The Ford Barn

Lugnutt · 06-27-2021, 05:49 PM

I have a 1931 model a Tudor with no reverse all forward gears work. Any help would be appreciated

redmodelt · 06-27-2021, 06:33 PM

More information would be needed to give suggestions on what may be wrong. How long have you had no reverse? Is there any noise? Have you taken the cover off to look inside? Is this car new to you? We can make wild guesses, some of which may be correct some not. What ever the issue is will be inside the transmission, we can not see that, so you need to have a look see.

Or be like the 58 Morris Minor I had with no reverse, had to push it into the parking spaces. Fun parallel parking in downtown Portland!

nkaminar · 06-27-2021, 06:40 PM

There are forks inside the transmission that move the gears inside for first, second, third, and reverse. The reverse gear could be damaged or the shift tower that moves the forks could be damaged.

It is a simple mater to peek inside the transmission by removing the shift tower. Remove the floor boards after removing any carpeting or mats. Put the car in neutral. Remove the bolts holding the sift tower, the part that has the sift lever attached to. Check the shift tower to see if it is shifting into reverse correctly (it should have full range and click into position).

There are three shafts in the transmission, the main shaft, the counter shaft on the bottom and a short shaft that holds the reverse gear. Look inside with a flash light or light to see what is not right. It is likely that you will have to rebuild the transmission but look first to see what is wrong. If you are lucky there will be something blocking the shift tower from completely moving into reverse.

Cover the transmission with cardboard so that nothing falls inside.

Put the sift tower back into neutral before re-installing. Use a new gasket and clean the mating surfaces. Make sure the two forks engage the two collars inside the transmission.

Tom Endy · 06-27-2021, 07:34 PM

Does the car have a Borg Warner overdrive?

Tom Endy

Lugnutt · 06-27-2021, 07:54 PM

Thanks for replying; had the car for about a year and 1/2. It wasn’t running then. I got the engine rebuilt and it seems to run ok. I took the shifter plate off and I can move the reverse/first and second/third clusters back and forth freely. If I have it in reverse the gears turn and the reverse idler also turns. I have a new clutch and throw-out bearing. I drives normal when going forward in all gears.

alexiskai · 06-28-2021, 12:04 AM

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Have you reached out to the Lehigh Valley club? Somebody might be able to come down and help diagnose the problem.

nkaminar · 06-28-2021, 05:18 AM

Some of the things that can cause the transmission to not shift correctly are worn forks, the ball at the end of the shifter worn to a square shape, the detent spring broken or weak, the detent grooves worn, and probably others that I don't know about.

As Tom alluded to, if you have the Borg Warner overdrive it can cause problems if you are in overdrive and try to back up.

Try posting some photos.

deuce5wndw · 06-28-2021, 07:16 AM

Ok you have the top off check the countershaft or sometimes called cluster gear to make sure it is engaged to the reverse idler gear and no teeth are missing, then slide the low\ reverse slider gear back to engage the reverse idler gear. You should have reverse if nothing is broken like missing teeth. If all of the above checks out it can only be the shift tower.
Dale

redmodelt · 06-28-2021, 11:19 AM

If you have 1st and unless the reverse idler gear is missing or major teeth damage, you should have reverse. They both use the same sliding gear and fork. When the low/reverse sliding gear is slid back it engages the idler gear not the gear on the cluster shaft. I don't think a worn ball would explain it, if you can drive the car in 1st, but could be a bent fork not allowing the low/reverse sliding gear to move back far enough to engage the reverse idler gear. The cluster gears are on the shaft below the sliding gears, and the reverse idler gear is to the left looking down from the rear.

deuce5wndw · 06-28-2021, 11:49 AM

The reverse idler gear engages the cluster gear so missing teeth there would cause no reverse.
Dale

Doug Linden · 06-28-2021, 02:07 PM

As Tom mentioned earlier, if you have Borg Warner Overdrive and the plunger is pushed in to engage the OD, you will have no reverse gear. Pull the Overdrive plunger out and reverse will work.

