Merger again considered, Credible opinions requested

[ctvpa]

This morning MAFCA posted:

MAFCA announces it's "15 in 15 Membership Program!" MAFCA has set a goal of 15,000 members in 2015. We are asking all MAFCA members to help achieve this goal. Your chapter has received special incentives to achieve the goal, contact your Chapter representative for more information!

I replied :
I would like an honest opinion. I know this is a hot topic, but it is relevant.

In today's world, all social type clubs are losing members. When I was young there was many choices, the garden club, camera club, Masonic or Knights, etc. Most all are dwindling or gone.

I am well aware of the circumstances that caused the separation that divided one national club into two national Model A clubs.
But I am going ask that controversial taboo question.

Why can't MAFCA & MARC merge into one.

Currently both clubs compete for members, maintain two headquarters, publish two magazines, organize two different sets of national meets (both attempting to attract members from the same limited, and reducing, number of Model A owners).

I have posted this an several Model A based sites, and the overwhelming response is that members support a merger to one club.

With this, the operating costs would drop dramatically. The cost of having two headquarters, two sets of employees, two publications, opposing national meets, and membership dues all would benefit.
With a merger I can only think of how this would positively benefit the dues paying members.

With increasing dues for both clubs, and so many of our membership on fixed incomes, more are forced to choose one over the other. Many are 'opting out'.

Now is the time to forgive and forget the history that divided our club. That is in the past. Let us place our direction on the future.

Please answer directly, what is the reason that prevents the two clubs from uniting into one larger, organized, efficient national club?
Thank you.

[spdway1]

I agree with the comment above. Merging or joining forces is the way the world is going to save money for EVERYONE involved. Every day you see in the news a businesses merging, yesterday was Travelocity and Expedia, it only makes $ense.

[pat in Santa Cruz]

In every club I have been in, at some point someone gets P.O.'d or otherwise has a political difference that makes them want to leave and form or join another club. That's why there will always be at least 2 clubs.

[southfork]

I agree with ctvpa completely. Logic should always prevail.

[Tom Wesenberg]

They will merge when Studebaker and Packard merge.

Oh, wait, they did merge and look what happened.

[Fred]

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When the Polar Bears move to Key West Florida, It might happen..

[ctvpa]

Until us, as members, bring this topic up, and demand either answers or action, of course it will never happen. But to sit back and say it 'just will not happen' without commenting on why, is one reason why it has not happened.
I have also requested an annual report from both clubs, to see for myself where the money is going to, and have been told that the information is 'Not Available'.
If we say we want to bring the hobby into the future, stop the duplicity, and increase efficiently, maybe withholding our dues may make a statement.

[Fred K-OR]

Competition is one of the few freedoms we still have in this country. Yes it does divide us but the best competitor will win out. So I feel a choice is still a freedom we should have.

[Patrick L.]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

They will merge when Studebaker and Packard merge.

Oh, wait, they did merge and look what happened.

My Grandfather took on Studebaker in 1918 and I was born in the parts room. The 'merge' took place when I was a kid and he always likened it to two drunks trying each other cross the street.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

We beat this horse to death every time it surfaces!!



I disagree with most every part of your proposal & thoughts. The biggest reason why they do not need to merge is the same reason why we need two branches of Government in this country. The two opposing views keep everything in cheque. If there were only one club, there would be someone (many??) who did not agree with their motives or goals, and the next thing you know, there would be a 2nd club again.

First off, they teach us in economics that what you are proposing doesn't always prove to be successful. Matter of fact, most will tell you that history shows they fail. Since we are speaking about a car club, name car companies that merged where both marques succeeded. Tom mentioned Packard & Studebaker merging. This merge was to help them save costs and be stronger yet history proved that both succumbed to the merge. Even in recent years, each of the Big 3 auto makers have tried to merge with companies to give them a financial advantage, ...and in all cases, the merge proved to be a Fail.

Second, the two clubs are NOT necessarily competing against each other. They're actively soliciting for a new member(s) which are not members of either club. Some hobbyists see a valve in belonging to both, -some to just one, ...and the kicker, many here are not a member of either club!! THOSE are the ones they are seeking as members.

Now one point I will argue with you to the end does not necessarily apply just to joining a club. Personally, I get so tired of hearing people say they are on fixed incomes. Isn't that really just a fabricated excuse??!! I would venture a guess that better than 95% of this world's citizens are on a "fixed income". I know I am! There are things in this world I say I cannot do/own, ...HOWEVER when the truth is known, the reason that I cannot afford it is simply because it really is not a strong priority of mine. The same applies here, anyone that truly wants to be a club member can find a way to be a club member!! (Get a part-time job, sell an asset, cut back on eating out, etc.) The only reason people are 'opting out' is because membership is not a high enough priority for them.

[Steve Plucker]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

We beat this horse to death every time it surfaces!!



