The engine is loose....but

[Rparker28]

Just an update on my 29 town sedan barn find. Got my engine turning tool in today and so I went to work on getting the starter off and the tool on. There was slight hesitation at first when I began to pull the wrench and I went back and forth till the engine broke loose. I sprayed lubricant in the cylinders as a precaution so everything would stay wet and move freely. Cylinders 2,3 and 4 move with no issues but cylinder one does not move. The valves are opening in all cylinders. I took the tool off and put the starter back on and turned the engine over and I have compression in cylinders 2,3 and 4 but not one. The engine sounds strong but no activity in cylinder one. What is wrong? Ralph

[holdover]

you posted "but cylinder one does not move" Do you mean the piston does not go up and down in the cylinder? If that is what you mean, DO NOT rotate the engine until you pull the pan and check the connecting rod. You may be causing damage to the block/crankshaft. If you mean something else post what is happening. You state that you have compression in 2-3-4, so I assume that the head is still on. If it is are the valves on # one closing as well as opening, like the others? Long distance diagnosis is sometimes difficult. just trying to help

[Rparker28]

The piston in number one does not go up and down. It does not move. The head is still on. The valves are opening and closing on cylinder 1.......appreciate,Ralph

[George Miller]

Originally Posted by Rparker28

The piston in number one does not go up and down. It does not move. The head is still on. The valves are opening and closing on cylinder 1.......appreciate,Ralph

You probley have broken the top off the piston. Do not run it any more, take the head and pan off to make sure. If you keep running it you may have more problems.

[Rparker28]

Thanks George.......I have not run it anymore. I am looking for someone in my area to look at it,Ralph

[flatford39]

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What's an engine turning tool??? Why not just use a crank.

[Rparker28]

It is a tool that goes in the place of the starter and you can turn the engine that way through the flywheel. The crank would not turn.

[Jason in TX]

wow! Yeah. The piston has broken off the rod. If the rod may be going up and down in the piston, or the rod cap may have broken off the crank, or your crank cracked and you're only turning the crank from the flywheel, 4, 3 and 2. Is the front pulley turning? If so then the crank isn't broken.

[Rparker28]

The front pulley is turning. We did put the starter back on and turn the engine over. Cylinders 2,3 and 4 moved up and down and the pulley turned fine,Ralph

[daveymc29]

If the valves in number one are opening and closing and the piston is not moving, the crank is still intact. The piston has likely broken and so further turning with the broken parts inside won't do the cylinder walls any good. Head and pan have to come off. Time to pull the engine and disassemble it to determine what all will be required to make it good again. MHO

[Synchro909]

The fact that the front pulley is turning does not mean the crankshaft isn't broken.It may very well still turn if the break is anything but straight across the (probably a) journal. Such a clean break is unlikely. If the break is spiral, the pulley will still turn. Try turning the front pulley in one direction, then the other while looking at the flywheel. You will be looking for movement of the pulley to be matched exactly by movement of the flywheel in both directions.
All that said, like others above, I think you should remove the sump so you can see exactly what is going on. It's not a big job and it will answer a lit of ???s Also a good opportunity to clean it out.
Please keep us informed about what you find.

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

If no noises when cranking it over, most likely the piston top is broken loose from the rest of the piston.
Bill W.

[Rparker28]

Thanks Bill and all who responded. It is very much appreciated. There are no noises that I could discern when we turned the engine over. I feel like that was/is a good sign. There is engine work to be done and it may have been inevitable that the engine was going to have to be gotten into anyway. For that reason I am not discouraged by the set back but rather even more encouraged that this is the catalyst that will get the car back on the road even sooner. This community is very much appreciated by myself and the passion that is contained in the threads is contagious! We have a responsibility to get and keep these rolling pieces of history on the road so that the people that remember these cars can for a moment go back and relive the days when they were common place and were so vital to day to day existence. We also have the responsibility of getting these cars out in front of folks who would say: Model A? What is a Model A? Thanks to everyone who has commented and offered advice and also to those who have viewed my albums of my treasure and thanks for reading this far as I got on my soap box,Ralph

[JDupuis]

Hang in there Ralph. Hard work does not go unrewarded! Jeff

[Rex_A_Lott]

Just an FYI for you...There is a swap meet at the dragstrip at Commerce tomorrow morning. Its 90% drag racing stuff, but I have seen a few A Model parts over there.Not likely you will see any motor parts there, but you may run into somebody that has a stash. I'm sure you know about Mike s Affordable. Good luck