Lugnutt · 07-10-2021, 09:05 AM

I do not have an overdrive. I removed the shift plate with the transmission in reverse and with the engine running I release the clutch the gears turn as designed. Again all forward gears work and the car moves fine in all gears, once it’s shifted into reverse and release the clutch I feel a slight tension but no movement of the vehicle.

Gary WA · 07-10-2021, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lugnutt

I do not have an overdrive. I removed the shift plate with the transmission in reverse and with the engine running I release the clutch the gears turn as designed. Again all forward gears work and the car moves fine in all gears, once it’s shifted into reverse and release the clutch I feel a slight tension but no movement of the vehicle.

Did you have reverse in the past? Did you work on Transmission? The Reverse Idler gear in the transmission case the flush side of the gear faces the rear of the transmission?Also I believe that the tranny gears must be in the neutral position when you put the tower back on and line the forks up-can anyone else verify this?That's the way I do mine. after reading your statement it does go into reverse? I had same problem years ago it was a tooth broken in the rear end and when you back up the oil would pick up tooth and jamb?Pull drain plug see if anything other than oil comes out.try fish magnet in drain plg hole.

Big hammer · 07-10-2021, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lugnutt

I do not have an overdrive. I removed the shift plate with the transmission in reverse and with the engine running I release the clutch the gears turn as designed. Again all forward gears work and the car moves fine in all gears, once it’s shifted into reverse and release the clutch I feel a slight tension but no movement of the vehicle.

Try this with the rear end on jack stands and the front end wheels chalked. If the wheels try to turn or turn you may have issues with the rear end

Will N · 07-10-2021, 12:44 PM

I wonder if maybe an axle is broken in such a way that it will move the car forward but not rearward? Try jacking up the rear tires and pull on them outward, away from the center differential while turning them rearward.

06-27-2021, 05:49 PM	#1
Lugnutt Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2020 Location: Doylestown, pa Posts: 3	No reverse I have a 1931 model a Tudor with no reverse all forward gears work. Any help would be appreciated

06-27-2021, 06:33 PM	#2
redmodelt Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Portland OR Posts: 6,340	Re: No reverse More information would be needed to give suggestions on what may be wrong. How long have you had no reverse? Is there any noise? Have you taken the cover off to look inside? Is this car new to you? We can make wild guesses, some of which may be correct some not. What ever the issue is will be inside the transmission, we can not see that, so you need to have a look see. Or be like the 58 Morris Minor I had with no reverse, had to push it into the parking spaces. Fun parallel parking in downtown Portland! __________________ I know the voices aren't real but damn they have some good ideas!

06-27-2021, 06:40 PM	#3
nkaminar Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Western North Carolina Posts: 3,897	Re: No reverse There are forks inside the transmission that move the gears inside for first, second, third, and reverse. The reverse gear could be damaged or the shift tower that moves the forks could be damaged. It is a simple mater to peek inside the transmission by removing the shift tower. Remove the floor boards after removing any carpeting or mats. Put the car in neutral. Remove the bolts holding the sift tower, the part that has the sift lever attached to. Check the shift tower to see if it is shifting into reverse correctly (it should have full range and click into position). There are three shafts in the transmission, the main shaft, the counter shaft on the bottom and a short shaft that holds the reverse gear. Look inside with a flash light or light to see what is not right. It is likely that you will have to rebuild the transmission but look first to see what is wrong. If you are lucky there will be something blocking the shift tower from completely moving into reverse. Cover the transmission with cardboard so that nothing falls inside. Put the sift tower back into neutral before re-installing. Use a new gasket and clean the mating surfaces. Make sure the two forks engage the two collars inside the transmission. __________________ A is for apple, green as the sky. Step on the gas, for tomorrow I die. Forget the brakes, they really don't work. The clutch always sticks, and starts with a jerk. My car grows red hair, and flies through the air. Driving's a blast, a blast from the past.

