The Ford Barn

DadsRoadster · 01-23-2016, 12:36 PM

I am new to the forum and looking for advice to get my dad's 31 Roadster "on the road". He bought the car in 1950 when he was 13 and it has been sitting in his basement since around 1960. It has been one of those projects you want to get around to but never did. Due to dad's failing health I am going to try to get the car assembled and road worthy as soon as possible--hoping that he will be able to drive it again.

My first question (of many) is about the engine. We still have the V860 that dad last had in the car along with the transmission. Dad says it is a good engine. We have a couple of Model A blocks, lots of misc parts, and a complete engine that appears to have a cracked block. My question is: how hard would it be to put the V860 back in it? Are there after market mounts available? Will it bolt up to the Model A driveshaft?

Again--we are not building a show car here--I just want to get it back on the road. Plus I think it would be cool to drive it the way dad drove it back in the '50's. If anyone can point me in the right direction or has already built one this way their advice would be much appreciated. Thx.

BRENT in 10-uh-C · 01-23-2016, 01:54 PM

Welcome to Fordbarn <insert name here>. While there may be a couple folks here that can help you, this site was set-up by Ryan to be more of a hangout for restoration however don't be discouraged as Ryan also has a sister-site called Jalopy Journal (HAMB) that you will likely find quite a few folks that own a V8-60 powered Model-A.

One other thing that I will offer my advice on is that a V8-60 is a cool looking engine however they actually have less torque & horsepower than what an equally built banger has. Both are costly to build but back in your Dad's day, there was limited speed parts for the Model-A compared to the V-8s however things are different today. With that said, you have some difficult decisions to make on which direction is 'best'.

DadsRoadster · 01-23-2016, 02:30 PM

Thanks Brent. I really appreciate your advice. You are correct that choosing the engine is a tough choice. Dad would rather use a Model A engine--we were just thinking using the V860 would get us on the road faster. Maybe I can locate a decent Model A engine that we could use.

I will check out the other forum. I also checked out your website. Wow--you guys do awesome work. I may give you a call next week to see if you guys can build the car for us. It may be that letting experts like yourself do it makes a lot more sense.

Thanks again.

BRENT in 10-uh-C · 01-23-2016, 02:35 PM

Thanks for the kudos. As soon as the white stuff leaves and we get back to normal weather, why don't you and your Dad make a road trip up to the shop, -not to discuss business but more about letting him get his 'battery charged' looking at projects we are working on.

Mitch//pa · 01-23-2016, 02:39 PM

Sounds like a great field trip...

DadsRoadster · 01-23-2016, 03:03 PM

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We will definitely do that. I'll let you know before we head that way. My name is Greg by the way. Thanks again.

1930artdeco · 01-23-2016, 09:02 PM

Welcome Greg,

That is a great project you have going for you. Something to consider is that I believe you will need to fabricate some front motor mounts for the V8 and I think you will need to look at an adapter plate for the tranny. And if it is speed you want down the line you can add an overdrive and maybe change the gears and you will be getting speeding tickets in no time flat.

Mike

Tom Wesenberg · 01-23-2016, 11:27 PM

Take some pictures of the engines and engine compartment to show Brent when you go there.
I agree with your dad and Brent that the Model A engine would be the better choice.

old car guy · 01-23-2016, 11:52 PM

Good luck on what you are trying to get done in a timely manner. What shape are the other blocks that you have in the basement. You also mentioned loads of parts. Some pictures here would help to have the folks here give you some better advise. As Brent said in his post you have some tough decisions to make,however my comment would be to put it back the way your dad wants it.you can hop it up per say without doing any permanent damage if you wisely install the parts with cutting or damaging the frame and related parts.and down the road when things change you can restore the car properly to the way ford sent it out the road. And ps Brent Terry will do you a superb job.

DadsRoadster · 01-24-2016, 11:12 PM

Thanks Mike for the advice on the little V8. I have read that a lot of folks do not care for that engine but unfortunately that is what we have. I am going to keep looking for a Model A engine but I think we can make the V8 work at least temporarily. Can't wait to get it on the road.

DadsRoadster · 01-24-2016, 11:19 PM

Thanks for the advice Tom. Hopefully we can find a good Model A engine for the roadster. I will take Brent some pics for sure.

DadsRoadster · 01-24-2016, 11:41 PM

Thanks OCG. I will try to get some pics on here. I am not sure about the condition of the other blocks. I bought the complete Model A engine a couple of years ago. It looked great but looks can be deceiving. We started it up and water poured out of the head and block. The parts on it look new and supposedly it has roller bearings instead of Babbitt. Not sure if that is a good thing or not. I agree about Brent. From what I have seen he would do a great job. I wish I had the skills to do it myself. This is definitely a car that we plan to keep in the family and pass on to my son someday. i look forward to getting started and to more great advice/knowledge from you guys.