[Rparker28]

Thanks JD and Rex! Had a long day at work today but I am gonna get after it Saturday afternoon. Going with the grand babies in the mustang Saturday morning to the regional mustang show. Last time I went they had some vendors and I bought some stuff. You never know but they might have something. I have made a purchase from mikes a couple weeks ago. They seem to be good people as I had a problem with my order and they took care of it right away. I will post a picture of the mustang Saturday with my grand babies pit crew,Ralph

[Rparker28]

As promised.......a picture of my mustang and one member of my pit crew! We had a great day at the car show and I absolutely made contact with a fellow who brought his model a and won first place in his class. He has parts and knowledge like the folks here. A great day indeed!

[JDupuis]

Your pit crew looks like she would be good at detailing the wheels and wheel wells. Hope she had a good day today. Jeff

[Rparker28]

Absolutely! She had a good time and lasted all day. The car show went from 8:30 till 3:30. She said paw paw I just got a feeling we gonna win something. She was right and we won 3rd place in our class. The most important part of the day was the time shared. We went around and talked about different cars and she asked a lot of questions. It was a very good day,Ralph

[JDupuis]

Congratulations on ALL accounts. They need an extra trophy at the car shows just for the Grandkids. All would be 1st place. . Jeff

[Tony Hillyard]

Just to amuse you all.... a friend here in France has a 1931 Citroen C4. He is not a mechanic, but an excellent baker. Anyway he said his C4 was not running very well. So I had a look at it and did a compression test. No compression on No 2 cylinder.

So I took the cylinder head off and there was no piston to be seen!!!! I thought perhaps it was a joke, he was winding me up.

So I dropped the sump and raked around a found this lot. The crank was unharmed and the cylinder bore was unmarked.

[Synchro909]

Shrapnel!

[Rparker28]

Absolutely incredible! I hope that I don't have any major damage on mine. I am contacting a engine builder today that a friend of mine told me about Last night,Ralph

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by Tony Hillyard

Just to amuse you all.... a friend here in France has a 1931 Citroen C4. He is not a mechanic, but an excellent baker. Anyway he said his C4 was not running very well. So I had a look at it and did a compression test. No compression on No 2 cylinder.

So I took the cylinder head off and there was no piston to be seen!!!! I thought perhaps it was a joke, he was winding me up.

So I dropped the sump and raked around a found this lot. The crank was unharmed and the cylinder bore was unmarked.

Glue all those pieces onto a board, and it will make a nice wall hanging.

That's the most extreme blown rod and piston that I've seen, and it's hard to believe the cylinder and crankshaft weren't damaged.

[JDupuis]

Tony, excellent photo! Hope life is treating you well. Jeff

[H. L. Chauvin]

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Young military mechanics are well known for having great strength.

If WWIII ever starts, appears never a bad idea for the U.S. to ship boat loads of "Engine Turning Tools" to the enemies' Military Vehicle Repair Shops.

[Flathead]

Maybe this is why that A was parked all those years ago?

[SeaSlugs]

Originally Posted by Tony Hillyard

Just to amuse you all.... a friend here in France has a 1931 Citroen C4. He is not a mechanic, but an excellent baker. Anyway he said his C4 was not running very well. So I had a look at it and did a compression test. No compression on No 2 cylinder.

So I took the cylinder head off and there was no piston to be seen!!!! I thought perhaps it was a joke, he was winding me up.

So I dropped the sump and raked around a found this lot. The crank was unharmed and the cylinder bore was unmarked.

Did one of the connecting rod to crank bolts vibrate off then that caused the mayhem? One looks surprisingly undamaged while the cap is bent out like a tin can....

[Tony Hillyard]

I think that must have been what happened Seaslugs. That is the conclusion I came to. You would have thought the driver would have stopped before the final death noise drove him completely mad!

[SeaSlugs]

Originally Posted by Tony Hillyard

I think that must have been what happened Seaslugs. That is the conclusion I came to. You would have thought the driver would have stopped before the final death noise drove him completely mad!

That had to have sounded awful and would have felt that even if you were completely deaf haha

[aermotor]

Where did the wrist pin end up in post #21?

John

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by aermotor

Where did the wrist pin end up in post #21?

John

It's still clamped tightly in the rod.