Little off topic, metallic paint.

[old guy rich]

I'm hoping someone can help me with my problem of orange peel in metallic paint. I'm trying to paint my 50 Merc. Banning Blue metallic, single stage acrylic enamel. I have painted the skirts 6 times each after sanding and no matter what I try I have bad orange peel. I've tried different air pressures, gun different distances from the car, changed the speed of the stroke and finally tried thinning the paint. Any ideas will be welcome. I'm not a painter by any means, but have painted a few cars years ago. Using an hvlp gun. Thanks, old guy rich.

[john worden]

Reducer choice is critical. The product information sheet will specify temperature rating and mix ratio of paint/acrylic enamel reducer.
Short cuts = disaster.

[ronzmtrwrx]

John Worden is correct. Gun setup is also equally critical. Are you using a 1.3 or 1.4 size tip? How many rounds out from seated have you screwed the fluid tip adjuster? How much air pressure? These are just a few of the variables that will determine how your paint lays down.

[Paul Bennett]

You should be buying paint from a dealer you can have a serious discussion with on any issue. I've felt part of the high paint price is for the support you should be getting for a super job.

[A bones]

I'm not a painter either. I know what orange peel looks like. If however, by bad orange peel you mean what is known as fish eye, I must tell you what an old body man told me. 'Never allow WD-40 near the shop where painting takes place. ( I do like the stuff ) It gets in the air and seems to spread and linger. It will cause the job to fail. Good luck.

And yes, as always John Worden is a proven expert.

[old guy rich]

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Thanks guys, John, I bought a kit from the local auto paint store and they supplied the hardener, thinner and mix ratio (8-1). I followed their instructions.
Ron, I am using a 1.4 tip and have tried from all the way out to almost all the way in on the fluid adjustment. Air pressure from 12 psi up to 25 psi in small increments.
Paul, the price does seem high (one gal=$180) plus the extra stuff. This store only sells auto paint and tries to help.
A Bones, the orange peel is not fish-eye, I know what that is. No wd40 used for months. Again, thanks for your replies guys. old guy rich.

[waterboychuck]

It sounds like your air pressure is to low. How are you adjusting the pressure?What does the instructions on the gun say about the pressure?

[37 Cab]

Try a slower reducer. That may help. You should be able to do a whole panel and have it wet to a sheen. If not.. Flash time is too fast.

[silvertop]

Old Guy Rich;
Your HVLP gun requires a much larger volume of air than a conventional gun. If you are using a 1/4" or 3/8" hose with 1/4" quick couplers you are not getting the volume of air that is required for efficient use of your hvlp gun. I would suggest turning your separator regulator up to 90psi. and regulating the air at the gun to 18-22psi. Also double check that mixing ratio of 8-1-1. I have used many manufacturers acrylic enamel and have not seen that mixing ratio for any of their products.

[old guy rich]

Waterboy, air pressure out of the tank is 100psi, I have a regulator at the gun for adjustments. Instructions say max psi 25. I have gone down to 12 psi.
37cab, I will try a slower reducer, but the paint store guy said it is not necessary to reduce it, just paint with it. The reducing was my idea. The door had a wet look and looked really good until it dried and then orange peel came.
Silvertop, I am using exactly what you said. I will ask the paint shop if I can vary that ratio to help with my problem. Maybe I should google that paint mfg and see what they recommend.
Thanks guys for the help. I appreciate it. old guy rich

[waterboychuck]

So your instructions call for 25 PSI at the gun. When you set your regulator are you setting it with the trigger open so that air can flow without paint?

[rotorwrench]

There are a lot of things that can cause the surface to mottle with metallics or orange peel. This is a link to a good explanation. http://www.collisionblast.com/2012/0...-eliminate-it/
Cleaning the surface to be sprayed is the most important part of final prep. Keeping it clean after is also important. An engine running too close to the project with the air flow around it just right (or wrong depending on how you look at it) can contaminate the surface before you put down the first coat.

I guess I'm just old. I still paint with either a syphon feed gun or a pressure pot. I have an old Sharp HVLP gun but it is still new in the box. With my gun set at around 45 to 50 PSI, that paint really flows. I admit, a lot ends up on the floor but it sure looks good on there.

