one is better than the other. Adding to that, how many actually have studied the original item to compare? Very, -very few get this opportunity,--and that is why finding a parts vendor you can have a solid relationship with who gets feedback from reliable sources is key.

As far as "better" though, when you read some of the posts above, "better" is also defined as 'something affordable' or 'something that will get me by'. Those folks are being honest, ...many others have that same thought or mindset but choose not to speak it verbally however they show it with their wallet by what they purchase. Face it, if two like items are available in repro., it stands to reason that the better quality item will force the lesser-quality item to no longer sell and the manufacturer of the poorer-quality item ceases production in a matter of time. The problem is, the vendors will tell you that history dictates that just isn't the case.



I think nature, size, complexity and ultimate price of the part at issue might also be involved in the mix. Surely no one expects sellers to take a risk of loss but I also suspect there is some pecking order of parts dealers, some of whom can afford to take greater risks of ROI than others.
Trust me when I tell you that manufacturers AND sellers alike take a HUGE risk every time they place an order. There seemingly is no loyalty amongst hobbyists, and as such the majority of sales is driven off of price & convenience. Take this for example, let's suppose the word is getting around about how nice Walt's new reflectors really are. Now, a small (greedy) businessman buys a couple of his reflectors and sends them off to China or India to have the reverse-engineered and copied. Now without the R&D expense Walt incurred, nor his Marketing expenses or product acceptance risk, this person imports his reflectors and retails them for $20 less because his overhead/risk was lower. You know that Loyalty 'thingie' I just spoke about, there ain't none! Folks will get on the forums and tout how the new import is cheaper and just as good! Now Walt is left holding the bag trying to get at least get back to a break-even position.

Did someone say Nah, that probably wouldn't happen?. Don't tell that to me. If you don't believe me, then research Model-A brake drums and the like!! How is any of this good for the hobby? Justify it any way you like, but poor quality parts are the direct fault of the hobbyist, and not the vendor! The parts vendor/manufacturer only does what the customer asks for!
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Old 08-01-2014, 08:26 AM   #38
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Remember in all fairness to the vendors, that even when 'new' Model A parts wouldn't always FIT it took the guy on the assy. line some creative hammer and alignment tools to get things together when the cars were originally being built. Look at the NOS parts that Marco tried to use on his Roadster that wouldn't fit and had to be tweaked. Assy. line rejects but still sold as NOS thru the dealership network.

Ever work on an assy. line building automobiles or tractors or some other complicated machine? If you have you know just what I mean. Parts just don't always line up. Oftentimes, even on new stuff today, you can't take a part right out of the box and pop it on. Sometimes it takes a little urging.

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Old 08-01-2014, 08:47 AM   #39
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I want tire tube valve dust covers identical to original.
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Old 08-01-2014, 08:52 AM   #40
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I am in the business world, and supply specialty retail items (different industry...not auto part). I completely understand the 'only make and sell what you can make a profit on' concept.

I'm also a hobbyist that loves the challenge of bringing original parts back to life. But, some things are a pain, or nearly impossible to restore.

When evaluating specialty items in my business, I attack the 'low hanging fruit' first. In my opinion, the logical next item would be the headlight sockets that BlueSunoco mentioned. The problems with the current repros are obvious, but not insurmountable. The engineering would not be complicated or expensive, allowing an attractive price-point. And, demand is high... the fiber pieces are bent out of shape on nearly every car I have tinkered with. If there was a quality repro, I would have bought several of them already myself. As such, the engineering and tooling costs could be spread over a great number of units.

Just my opinion.

Hey, and a big thanks to Walt Bratton for taking the risk on his headlight reflectors. I have an original set with okay original finish. I am now doing just enough night driving... and the reviews of Walt's reflectors are so impressive... I think I am going to get a set for my daily driver.
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Old 08-01-2014, 09:41 AM   #41
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I suspect that over the 80+ years vendor who make new parts take a few and re-engineer them... Example, I replaced my distributor set screw and the dimple that should have mated with the distributor shaft was way to large in diameter to mate... I can only guess there might be several different distributor shaft (female sizes) out there and how the size difference came about...
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Old 08-01-2014, 10:26 AM   #42
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I suspect that over the 80+ years vendor who make new parts take a few and re-engineer them... Example, I replaced my distributor set screw and the dimple that should have mated with the distributor shaft was way to large in diameter to mate... I can only guess there might be several different distributor shaft (female sizes) out there and how the size difference came about...
What ???
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Old 08-01-2014, 11:33 AM   #43
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ericr;919977 said;


Well, yes and no, isn't it? I just posted a comment where I returned a US made open car door lock that was substantially more expensive than foreign made but no greater in quality. On the flip side, Brattons's new headlamp reflectors seem to be gathering praise (and hopefully sales) and are substantially higher in cost than the former ones. Am I to think Walt doesn't know what he is doing or never heard of ROI?
No, Walt & Jeff are pretty smart guys who have traveled down this road many miles however most folks do not realize the behind-the-scenes obstacles they had to overcome just to manufacture reflectors. If I recall correctly, these have been 3-4 years in the making trying to find a manufacturer that will take on the project, produce in small (-affordable) quantities, and supply with Q/C from batch to batch. It goes without saying that if it were not for Walt's "depth" of his other parts, the reflectors would likely have never came to fruition by him. In other words, an average small businessman could not take the same idea and manufacture reflectors, and survive off of the sales. So what does that say about the parts manufacturing business in general?