06-27-2021, 07:34 PM	#4
Tom Endy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Southern California Posts: 3,131	Re: No reverse Does the car have a Borg Warner overdrive? Tom Endy

06-27-2021, 07:54 PM	#5
Lugnutt Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2020 Location: Doylestown, pa Posts: 3	Re: No reverse Thanks for replying; had the car for about a year and 1/2. It wasn’t running then. I got the engine rebuilt and it seems to run ok. I took the shifter plate off and I can move the reverse/first and second/third clusters back and forth freely. If I have it in reverse the gears turn and the reverse idler also turns. I have a new clutch and throw-out bearing. I drives normal when going forward in all gears.

06-28-2021, 12:04 AM	#6
alexiskai Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Location: Mebane NC Posts: 2,354	Re: No reverse Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Have you reached out to the Lehigh Valley club? Somebody might be able to come down and help diagnose the problem.

06-28-2021, 05:18 AM	#7
nkaminar Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Western North Carolina Posts: 3,897	Re: No reverse Some of the things that can cause the transmission to not shift correctly are worn forks, the ball at the end of the shifter worn to a square shape, the detent spring broken or weak, the detent grooves worn, and probably others that I don't know about. As Tom alluded to, if you have the Borg Warner overdrive it can cause problems if you are in overdrive and try to back up. Try posting some photos. __________________ A is for apple, green as the sky. Step on the gas, for tomorrow I die. Forget the brakes, they really don't work. The clutch always sticks, and starts with a jerk. My car grows red hair, and flies through the air. Driving's a blast, a blast from the past. Last edited by nkaminar; 06-28-2021 at 05:23 AM.

06-28-2021, 07:16 AM	#8
deuce5wndw Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Liberty, KY Posts: 901	Re: No reverse Ok you have the top off check the countershaft or sometimes called cluster gear to make sure it is engaged to the reverse idler gear and no teeth are missing, then slide the low\ reverse slider gear back to engage the reverse idler gear. You should have reverse if nothing is broken like missing teeth. If all of the above checks out it can only be the shift tower. Dale

06-28-2021, 11:19 AM	#9
redmodelt Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Portland OR Posts: 6,340	Re: No reverse If you have 1st and unless the reverse idler gear is missing or major teeth damage, you should have reverse. They both use the same sliding gear and fork. When the low/reverse sliding gear is slid back it engages the idler gear not the gear on the cluster shaft. I don't think a worn ball would explain it, if you can drive the car in 1st, but could be a bent fork not allowing the low/reverse sliding gear to move back far enough to engage the reverse idler gear. The cluster gears are on the shaft below the sliding gears, and the reverse idler gear is to the left looking down from the rear. __________________ I know the voices aren't real but damn they have some good ideas!

06-28-2021, 11:49 AM	#10
deuce5wndw Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Liberty, KY Posts: 901	Re: No reverse The reverse idler gear engages the cluster gear so missing teeth there would cause no reverse. Dale

06-28-2021, 02:07 PM	#11
Doug Linden Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 259	Re: No reverse As Tom mentioned earlier, if you have Borg Warner Overdrive and the plunger is pushed in to engage the OD, you will have no reverse gear. Pull the Overdrive plunger out and reverse will work.

07-10-2021, 09:05 AM	#12
Lugnutt Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2020 Location: Doylestown, pa Posts: 3	Re: No reverse I do not have an overdrive. I removed the shift plate with the transmission in reverse and with the engine running I release the clutch the gears turn as designed. Again all forward gears work and the car moves fine in all gears, once it’s shifted into reverse and release the clutch I feel a slight tension but no movement of the vehicle.

07-10-2021, 12:44 PM	#15
Will N Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 1,100	Re: No reverse I wonder if maybe an axle is broken in such a way that it will move the car forward but not rearward? Try jacking up the rear tires and pull on them outward, away from the center differential while turning them rearward.