Mike V. Florida · 01-25-2016, 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DadsRoadster

Thanks OCG. I will try to get some pics on here. I am not sure about the condition of the other blocks. I bought the complete Model A engine a couple of years ago. It looked great but looks can be deceiving. We started it up and water poured out of the head and block. The parts on it look new and supposedly it has roller bearings instead of Babbitt. Not sure if that is a good thing or not. I agree about Brent. From what I have seen he would do a great job. I wish I had the skills to do it myself. This is definitely a car that we plan to keep in the family and pass on to my son someday. i look forward to getting started and to more great advice/knowledge from you guys.

Say what!

Tom Wesenberg · 01-25-2016, 03:03 AM

When I was in the 7th grade I wrote a letter to General Motors asking them why they didn't use roller bearings instead of insert bushings. They sent me a reply simply stating that the engineers felt the bushings were better.

Some motorcycles and small engines use roller and ball bearings, but I'm not aware of any larger car engines using them.

DadsRoadster · 01-25-2016, 06:17 AM

I really have no idea. You guys know better than me. Supposedly an upgrade over the poured bearings--but the guy may have been full of it. I will report back if I ever tear that motor down.

larrys40 · 01-25-2016, 09:13 AM

Greg , as the guys have said the model a engine is the best choice
I've worked on and driven several v8 60 powered A's and the 60 grossly underpowers the A. You are much better off finding a decent A engine it buying a rebuilt outright
Just my recommendation .
Larry Shepard

Roadster Rich · 01-25-2016, 01:21 PM

Greg, that probably means it might have insert bearings instead of poured. Can't mean roller bearings. Or if it does, there are a whole lot of us on this sight that would like to see what you have.

Spokes · 01-25-2016, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DadsRoadster

We will definitely do that. I'll let you know before we head that way. My name is Greg by the way. Thanks again.

Welcome to The Barn, Greg you will love this and The HAMB sites. Where else can you get Free Advice from all over the World. I am currently putting together a Model A engine with Speed equipment as others have said there is a Ton of stuff now available. Not cheap but Great Quality. My vote is for a Model A engine. Look for Model A clubs in your neck of the woods. Hopefully you can find a good running Model a engine for your car. Take Brent up on His offer. He will save you time and $$$.

C26Pinelake · 01-25-2016, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DadsRoadster

We will definitely do that. I'll let you know before we head that way. My name is Greg by the way. Thanks again.

You won't be disappointed as the man is a true expert. His work is first class ! Wayne

Jeff/Illinois · 01-25-2016, 03:06 PM

Welcome Greg!!

Good luck on your project keep us informed!! Brent Terry's shop is First Class you won't go wrong with those guys from all I've ever heard, plus he's close to you. They will work with you in however you plan to proceed on your project.

This little Roadster has way too much family history involved not to resurrect it!

DadsRoadster · 01-26-2016, 06:38 AM

Thanks everyone for the advice and the hospitality. We have decided the Model A engine is the way to go. Going to try to just find a running engine for now and hopefully build one the right way later on as time is an issue. I will share our progress. I would like to find a project for that V860 some day. I just think it's a cool little engine. Thanks again.

George Miller · 01-26-2016, 08:18 AM

I have a Model A pickup with a 1939 ==239 engine runs great. But a 60 is not that good in the A. Like the others said the A engine has more torque. Plus you can hop it up with a few bolt on parts.

If you do go with the 60 use a 39 transmission.

DadsRoadster · 01-26-2016, 09:03 AM

Thanks George. The transmission I have on the 60 is tiny--looks like a toy. Not sure of the year. I have read that there is a larger version that was used on trucks that will bolt up as well.

Going to go with an A engine. I may even look into repairing the one that is cracked. Have you heard of anyone doing that? It runs great except for the fact that water leaks out of it. Might be good enough to putt around the neighborhood until I can find or build a good engine.

Tom Wesenberg · 01-26-2016, 11:59 AM

Where are the cracks that leak coolant?

They can be stitched, and some guys have even had luck with just cleaning the crack, grinding a V, and using JB Weld.

DadsRoadster · 01-26-2016, 12:26 PM

It's not in the cylinder. I will try to get a picture.

George Miller · 01-26-2016, 01:07 PM

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Yes it can be saved, the one in Sport coupe had two cylinders that were cracked. That was 22,000 miles ago.