Members have commented on who sells better running boards and trim, better nuts and bolts, carb jets, points, condenser and many other things and I think you advise people where to buy better fender welting.
Ok, you DO realize there is a magazine that is supposed to offer this very information to hobbyists.

The thought to ponder is how do folks here REALLY know which is better quality? How many on forums offer/give that advice based on hearsay but have no first-hand experience with the advice they are giving you? You mentioned running boards, ...so how many posters here actually get to personally install a pair from both vendors within a short amount of time to be able to say why one is better than the other. Adding to that, how many actually have studied the original item to compare? Very, -very few get this opportunity,--and that is why finding a parts vendor you can have a solid relationship with who gets feedback from reliable sources is key.

As far as "better" though, when you read some of the posts above, "better" is also defined as 'something affordable' or 'something that will get me by'. Those folks are being honest, ...many others have that same thought or mindset but choose not to speak it verbally however they show it with their wallet by what they purchase. Face it, if two like items are available in repro., it stands to reason that the better quality item will force the lesser-quality item to no longer sell and the manufacturer of the poorer-quality item ceases production in a matter of time. The problem is, the vendors will tell you that history dictates that just isn't the case.



I think nature, size, complexity and ultimate price of the part at issue might also be involved in the mix. Surely no one expects sellers to take a risk of loss but I also suspect there is some pecking order of parts dealers, some of whom can afford to take greater risks of ROI than others.
Trust me when I tell you that manufacturers AND sellers alike take a HUGE risk every time they place an order. There seemingly is no loyalty amongst hobbyists, and as such the majority of sales is driven off of price & convenience. Take this for example, let's suppose the word is getting around about how nice Walt's new reflectors really are. Now, a small (greedy) businessman buys a couple of his reflectors and sends them off to China or India to have the reverse-engineered and copied. Now without the R&D expense Walt incurred, nor his Marketing expenses or product acceptance risk, this person imports his reflectors and retails them for $20 less because his overhead/risk was lower. You know that Loyalty 'thingie' I just spoke about, there ain't none! Folks will get on the forums and tout how the new import is cheaper and just as good! Now Walt is left holding the bag trying to get at least get back to a break-even position.

Did someone say Nah, that probably wouldn't happen?. Don't tell that to me. If you don't believe me, then research Model-A brake drums and the like!! How is any of this good for the hobby? Justify it any way you like, but poor quality parts are the direct fault of the hobbyist, and not the vendor! The parts vendor/manufacturer only does what the customer asks for!
well nobody has so undercut Champion 3X plugs so as to cause them to cease production, and whenever anyone mentions them on Amazon, there is a stampede to buy them at a modest savings. But I am sure there is far more truth than poetry to what you are saying. I simply hope there are enough restorers that are willing to put their $ where their mouth is, and support our suppliers that take the risk to market better-quality parts.

If you read the publications, even when the cars were new, after-market suppliers were undercutting the factory on quality vs. price. Northing new under the sun, is there.
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Old 08-01-2014, 11:33 AM   #44
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

I too wouldn't mind seeing gas tanks being put into production but , as has been mentioned in other posts, it's probably due to liability issues.

I agree with Brent's comments regarding vendors options of doing production runs at feasible costs. No vendor wants to stock his shelves with parts that are so expensive to produce that no one buys them and he's stuck taking the loss.

I'm sure the vendors want the best quality part for the best possible price but it economically boils down to production costs and likelihood of being able to sell the item.
The quality of a given repro part doesn't necessarily increase as the price increases....it may just be the area it was produced that has higher labour costs, taxes, etc.
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Old 08-01-2014, 11:55 AM   #45
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Perhaps, also good snaps for Roadster side curtains and tops. Seems like someone was working on that a couple years ago...............
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Old 08-01-2014, 03:18 PM   #46
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Head light connectors that work..conduit in back of head light to head light itself... Chinese junk don't work.
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Old 08-01-2014, 04:02 PM   #47
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Speaking as a Fine point restoration supporter ...the 2 following parts.... #1 CORRECT UPPER + LOWER WATER HOSES and CORRECT FAN BELTS... WOULD I BE PUSHING IT BY SAYING BRING BACK THE CORRECT TOP ROUND 3 SPARK PLUGS....P.S. I AM NOT SHOUTING ....I JUST WORKED AND BEEN UP NOW FOR 14 HOURS AND FINISHED 15 DAYS STRAIGHT OF WORK...just love that hope and change
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Old 08-01-2014, 06:58 PM   #48
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I agree with 1930 coupe about the headlight switch, I took apart one new one that the inside contact was assembled about 5 degrees off. I have 3 or 4 of the new ones in the junk box.

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Old 08-01-2014, 09:00 PM   #49
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well nobody has so undercut Champion 3X plugs so as to cause them to cease production, and whenever anyone mentions them on Amazon, there is a stampede to buy them at a modest savings. But I am sure there is far more truth than poetry to what you are saying. I simply hope there are enough restorers that are willing to put their $ where their mouth is, and support our suppliers that take the risk to market better-quality parts.

Your example of the 3x is interesting for the reason that they have been out of production for several years and a run was just made off-shore to fill the 'pipeline' again however speculation is the plug will be unavailable after this round. The reason Champion halted production was this was a hand-assembled item, and labor costs here in the States made them cost prohibitive to manufacture.

If you read the publications, even when the cars were new, after-market suppliers were undercutting the factory on quality vs. price. Northing new under the sun, is there.
Two totally different scenarios in my view and not the same.