I disagree with most every part of your proposal & thoughts. The biggest reason why they do not need to merge is the same reason why we need two branches of Government in this country. The two opposing views keep everything in cheque. If there were only one club, there would be someone (many??) who did not agree with their motives or goals, and the next thing you know, there would be a 2nd club again.

First off, they teach us in economics that what you are proposing doesn't always prove to be successful. Matter of fact, most will tell you that history shows they fail. Since we are speaking about a car club, name car companies that merged where both marques succeeded. Tom mentioned Packard & Studebaker merging. This merge was to help them save costs and be stronger yet history proved that both succumbed to the merge. Even in recent years, each of the Big 3 auto makers have tried to merge with companies to give them a financial advantage, ...and in all cases, the merge proved to be a Fail.

Second, the two clubs are NOT necessarily competing against each other. They're actively soliciting for a new member(s) which are not members of either club. Some hobbyists see a valve in belonging to both, -some to just one, ...and the kicker, many here are not a member of either club!! THOSE are the ones they are seeking as members.

Now one point I will argue with you to the end does not necessarily apply just to joining a club. Personally, I get so tired of hearing people say they are on fixed incomes. Isn't that really just a fabricated excuse??!! I would venture a guess that better than 95% of this world's citizens are on a "fixed income". I know I am! There are things in this world I say I cannot do/own, ...HOWEVER when the truth is known, the reason that I cannot afford it is simply because it really is not a strong priority of mine. The same applies here, anyone that truly wants to be a club member can find a way to be a club member!! (Get a part-time job, sell an asset, cut back on eating out, etc.) The only reason people are 'opting out' is because membership is not a high enough priority for them.

And to add to this...BOTH clubs advertise in each other's magizine...MARC in The Restorer (MAFCA) and MAFCA in Model A News (MARC)!

Pluck

[ctvpa]

Thank you, Very good points. I appreciate the honest input.
By fixed income, I am referring to retired members, and their income has not kept up with cost of living.
I still believe in my comments, and that the division looses more than it gains. However you have made excellent points.
This type of non-confrontational discussion is what I hoped for.

[Fred]

Originally Posted by ctvpa

Until us, as members, bring this topic up, and demand either answers or action, of course it will never happen. But to sit back and say it 'just will not happen' without commenting on why, is one reason why it has not happened.
I have also requested an annual report from both clubs, to see for myself where the money is going to, and have been told that the information is 'Not Available'.
If we say we want to bring the hobby into the future, stop the duplicity, and increase efficiently, maybe withholding our dues may make a statement.

The information you asked for, I am pretty sure is all printed in each Magazine once a year for all to see..

[Marco Tahtaras]

Originally Posted by ctvpa

Until us, as members, bring this topic up, and demand either answers or action, of course it will never happen. But to sit back and say it 'just will not happen' without commenting on why, is one reason why it has not happened.
I have also requested an annual report from both clubs, to see for myself where the money is going to, and have been told that the information is 'Not Available'.
If we say we want to bring the hobby into the future, stop the duplicity, and increase efficiently, maybe withholding our dues may make a statement.

Do whatever you wish but I'll bet that most folks that ARE members of both clubs are like me and have no interest in changing that. Ironically, many of the folks speaking loudest in favor last time this topic was BEAT TO DEATH admittedly were not members of either club. And lastly, I sure don't need anyone else attempting to take away MY options as they currently stand.

[ericr]

I'd like to have a knowledgeable member of both clubs to cogently state what he feels the difference between the two clubs may be. I've read a lot of strongly-held opinions but it would help more if someone can comment specifically on the desirability of two clubs.

[ctvpa]

Originally Posted by Fred

The information you asked for, I am pretty sure is all printed in each Magazine once a year for all to see..

No, I want an annual financial report, like most companies offer. The information inside the magazine is just basic info.

[mshmodela]

ctvpa,

I completely agree! Like the AFL and CIO ( American Federation of Labor and Congress of Industrial Organizations) they too had no choice to become the AFL-CIO and they where a HELL of lot larger. All a matter of time...

[ctvpa]

Thank everyone for keeping this mostly civil. Just as an update, this is posted in several sites. Currently , from the posts , p.m.'s and emails, about 70% feel a merger or mutual affiliation would benefit them. 7 people said that they are dual membership, and when asked 5 said that are considering not renewing both, but will choose one.
Some offered changes that they would like to see. One suggested one magazine that featured both.
Rude obnoxious comments, so far is only 1.
Thank you everyone for their input.

[Fred]

Originally Posted by ctvpa

No, I want an annual financial report, like most companies offer. The information inside the magazine is just basic info.

And the "Need To Know", is ??

[Jim Mason]

I'm a member of both clubs. From the arguments that I see the people that want the merger just want everyone else to agree with their opinion. Personally I like the choice