[old guy rich]

Originally Posted by waterboychuck

So your instructions call for 25 PSI at the gun. When you set your regulator are you setting it with the trigger open so that air can flow without paint?

Waterboy, I went back and re read the instructions. All it says is 45psi max, I set the regulator at 40 psi to start with, with the trigger pulled all the way and the regulator reads about 25 psi. Thanks, old guy

[old guy rich]

Originally Posted by ronzmtrwrx

John Worden is correct. Gun setup is also equally critical. Are you using a 1.3 or 1.4 size tip? How many rounds out from seated have you screwed the fluid tip adjuster? How much air pressure? These are just a few of the variables that will determine how your paint lays down.

Back reading the manual it suggests using a 1.2 tip for automotive base. I will get one tomorrow and try it. Thanks, old guy.

[Tony, NY]

You're not painting base/clearcoat.
Just curious. Are you wet sanding out the orange peel and buffing? Don't understand the sanding part and respraying. Orange peel is common in paint jobs by a hobbyist.

[Tony, NY]

Recently I asked my autobody supply guy about PPG acrylic enamel because I have a 25+ year old paint job that needs a respray. It has held up well and I like acrylic enamel. Well it's being phased out. Why not go with a urethane? May be it's a paint match like mine is.

[old guy rich]

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

There are a lot of things that can cause the surface to mottle with metallics or orange peel. This is a link to a good explanation. http://www.collisionblast.com/2012/0...-eliminate-it/
Cleaning the surface to be sprayed is the most important part of final prep. Keeping it clean after is also important. An engine running too close to the project with the air flow around it just right (or wrong depending on how you look at it) can contaminate the surface before you put down the first coat.

I guess I'm just old. I still paint with either a syphon feed gun or a pressure pot. I have an old Sharp HVLP gun but it is still new in the box. With my gun set at around 45 to 50 PSI, that paint really flows. I admit, a lot ends up on the floor but it sure looks good on there.

rotorwrench, watched that video and several others, cool site. Hard to digest all that info but I got some food for thought. Thank you. old guy

[john worden]

Originally Posted by old guy rich

Waterboy, air pressure out of the tank is 100psi, I have a regulator at the gun for adjustments. Instructions say max psi 25. I have gone down to 12 psi.
37cab, I will try a slower reducer, but the paint store guy said it is not necessary to reduce it, just paint with it. The reducing was my idea. The door had a wet look and looked really good until it dried and then orange peel came.
Silvertop, I am using exactly what you said. I will ask the paint shop if I can vary that ratio to help with my problem. Maybe I should google that paint mfg and see what they recommend.
Thanks guys for the help. I appreciate it. old guy rich

In this post you said " the paint store guy said it is not necessary to reduce it "
As far as I know there is not one acrylic enamel for automotive use that does not require reduction.
Consult the paint manufacturers Information Data Sheet for accurate information and then educate the paint guy with it.

[old guy rich]

Originally Posted by Tony, NY

You're not painting base/clearcoat.
Just curious. Are you wet sanding out the orange peel and buffing? Don't understand the sanding part and respraying. Orange peel is common in paint jobs by a hobbyist.

Tony, the sanding I referred to was after the paint dried and I was wet sanding to try another paint job. Can't sand metallic, it screws it up. It seems that after you spray metallic, you got what you got, no fixing.. I can live with a little orange peel, but mine is more than a little !! Thanks. old guy.

[bill3337]

Just curious, but you haven't mentioned the brand of HVLP gun, or I missed it. It could be the tip isn't giving good atomization. I only spray base/clear, but I set my main regulator to 120 lbs and cut it back at the gun regulator to about 15 lbs, likely different for single stage. Base recommends 10 lbs at the air cap. (but hard to measure at the cap directly). You said the paint looked good when first sprayed, then develops orange peel as it dries....I haven't run into that before. A good forum to try out is http://www.spiuserforum.com/index.php, you can ask experts for their opinions on there. It sounds to me like a combination of air pressure and distance from the surface. With HOK base I spray at 4" to 6" from the surface with a full fan and minimum 50% overlap. I suppose you could spray clear coat over the single stage and colour sand and polish that out. It would be better than losing your paint job. Just my amateur opinion.....good luck, Bill