...




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I too wouldn't mind seeing gas tanks being put into production but , as has been mentioned in other posts, it's probably due to liability issues.
That myth has been discussed here many times before and it is my opinion there is just too many differences and tooling costs. If it were indeed from liability issues, then we would not be able to purchase new reproduction tanks for Model-Ts nor for the early V-8 Fords.

I agree with Brent's comments regarding vendors options of doing production runs at feasible costs. No vendor wants to stock his shelves with parts that are so expensive to produce that no one buys them and he's stuck taking the loss.

I'm sure the vendors want the best quality part for the best possible price but it economically boils down to production costs and likelihood of being able to sell the item.
The quality of a given repro part doesn't necessarily increase as the price increases....it may just be the area it was produced that has higher labour costs, taxes, etc.
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Old 08-02-2014, 02:14 AM   #50
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What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

That's the title of the thread. Not why they are not made.
We sure do have a lot of negative posts on making parts.

Maybe we should just give up?

How many things do we take for granted today that the inventors or manufacturers were told, too hard, nobody would want them. How many failures before success.

I hope my kids don't read this and get the idea that only easy things or things with great profit are worthwhile!

If I sound a little pissed I am! All I seem to hear every day everywhere is why something cannot be built, cannot be cured, cannot be solved, cannot, cannot, cannot.

Ever seen a circus elephant? Every wonder why they don't just pull that little stake out of the ground and walk away? When they are young they don't have the strength to do it. They pull and pull, day after day, week after week, month after month. When they get older, they lose the will to pull.

Are we losing the will to pull? Too hard, too complicated?
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Old 08-02-2014, 05:56 AM   #51
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damn Mike, couldnt agree with you more!

What happened to America? (OK another time...........).

so I still want new gas tanks.......... ( or rebuilt old ones)

A 500. donation to McPherson-they gut out the old ones, you get to write it off, they get practice, somebody put it together........... the school could use the support.
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Old 08-02-2014, 08:12 AM   #52
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OK Brent ...meet me 1/2 way then...L.O.L. .... IF Champion spark plug company would take orders in advance [something like the 1931 running boards] and reproduce the PORCELAIN INSULATOR W/ ROUND 3 / ELECTRODE with CORRECT KNURL NUT and BRASS CAP or even without the correct knurl nut that would cut down on the labor cost for putting them together...Someone made a really nice base out in C.A. which i bought a set and there are original bases around... One other thing too is a replacement Thermometer/TEMPERATURE GAUGE for the original MOTORMETER .Anyone still selling reproduction Motormeter's ??? I have 3 originals that work but will like to take them apart and have plated....
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Old 08-02-2014, 09:49 AM   #53
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Pete, I have had them plated with the Thermometer in place and all was fine, but remember they are pot metal !!
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Old 08-02-2014, 09:53 AM   #54
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Tires that are tough and last more than 12000 miles. ditto really good inner tubes
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Old 08-02-2014, 10:06 AM   #55
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What would happen if an individual, or company, did decide to make a really nice part and asked for investors, on here, to help soften the blow, if it did not make a profit ?
How many would invest, even if they thought it was a "winner" ?
Just thinking.
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Old 08-02-2014, 11:17 AM   #56
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i am just saying ..if you increase the membership dues to each[MARC/MAFCA] by lets say $1.00 to improve a part or parts to continue the preservation [restoration] of the Model "A' Ford i am sure no one will object. If as a group contact a Model "A' Supplier [BRATTONS /SNYDERS [we don't need more then 1] to find a manufacture that they deal with will do the right thing by us on the correct reproduction of a part needed ..How many members do we have between the 2 clubs ??? 30 / 40 ???thousand /// I am sure with that kind of money someone can reproduce the correct headlight switch...and change left over...for the new part.
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Old 08-02-2014, 11:29 AM   #57
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i am just saying ..if you increase the membership dues to each[MARC/MAFCA] by lets say $1.00 to improve a part or parts to continue the preservation [restoration] of the Model "A' Ford i am sure no one will object. If as a group contact a Model "A' Supplier [BRATTONS /SNYDERS [we don't need more then 1] to find a manufacture that they deal with will do the right thing by us on the correct reproduction of a part needed ..How many members do we have between the 2 clubs ??? 30 / 40 ???thousand /// I am sure with that kind of money someone can reproduce the correct headlight switch...and change left over...for the new part.
That would NEVER go over with a whole bunch of people for many-many reasons !!..
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Old 08-02-2014, 04:19 PM   #58
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i thought brattons made some good innertubes?. Gastanks would be nice but i read they come in 7 flavours. Maybe if there was a "1 size fits all" replacement bottom patch panel that ran all the way up to the top edges of the tank people might weld it in at their own risk?
What parts would i like to see?.... hmm... heaps of things are made good enough already but i find it hard to buy them.
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Old 08-02-2014, 06:30 PM   #59
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Ronald Wilson Reagan. Just bring him back, the quality was already there.
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Old 08-02-2014, 08:02 PM   #60
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Nickel plated parts that should be nickel plated. Easy to do. Also, a good 28-29 gas cap. Radiator cap too.
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Old 08-02-2014, 08:21 PM   #61
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Nickel plated parts that should be nickel plated. Easy to do. Also, a good 28-29 gas cap. Radiator cap too.
Plenty of Originals out there that can be re-plated..
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Old 08-02-2014, 08:23 PM   #62
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i would like to see decent quality repair panels , inner and outer, for bottom of deck lid. and, even simpler, a well made patch for right front fender for area behind and including where the fender brace attaches. this one should extend inboard about 5 or 6 inches.
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Old 08-02-2014, 09:05 PM   #63
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Plenty of Originals out there that can be re-plated..
Fred, do you have a cap you'll sell me? How about some 29 headlight buckets and headlight doors? A good radiator shell?
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Old 08-02-2014, 09:46 PM   #64
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