Jeff/Illinois · 01-26-2016, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DadsRoadster

Thanks everyone for the advice and the hospitality. We have decided the Model A engine is the way to go. Going to try to just find a running engine for now and hopefully build one the right way later on as time is an issue. I will share our progress. I would like to find a project for that V860 some day. I just think it's a cool little engine. Thanks again.

Definitely keep the 60HP flattie. Get a nice engine stand, clean it up and display it in your garage they are a neat little V-8.

01-23-2016, 12:36 PM	#1
DadsRoadster Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 10	Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster I am new to the forum and looking for advice to get my dad's 31 Roadster "on the road". He bought the car in 1950 when he was 13 and it has been sitting in his basement since around 1960. It has been one of those projects you want to get around to but never did. Due to dad's failing health I am going to try to get the car assembled and road worthy as soon as possible--hoping that he will be able to drive it again. My first question (of many) is about the engine. We still have the V860 that dad last had in the car along with the transmission. Dad says it is a good engine. We have a couple of Model A blocks, lots of misc parts, and a complete engine that appears to have a cracked block. My question is: how hard would it be to put the V860 back in it? Are there after market mounts available? Will it bolt up to the Model A driveshaft? Again--we are not building a show car here--I just want to get it back on the road. Plus I think it would be cool to drive it the way dad drove it back in the '50's. If anyone can point me in the right direction or has already built one this way their advice would be much appreciated. Thx.

01-23-2016, 01:54 PM	#2
BRENT in 10-uh-C Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Eastern Tennessee Posts: 11,520	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Welcome to Fordbarn <insert name here>. While there may be a couple folks here that can help you, this site was set-up by Ryan to be more of a hangout for restoration however don't be discouraged as Ryan also has a sister-site called Jalopy Journal (HAMB) that you will likely find quite a few folks that own a V8-60 powered Model-A. One other thing that I will offer my advice on is that a V8-60 is a cool looking engine however they actually have less torque & horsepower than what an equally built banger has. Both are costly to build but back in your Dad's day, there was limited speed parts for the Model-A compared to the V-8s however things are different today. With that said, you have some difficult decisions to make on which direction is 'best'. __________________ . BRENT in 10-uh-C . www.model-a-ford.com ...(...Finally Updated!! ) .

01-23-2016, 02:30 PM	#3
DadsRoadster Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 10	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Thanks Brent. I really appreciate your advice. You are correct that choosing the engine is a tough choice. Dad would rather use a Model A engine--we were just thinking using the V860 would get us on the road faster. Maybe I can locate a decent Model A engine that we could use. I will check out the other forum. I also checked out your website. Wow--you guys do awesome work. I may give you a call next week to see if you guys can build the car for us. It may be that letting experts like yourself do it makes a lot more sense. Thanks again.

01-23-2016, 02:35 PM	#4
BRENT in 10-uh-C Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Eastern Tennessee Posts: 11,520	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Thanks for the kudos. As soon as the white stuff leaves and we get back to normal weather, why don't you and your Dad make a road trip up to the shop, -not to discuss business but more about letting him get his 'battery charged' looking at projects we are working on. __________________ . BRENT in 10-uh-C . www.model-a-ford.com ...(...Finally Updated!! ) .

01-23-2016, 02:39 PM	#5
Mitch//pa BANNED Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bucks County, PA Posts: 11,454	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Sounds like a great field trip...

01-23-2016, 03:03 PM	#6
DadsRoadster Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 10	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) We will definitely do that. I'll let you know before we head that way. My name is Greg by the way. Thanks again.

01-23-2016, 09:02 PM	#7
1930artdeco Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Lynden, Wa Posts: 3,552	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Welcome Greg, That is a great project you have going for you. Something to consider is that I believe you will need to fabricate some front motor mounts for the V8 and I think you will need to look at an adapter plate for the tranny. And if it is speed you want down the line you can add an overdrive and maybe change the gears and you will be getting speeding tickets in no time flat. Mike __________________ 1930 TownSedan (Briggs) 1957 Country Sedan

01-23-2016, 11:27 PM	#8
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Take some pictures of the engines and engine compartment to show Brent when you go there. I agree with your dad and Brent that the Model A engine would be the better choice.