I also would like to see quality ammeters. the repros are junk and not accurate. Also dash lights for round speedometer cars. The repros could burn your car up.
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Old 08-02-2014, 10:10 PM   #65
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i would like to see decent quality repair panels , inner and outer, for bottom of deck lid. and, even simpler, a well made patch for right front fender for area behind and including where the fender brace attaches. this one should extend inboard about 5 or 6 inches.
I agree, the panel below the deck lid opening is one of the most frustrating restoration aspects I have encountered....I've griped bout it several times in earlier threads. Still griping.
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Old 08-03-2014, 02:40 PM   #66
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This comment is NOT about Model A parts, but the story applies. I used to sell office supplies wholesale. We sold QUALITY American made paper clips. Our competitors started pushing the foreign made ones (cheaper, because of less and inferior steel), so we ordered some too, and we sold a lot of them. BUT OUR customers, said THEIR customers complained about the poor quality, they bent and wouldn't hold more than two pages,but they wouldn't pay for GOOD QUALITY ones.

Quality costs money, doesn't matter where IT is made. Many people don't understand the risks involved in bringing out a new product or reproduction.

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Old 08-03-2014, 03:48 PM   #67
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This comment is NOT about Model A parts, but the story applies. I used to sell office supplies wholesale. We sold QUALITY American made paper clips. Our competitors started pushing the foreign made ones (cheaper, because of less and inferior steel), so we ordered some too, and we sold a lot of them. BUT OUR customers, said THEIR customers complained about the poor quality, they bent and wouldn't hold more than two pages,but they wouldn't pay for GOOD QUALITY ones.

Quality costs money, doesn't matter where IT is made. Many people don't understand the risks involved in bringing out a new product or reproduction.

Ted
this whole situation is a puzzlement to me. conversely to your experiences, foreign cars gained such dominance in this country because car buyers were in fact willing to pay more for the perceived quality and standard accessories. Now the whole industry is so blurred with foreign vs. domestic parts. assembly, etc., I don't know where it stands. But no denying foreign manufacturers clobbered the US companies, largely on quality.
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Old 08-03-2014, 04:40 PM   #68
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Sounds like there is a lot of uncertainty over what parts sell and entrepreneurs not wanting to risk laying out the cash to make parts nobody will buy. I'm not sure if anybody has heard of the Kickstarter website, but basically people who want to get a project funded post them on Kickstarter hoping they'll get funded. Here's a sample listing

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects...e-sleep-better

It would answer the question "Is this a financially viable part to make?". If a reputable vendor posted an item, there would be no question that the parts would get made.

In theory, it would be a beautiful system. In practice, I think it would only demonstrate that most guys are unwilling to put their money where their mouth is.
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Old 08-03-2014, 04:53 PM   #69
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

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this whole situation is a puzzlement to me. conversely to your experiences, foreign cars gained such dominance in this country because car buyers were in fact willing to pay more for the perceived quality and standard accessories. Now the whole industry is so blurred with foreign vs. domestic parts. assembly, etc., I don't know where it stands. But no denying foreign manufacturers clobbered the US companies, largely on quality.
I can see you are puzzled indeed HOWEVER you are definitely NOT alone there. I liken it to cheating, ...by cheating it is a unfair advantage. Foreign car makers gained dominance in this country because their factories did not need to conform to the same rules as our country's manufacturers did. Blames US Gov't for that. Therefore the foreign manufacturers could offer an equal or slightly better product for a greater profit margin. Unfortunately during this time, US automakers AND their Unions were cranking out a poorer-quality product so it opened the door for a competitor. This is how the stronghold was formed. This has been discussed in college business classes for years however IMHO this really does NOT apply to reproduction parts manufacturers. Allow me to explain.

Some offshore repro parts manufacturers DO have the capability to produce high quality parts (parts equal to Ford's original parts!) however it is the consumer that sets the market price. Just as Ed suggested above, to a few hobbyists, paying $200.00-$250.00 for a latch is acceptable but most perceive it as too expensive. Therefore what are the options? Does he 'table' the project, --or seek a 3rd World country's manufacturer to do it cheaper using subgrade materials, sweatshop labor, and shops that do not have any type of government regulations? I have enjoyed reading each person's thoughts but in my view, it is like Kris said above, it still boils down to the majority are unwilling to pay for true quality.


Oh, for those who speak of a better Ammeter, buy the repro and use the shiney parts (lens, face, bezel, insulator, etc.) on a worn original Ammeter. Works every time! I purchased my little wrench to open them from Tom W.
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Old 08-03-2014, 06:43 PM   #70
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this whole situation is a puzzlement to me. conversely to your experiences, foreign cars gained such dominance in this country because car buyers were in fact willing to pay more for the perceived quality and standard accessories. Now the whole industry is so blurred with foreign vs. domestic parts. assembly, etc., I don't know where it stands. But no denying foreign manufacturers clobbered the US companies, largely on quality.
Actually, and as Brent stated also, it is a bigger story than just THAT. You said it yourself 'PERCEIVED' quality. Just that.

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Old 08-03-2014, 08:05 PM   #71
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I can see you are puzzled indeed HOWEVER you are definitely NOT alone there. I liken it to cheating, ...by cheating it is a unfair advantage. Foreign car makers gained dominance in this country because their factories did not need to conform to the same rules as our country's manufacturers did. Blames US Gov't for that. Therefore the foreign manufacturers could offer an equal or slightly better product for a greater profit margin. Unfortunately during this time, US automakers AND their Unions were cranking out a poorer-quality product so it opened the door for a competitor. This is how the stronghold was formed. This has been discussed in college business classes for years however IMHO this really does NOT apply to reproduction parts manufacturers. Allow me to explain.
Also dont forget at the time the import cars became popular we were in an energy crisis and all weve been making up to that point in time was bigger heavier faster cars and only worried about HP and able to sit 6+ a dog. Meanwhile in europe and asia they've always made cars that are small, cheap to run, and buy (sure the interior and body fall apart but engine and mechanicals still keep going). So that already made them very economical to own. That appealed to peoples pocketbooks more. Then Ford GM Chrysler etc had to scramble to get their foreign market cars up to US standards for EPA and crash tests so we got things like the pinto, pacer, chevette, omni, horizon, assorted K-cars, cavalier etc to try to "catch up" to the imports.

I had someone told me it all started with the Japanese making Casio digital wristwatches for like $8 and you couldn't destroy them if you tried and for $8 no-one else in the world could even touch that level of quality for the price.

People - you and me included- want the best bang for our buck period - doesnt matter if its a TV , washer, furnace, tires, watch, handsaw, etc we just want our hard earned money to go as far as it can.

Sure some people waiver to either side and ALWAYS buy the more expensive thing because if it cost more its better made mentality (deffinately not always true) then the other end is "I wont pay over a dollar for anything but it should work flawlessly forever" mentality which isn't always true either.

Personally it depends on what it is and how often I'm going to use it factors what price i want to pay.
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Old 08-03-2014, 08:25 PM   #72
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My answer with no excuses or political jargon. I favor gas tanks( already produced for other old cars) and a close second, affordable Shocks.
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Old 08-03-2014, 09:15 PM   #73
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

This is a great thread.

Interesting facts for you ....

New , much better quality ammeters are in the process of being made . they will done later this year. They will cost more then the current $9 ones.

1928-1929 pickup door latches have been made now for several years, in New Zealand. They were OK quality, but not perfect.

Last week, another company started making them as well. Much better quality, and about the same price. The first company that came out with them a couple years ago will likely never sell another, since a better one is now being made.

Patch Panels- Seen several complaints about them. Most patch panels (cowl, 1/4 panal etc) are currently being made by 4 different companies. Some are good, some are not. Those guys complaining about them likely purchased (unknowingly ) the bad ones.

Shocks- Many $$ are being spent right now, to have them made overseas, since many are not interested in Bill Stipes shocks due to the cost. they will be done this year or next year.

Bottom line- For something to be reproduced, as indicated here before, it take lots of cash , time, and planning.

Also , think about this. We sell 2 different 1930-1931 Hub Caps. Both are stainless on the outside, and steel on the inside (2 piece construction), not the cheap 1 piece ones. the Taiwan one sells for $9. the perfect USA one sells for $27. In our store, every time anyone wants to buy any, we show them both to them. Side by side. Tell them one is USA made, and one is taiwan made. 95% of the time, they buy the cheap one, even when I tell them they are hard to make tight in the wheel.

One of the most interesting things that I don't think most here are aware of, is most of the companies that make Model A Parts now, started out as Model A owners that wanted a part to be made, so they made one. Then they made 10 more, then 100 more, then another different part, then 100 of them, then they quit their job and started making Model A parts for a living.

So......if you want a better light switch, or dash light, or whatever, you have choices. Find and original or make your own. Then make some more for everyone else.

Even better, restore the part that came with your car. So many people are way to lazy to restore a part, so they just by a new one and complain about it.



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Old 08-04-2014, 02:01 AM   #74
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

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restore the part that came with your car.
There is only one problem with that. People like me never seem to buy complete cars, hence reproduction parts market exists.
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Old 08-04-2014, 06:33 AM   #75
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There is only one problem with that. People like me never seem to buy complete cars, hence reproduction parts market exists.
Well those incomplete cars that you purchase had the parts on them at one time, ...have you looked for them, --or is it just easier to buy the reproduction parts?
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Old 08-04-2014, 05:20 PM   #76
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

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Gas tanks; 28/29 and 30/31.
Here lies another issue with as "simple" a thing as gas tanks. Were there any variances in 1928-29 tanks? I know or at least four variations of 1930-31 (1929 style for early 1930 pickup with bayonet gas cap, 1930 oval speedometer, 1930-31 round speedometer, and 1931 with external shutoff, plus whatever happens with the change from tank mounted column drop to dash mount).

Again, it boils down to ROI, whether finiancial or love.
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Old 08-04-2014, 05:37 PM   #77
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

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Some of us are not looking for cheap, we are looking for convenience and I don't personally care if it is original. And sometimes they are rusted through and how do you clean holes ???
Wayne
Ok, Buy another tank & still do it right before you install it !!. Still will be CHEAPER !! P.S Read above post !!