01-23-2016, 11:52 PM	#9
old car guy Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: tampa fl Posts: 194	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Good luck on what you are trying to get done in a timely manner. What shape are the other blocks that you have in the basement. You also mentioned loads of parts. Some pictures here would help to have the folks here give you some better advise. As Brent said in his post you have some tough decisions to make,however my comment would be to put it back the way your dad wants it.you can hop it up per say without doing any permanent damage if you wisely install the parts with cutting or damaging the frame and related parts.and down the road when things change you can restore the car properly to the way ford sent it out the road. And ps Brent Terry will do you a superb job. __________________ old car guy

01-24-2016, 11:12 PM	#10
DadsRoadster Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 10	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Thanks Mike for the advice on the little V8. I have read that a lot of folks do not care for that engine but unfortunately that is what we have. I am going to keep looking for a Model A engine but I think we can make the V8 work at least temporarily. Can't wait to get it on the road.

01-24-2016, 11:19 PM	#11
DadsRoadster Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 10	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Thanks for the advice Tom. Hopefully we can find a good Model A engine for the roadster. I will take Brent some pics for sure.

01-24-2016, 11:41 PM	#12
DadsRoadster Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 10	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Thanks OCG. I will try to get some pics on here. I am not sure about the condition of the other blocks. I bought the complete Model A engine a couple of years ago. It looked great but looks can be deceiving. We started it up and water poured out of the head and block. The parts on it look new and supposedly it has roller bearings instead of Babbitt. Not sure if that is a good thing or not. I agree about Brent. From what I have seen he would do a great job. I wish I had the skills to do it myself. This is definitely a car that we plan to keep in the family and pass on to my son someday. i look forward to getting started and to more great advice/knowledge from you guys.

01-25-2016, 03:03 AM	#14
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster When I was in the 7th grade I wrote a letter to General Motors asking them why they didn't use roller bearings instead of insert bushings. They sent me a reply simply stating that the engineers felt the bushings were better. Some motorcycles and small engines use roller and ball bearings, but I'm not aware of any larger car engines using them.

01-25-2016, 06:17 AM	#15
DadsRoadster Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 10	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster I really have no idea. You guys know better than me. Supposedly an upgrade over the poured bearings--but the guy may have been full of it. I will report back if I ever tear that motor down.

01-25-2016, 09:13 AM	#16
larrys40 Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: St Charles , Missouri Posts: 1,998	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Greg , as the guys have said the model a engine is the best choice I've worked on and driven several v8 60 powered A's and the 60 grossly underpowers the A. You are much better off finding a decent A engine it buying a rebuilt outright Just my recommendation . Larry Shepard

01-25-2016, 01:21 PM	#17
Roadster Rich Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Alpharetta, Georgia (Atlanta) Posts: 272	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Greg, that probably means it might have insert bearings instead of poured. Can't mean roller bearings. Or if it does, there are a whole lot of us on this sight that would like to see what you have.

01-25-2016, 03:06 PM	#20
Jeff/Illinois Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 2,789	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Welcome Greg!! Good luck on your project keep us informed!! Brent Terry's shop is First Class you won't go wrong with those guys from all I've ever heard, plus he's close to you. They will work with you in however you plan to proceed on your project. This little Roadster has way too much family history involved not to resurrect it!

01-26-2016, 06:38 AM	#21
DadsRoadster Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 10	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Thanks everyone for the advice and the hospitality. We have decided the Model A engine is the way to go. Going to try to just find a running engine for now and hopefully build one the right way later on as time is an issue. I will share our progress. I would like to find a project for that V860 some day. I just think it's a cool little engine. Thanks again.

01-26-2016, 08:18 AM	#22
George Miller Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: NC Posts: 2,975	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster I have a Model A pickup with a 1939 ==239 engine runs great. But a 60 is not that good in the A. Like the others said the A engine has more torque. Plus you can hop it up with a few bolt on parts. If you do go with the 60 use a 39 transmission.

01-26-2016, 09:03 AM	#23
DadsRoadster Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 10	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Thanks George. The transmission I have on the 60 is tiny--looks like a toy. Not sure of the year. I have read that there is a larger version that was used on trucks that will bolt up as well. Going to go with an A engine. I may even look into repairing the one that is cracked. Have you heard of anyone doing that? It runs great except for the fact that water leaks out of it. Might be good enough to putt around the neighborhood until I can find or build a good engine.

01-26-2016, 11:59 AM	#24
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Where are the cracks that leak coolant? They can be stitched, and some guys have even had luck with just cleaning the crack, grinding a V, and using JB Weld.

01-26-2016, 12:26 PM	#25
DadsRoadster Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: Knoxville, TN Posts: 10	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster It's not in the cylinder. I will try to get a picture.

01-26-2016, 01:07 PM	#26
George Miller Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: NC Posts: 2,975	Re: Intro and help needed for 31 Roadster Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Yes it can be saved, the one in Sport coupe had two cylinders that were cracked. That was 22,000 miles ago.