"CONVENIENCE" ?? Just how long do you think you will have to wait for it to be made ??

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Old 08-04-2014, 09:42 PM   #78
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I am forever surprised at the amount of good quality repop parts available for the Model A.
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Old 08-04-2014, 11:41 PM   #79
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

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Well those incomplete cars that you purchase had the parts on them at one time, ...have you looked for them, --or is it just easier to buy the reproduction parts?
Yes, easier, cheaper, faster.
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Old 08-05-2014, 01:32 AM   #80
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Well those incomplete cars that you purchase had the parts on them at one time, ...have you looked for them, --or is it just easier to buy the reproduction parts?
They do not exist. i know they do not exist because nobody outside the USA has seen any. i am suprised people in the USA have seen any in a while TBH.
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Old 08-05-2014, 01:33 AM   #81
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I am forever surprised at the amount of good quality repop parts available for the Model A.
Me too.
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#2 If they think it is impossible, prove them wrong
#3 If the science says it impossible you are not being creative enough.
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Old 08-05-2014, 02:18 AM   #82
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Murray capture nuts would be nice.
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Old 08-05-2014, 11:05 AM   #83
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Talk of negativity, wow, Model A restorers aren't the masses. We don't need shiny new junk that won't function to toss into our junk boxes. If business owners and manufacturers are savvy then then let them beware of ROI. It comes to this who those responded with votes for a need or desire saw this post with a positive eye. Everything else, including this,,, is bull. I'll not be surprised when this is taken down. Just had to say.
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Old 08-05-2014, 04:21 PM   #84
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I agree with those 28-29 pick up outside door handles,the original I have is brass with a black insert,bought the repros over 30 years ago,still sell the same ones today,no improvement.
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Old 08-05-2014, 06:40 PM   #85
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

I think the headlight switch would be a real good seller , if someone were to make one that really worked good right out of the box. But the list could go on for miles!!!! Gary
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Old 08-05-2014, 07:33 PM   #86
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window crank arms
early 28 parts (floor mats, brake boots, handles, emblems ect)
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Old 08-05-2014, 08:41 PM   #87
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

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Originally Posted by SteveB31 View Post
This is a great thread.

Interesting facts for you ....

One of the most interesting things that I don't think most here are aware of, is most of the companies that make Model A Parts now, started out as Model A owners that wanted a part to be made, so they made one. Then they made 10 more, then 100 more, then another different part, then 100 of them, then they quit their job and started making Model A parts for a living.

So......if you want a better light switch, or dash light, or whatever, you have choices. Find and original or make your own. Then make some more for everyone else.

Even better, restore the part that came with your car. So many people are way to lazy to restore a part, so they just by a new one and complain about it.



Steve Becker
Berts Model A Center
I think Steve is correct......that some people are lazy, I also think
they want instant gratification (repo parts) and when they don't
fit or work right they complain. I guess that's human nature?

I'm part of the "cottage industry", I used to make Gas Gauge Shields
for the 28's (both styles), Nickle plated and correct. Nobody wanted
them so I don't offer them. (Doug Clayton, you were correct!) I also
make the floor pan plugs for 82-A CCPU's....I made them for my self
and a few friends...

If you need a part, get off the couch and go hunting for a restorable
original...or make it.
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Old 08-06-2014, 07:29 AM   #88
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Welcome to the restoration of cars. The best car that sticks in my mind over the years was a 1939 LaSAlle coupe that the man restored. Every original part on this car was taken apart rebuild and re-assembled. He couldn't get the correct dash knobs so he had the correct colour plastic cast onto a tube and from this he machined the new knobs including the etched lettering. Every part was like this. A friend of mine use to say "Many cars are repaired, few are restored" . The Lasalle was rebuilt on a farm with a simple work shop and hand tools and alot of time.

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Old 08-06-2014, 04:04 PM   #89
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

One of the most interesting things that I don't think most here are aware of, is most of the companies that make Model A Parts now, started out as Model A owners that wanted a part to be made, so they made one. Then they made 10 more, then 100 more, then another different part, then 100 of them, then they quit their job and started making Model A parts for a living.

So......if you want a better light switch, or dash light, or whatever, you have choices. Find and original or make your own. Then make some more for everyone else.

Even better, restore the part that came with your car. So many people are way to lazy to restore a part, so they just by a new one and complain about it.

Steve Becker

Anyone looked into crowd funding? It's pretty amazing. Check the memory stick for IPads. No such thing? There is now. If you contribute to funding the company, with a chance of being paid back with interest, you get one of th sticks for less than retail.

This would be a great way to make the small parts. Sure the first few hand made ones could cost a fortune, but this crowd funding thing could generate amazing capital, mostly for us hobbyist.

Robert Houston
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Old 08-11-2014, 01:58 AM   #90
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Just be thankful that you can still purchase USA manufactured parts and cars. In two years time Australia will not have any car to call its own.
Ford Australia manufacturing plant will be closed, Toyota's assy plant closed and our own GM division that has been assembling and making body's for US/Canada vehicles into the 50s will be become just an importer.
Our Holden that's been a big part of Australian life will be gone.
Even for a blue blood like me that will be a sad sad day when this company's manufacturing plants will be gone. 150 or so years of manufacturing everything from horse saddles, horse coaches to even FORDs in the model T days.
Even if a USA manufactured part is double in price I would seriously still buy it.
Don't become another Australia and become just a importer.
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Old 05-08-2015, 07:58 PM   #91
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gas tanks
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Old 05-09-2015, 02:22 AM   #92
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A right hand drive shortened pitman arm.

Take the current one and give it a short twist to the right ...
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Old 05-09-2015, 04:37 AM   #93
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All of them...........
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Old 05-09-2015, 08:40 AM   #94
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gas tanks

There are still plenty of gas tanks around that can be properly and completely restored.

BTW, welcome to Fordbarn!
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Old 05-09-2015, 08:44 AM   #95
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

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Originally Posted by SteveB31 View Post
This is a great thread.

Interesting facts for you ....

New , much better quality ammeters are in the process of being made . they will done later this year. They will cost more then the current $9 ones.

1928-1929 pickup door latches have been made now for several years, in New Zealand. They were OK quality, but not perfect.

Last week, another company started making them as well. Much better quality, and about the same price. The first company that came out with them a couple years ago will likely never sell another, since a better one is now being made.

Patch Panels- Seen several complaints about them. Most patch panels (cowl, 1/4 panal etc) are currently being made by 4 different companies. Some are good, some are not. Those guys complaining about them likely purchased (unknowingly ) the bad ones.

Shocks- Many $$ are being spent right now, to have them made overseas, since many are not interested in Bill Stipes shocks due to the cost. they will be done this year or next year.

Bottom line- For something to be reproduced, as indicated here before, it take lots of cash , time, and planning.

Also , think about this. We sell 2 different 1930-1931 Hub Caps. Both are stainless on the outside, and steel on the inside (2 piece construction), not the cheap 1 piece ones. the Taiwan one sells for $9. the perfect USA one sells for $27. In our store, every time anyone wants to buy any, we show them both to them. Side by side. Tell them one is USA made, and one is taiwan made. 95% of the time, they buy the cheap one, even when I tell them they are hard to make tight in the wheel.

One of the most interesting things that I don't think most here are aware of, is most of the companies that make Model A Parts now, started out as Model A owners that wanted a part to be made, so they made one. Then they made 10 more, then 100 more, then another different part, then 100 of them, then they quit their job and started making Model A parts for a living.

So......if you want a better light switch, or dash light, or whatever, you have choices. Find and original or make your own. Then make some more for everyone else.

Even better, restore the part that came with your car. So many people are way to lazy to restore a part, so they just by a new one and complain about it.



Steve Becker
Berts Model A Center
Isn't that the truth!

Pluck
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Old 05-09-2015, 11:55 AM   #96
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F r o n t F e n d e r s !

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Old 05-09-2015, 12:16 PM   #97
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Yes, but will folks really pay for a good quality fender, --or a new gas tank? If the price of a quality new front fender (--good enough to pass Fine-point Judging) were $1,500.00 a piece, how many people would honestly pay the price? Same thing about gas tanks. If a new tank were 1,000.00, would they sell like hot cakes --or would only a few step-up and pay? Now before we all answer, think about how many people have said if only someone made good quality shock absorbers, ....
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Old 05-09-2015, 02:16 PM   #98
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Yes, but will folks really pay for a good quality fender, --or a new gas tank? If the price of a quality new front fender (--good enough to pass Fine-point Judging) were $1,500.00 a piece, how many people would honestly pay the price? Same thing about gas tanks. If a new tank were 1,000.00, would they sell like hot cakes --or would only a few step-up and pay? Now before we all answer, think about how many people have said if only someone made good quality shock absorbers, ....
yeah I think you hit the nail on the head. BTW, do you think that 1,000.00 could even represent a fair retail price for that repro gas tank? That sounds low to me......
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Old 05-09-2015, 03:44 PM   #99
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Yes, but will folks really pay for a good quality fender, --or a new gas tank? If the price of a quality new front fender (--good enough to pass Fine-point Judging) were $1,500.00 a piece, how many people would honestly pay the price? Same thing about gas tanks. If a new tank were 1,000.00, would they sell like hot cakes --or would only a few step-up and pay? Now before we all answer, think about how many people have said if only someone made good quality shock absorbers, ....
Enough people to make it happen and a great quality USA Made Bill Stipe shock absorber is now available to all.....and they are selling like hot cakes !
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Old 05-09-2015, 07:15 PM   #100
Tom Wesenberg
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Ammeters that look and fit like originals, instead of being loose in the hole.

Also how about instrument panels that are nickel plated instead of chrome, and have the mounting holes in the right location.

Also 29-9 door inside handles and window cranks that are nickel plated instead of chrome.
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Old 05-09-2015, 07:55 PM   #101
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

The 1928-early 1930 Instrument panel is now made in Nickle with the correct holes and is very nice.

http://parts.modelastore.com/show_Product.asp?ID=12208


Ammeters coming soon.

Steve @ Berts
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Old 05-09-2015, 11:20 PM   #102
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

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The 1928-early 1930 Instrument panel is now made in Nickle with the correct holes and is very nice.

http://parts.modelastore.com/show_Product.asp?ID=12208


Ammeters coming soon.

Steve @ Berts
You get one in late 31 and you have a sale!
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Old 05-10-2015, 06:10 PM   #103
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

An express bed, our at least the front and tailgate. There are so many AAs around now that are available for restoration, and most folks with stakebeds aren't as interested in them as they are in express beds.
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Old 05-10-2015, 08:20 PM   #104
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikeinnj View Post
Enough people to make it happen and a great quality USA Made Bill Stipe shock absorber is now available to all.....and they are selling like hot cakes !
Selling like hot cakes huh??
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Old 05-11-2015, 06:18 AM   #105
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Steve
Will the ammeters be 20 or 30 amp ones and when will they be ready? The ones in both of my '28 A's and my '27 T are cheaply made and are loose fitting.
Thanks, Robert
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Old 05-11-2015, 06:33 AM   #106
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Quote:
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Selling like hot cakes huh??
You must have accurate sales figures then? Could you provide them here please?
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Old 05-11-2015, 07:36 AM   #107
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

I agree with Brent... I just bought a New Berg Radiator..... When all said and done $800 bucks. Yes it was expensive.... Quality was excellent!!!!! Did it work YOU BET!!!

Small shop... limited market..... top quality........= Higher cost.

I am a bit surprised a fuel tank has not been produced. I would think a market would exist between restoration and rodders?
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Old 05-11-2015, 03:07 PM   #108
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

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You must have accurate sales figures then? Could you provide them here please?

It really is not my place to share any of Bill's personal information he & I have discussed here. My take is if you feel you need to know his sales figures, then maybe it would be best if YOU contacted Bill and asked.
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Old 05-12-2015, 02:25 AM   #109
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

I can see that the quality versus cost issue is very real, BUT, does it cost any more to punch a hole in the exact location it should be instead of 1/8" or more off? Or, if a company is tooling up for a particular part, does it cost anymore to make a correct shaped die, for example, than one that is nowhere near proper dimensions? I can see better quality control and closer tolerances costing more, but why would a vendor accept parts that are designed wrong in the first place?
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Old 05-12-2015, 02:52 AM   #110
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

the title is;

"What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?"

It's not "Lets bitch about how many are crap and why."

We see there are people making parts that we want and need that fit and look good. Are they exact, some no, but they are better then most and far better then none.

Let me add that I get a knot on my stomach when I read/hear how something cannot be done. Talk should be, how we can do something, how can we get it done.

How many of you have kids/grandkids? When they say "I can't do it." do you say, "OK fine it's too (fill in the blank) for you, have a seat and rest."

So go back and reread this thread and see all the posts about why something cannot be done.
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Last edited by Mike V. Florida; 05-12-2015 at 03:24 AM.
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Old 05-12-2015, 04:50 AM   #111
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

All of them!!!!!!!!!
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Old 05-12-2015, 07:50 PM   #112
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

oddly enough, there might have been a very few repro parts available back in the '60s and '70s that were better than today's versions.

Many guys today report faulty ammeters and while there have always been fit and authenticity issues, I never had any performance issues with the older repros. Ditto for the light switches.

I recall Rick's Parts (gasp!) being among the first to advertise better-quality headlamp sockets. I perceived that the terminals sold on harnesses back then were improper and made my own out of miniature copper tubing, and never had a headlamp problem.

Back then, the dealers sold a somewhat-authentic looking Electrolock that was imported from Spain. Unfortunately the cable was too stiff and the thing was difficult to install. I wonder why an authentic version of the locking part never got reproduced, if the cable itself is now being made.

Overall, though, the quality of today's repros exceeds those of yesteryear, let alone the wider variety of items.
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Old 05-13-2015, 04:25 PM   #113
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Its great that you can now get parts for the right hand drive steering boxes, both 2 & 7 tooth. This has kept a lot of RH drive cars on the road. It would now be just wonderful if new RH drive PITMAN ARMS were available. Well better get back to work now the rain has stopped. Happy Motoring
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Old 05-13-2015, 11:15 PM   #114
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

A nice USA made ammeter........or headlight connectors that don't short..... keep it simple gentlemen
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Old 05-14-2015, 06:44 AM   #115
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

A 30/31 dash light that works correctly and doesn't go dead after one week.
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Old 05-14-2015, 08:12 AM   #116
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 40 Deluxe View Post
I can see that the quality versus cost issue is very real, BUT, does it cost any more to punch a hole in the exact location it should be instead of 1/8" or more off? Or, if a company is tooling up for a particular part, does it cost anymore to make a correct shaped die, for example, than one that is nowhere near proper dimensions? I can see better quality control and closer tolerances costing more, but why would a vendor accept parts that are designed wrong in the first place?

Being a machinist in my past life the answer is no. It does not cost more to do it right. It takes pride in what you are doing. Some people do it just for the money, could care less if it is right. As long as they can get away with it, it will not change.
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Old 05-14-2015, 08:26 AM   #117
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

I have to agree with ericr....... I first started fooling with Model A's in 1971 and I believe that TODAY we are seeing better made parts than what we had back then, and it is getting better every year.

With 3-D printing technology we will see even better quality parts down the road. Ten years from now we'll be saying 'Remember that such-and -such part back in '15? Wasn't the greatest fit but wow look what we have today!

Maybe we'll have electric Model A's by then
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Old 05-14-2015, 09:33 AM   #118
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

[QUOTE=Jeff/Illinois;1085555...Maybe we'll have electric Model A's by then[/QUOTE]
Check this out!
Attached Files
File Type: pdf electric model a[1].pdf (136.7 KB, 22 views)
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Old 05-14-2015, 11:44 AM   #119
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

how about ALL OF THEM
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Old 05-14-2015, 09:16 PM   #120
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Default Re: What Part Would You Want to See Reproduced with Quality?

Door Trim Panel Springs. The a/m ones are too thick and will not collapse far enough to get the door handle locking pin into place without a fight.

John Poole
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