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09-13-2016, 10:42 AM | #21 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
Hard to say, did you mix the wiring up? Damage the sender? Because you are having two systems exhibit a problem I would guess a wiring problem. On the temperature gauge H indicates an open somewhere in the wiring or the sender.
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09-13-2016, 01:13 PM | #22 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
I did two things at the temp sending unit. I removed and reinstalled the wire to the sending unit. Only one wire and one place to reinstall it. I replaced the screw with a socket head cap screw because the original straight head screw was buggered. Both gauges stopped working properly afterward.
I will double check continuity of the wire and try the 1.5 volt battery test procedure on both gauges and look for mid-range. Key off, 6 volt input wires and sending unit wires disconnected from gauges? Operationally, with the temp sending unit wire disconnected, shouldn't the fuel gauge still work? Since the fuel gauge deflected full range with momentary contact by the jumper from the sending unit end of the wire, I assume (uhoh, there's that word) that the gauge has 6 volt supply and the wire from the sending unit has continuity. The ground wire at the fuel sending unit is good, but I will double check it for continuity with the positive cable on the battery disconnect. Last edited by FireEngineMike; 09-13-2016 at 01:20 PM. |
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07-04-2017, 10:49 AM | #23 | |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
Quote:
__________________
Owner/Operator of 'Jailbar Ranch' on the side of Mt. Pickett. Current stable consists of 1946 1/2 ton pickup turned woodie wagon with FH V8, 1947 Tonner Pickup (red) mostly stock with exception of a cummins 6at turbo diesel, 1946 Tonner Pickup (green) with 226 cu in 6 cyl flathead, 1979 Toyota landcruiser wagon, completely encased in 1947 Ford Jailbar sheet metal. Ok, cornbinder rear fenders..... 'Rusty ol' floorboards, hot on their feet' (Alan Jackson) |
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07-04-2017, 02:18 PM | #24 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
The car use Positive ground and Negative for the power side. The gauge is wired with power from the ignition switch going to one terminal on the gauge and the other terminal connected to the sending unit. The negative side of the battery would connect to the ignition switch side of the gauge and the positive side would connect to the sender side of the gauge.
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07-04-2017, 03:22 PM | #25 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
Great information thanks
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07-04-2017, 04:25 PM | #26 |
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Oscilloscope Anyone?
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Not a resistance direct current system, the Ford gauge isn't an alternating current system either. Information really depends upon the on-off pulse ratio not the pulse rate. Sender open/pulses mostly off - gauge is at maximum. Sender pulses mostly on - gauge is minimum. Pulsing - gauge reads pulse off/on ratio. I do find it interesting how the similar temperature coefficient of both sender and gauge work to cancel each other resulting in a system quite accurate across a wide ambient range. . Last edited by Paul Bennett; 07-04-2017 at 06:22 PM. |
07-05-2017, 12:02 AM | #27 | |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
Quote:
__________________
Owner/Operator of 'Jailbar Ranch' on the side of Mt. Pickett. Current stable consists of 1946 1/2 ton pickup turned woodie wagon with FH V8, 1947 Tonner Pickup (red) mostly stock with exception of a cummins 6at turbo diesel, 1946 Tonner Pickup (green) with 226 cu in 6 cyl flathead, 1979 Toyota landcruiser wagon, completely encased in 1947 Ford Jailbar sheet metal. Ok, cornbinder rear fenders..... 'Rusty ol' floorboards, hot on their feet' (Alan Jackson) |
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07-05-2017, 07:13 AM | #28 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
So does converting to 12V affect the accuracy of the gauge? I was always under the impression you only needed to drop the voltage at the gauge, but it seems from the diagram that both the gauge and the sending unit would be impacted by the 12V.
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07-05-2017, 09:42 AM | #29 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
All of the gauges work the same way, the current is from the gauge to the sender and to ground. A voltage drop is needed at the power input side of the gauge, the sender is just a path to ground. The circuit is matching the current flow through both the gauge and the sender. There is no way or reason you would attempt to connect a voltage drop device to the sender.
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07-05-2017, 10:01 AM | #30 | |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
Quote:
__________________
Owner/Operator of 'Jailbar Ranch' on the side of Mt. Pickett. Current stable consists of 1946 1/2 ton pickup turned woodie wagon with FH V8, 1947 Tonner Pickup (red) mostly stock with exception of a cummins 6at turbo diesel, 1946 Tonner Pickup (green) with 226 cu in 6 cyl flathead, 1979 Toyota landcruiser wagon, completely encased in 1947 Ford Jailbar sheet metal. Ok, cornbinder rear fenders..... 'Rusty ol' floorboards, hot on their feet' (Alan Jackson) |
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07-05-2017, 11:30 AM | #31 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
Check out Randy Rundle's fifth avenue internet garage. He has about everything a person would need to switch to 12-volt. This includes dropping resistors & voltage regulators.
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07-05-2017, 03:03 PM | #32 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
See if this helps any.
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07-05-2017, 06:11 PM | #33 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
The power in is at the gauge so it would need a runtz or a dropping resistor on there. The runtz units use one for each gauge I think but a dropping resistor or voltage regulator will drop all of them at once. Speedway carries this stuff too.
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07-05-2017, 06:39 PM | #34 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
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07-05-2017, 07:40 PM | #35 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
So I looked at all Randy's stuff and he seems like a very knowledgeable straight shooter and I thank you. What has worked well over time, the speedway style that does all gauges or the runtz, needing three? Money seems about the same. I'm ready to pull the trigger on one way or the other.
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Owner/Operator of 'Jailbar Ranch' on the side of Mt. Pickett. Current stable consists of 1946 1/2 ton pickup turned woodie wagon with FH V8, 1947 Tonner Pickup (red) mostly stock with exception of a cummins 6at turbo diesel, 1946 Tonner Pickup (green) with 226 cu in 6 cyl flathead, 1979 Toyota landcruiser wagon, completely encased in 1947 Ford Jailbar sheet metal. Ok, cornbinder rear fenders..... 'Rusty ol' floorboards, hot on their feet' (Alan Jackson) |
07-06-2017, 12:35 AM | #36 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
I'd use the Runts units: one per gauge. Can't say for sure why, but I suspect the Runts may be more than a simple voltage dropping resitive load. In any event I like the idea of a single runtz unit responding to the individual load of each circuit rather than the average of the three parallel circuits.
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07-06-2017, 08:42 AM | #37 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
The runtz is a mini regulator. It will keep accuracy better with separate units for each gauge.
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07-06-2017, 09:18 AM | #38 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
Runtz it is! Thanks much.
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Owner/Operator of 'Jailbar Ranch' on the side of Mt. Pickett. Current stable consists of 1946 1/2 ton pickup turned woodie wagon with FH V8, 1947 Tonner Pickup (red) mostly stock with exception of a cummins 6at turbo diesel, 1946 Tonner Pickup (green) with 226 cu in 6 cyl flathead, 1979 Toyota landcruiser wagon, completely encased in 1947 Ford Jailbar sheet metal. Ok, cornbinder rear fenders..... 'Rusty ol' floorboards, hot on their feet' (Alan Jackson) |
07-08-2017, 02:27 AM | #39 | |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
Quote:
Last conversion i did uses a switched stepdown converter and is now being under test for dependability. The stepdown converter modules are dirtcheap today i can´t buy a regulator and breadbord for what they sell online. If you use one for each gauge just about any dropping device including a simple resistor works fine. The gauge doesn´t care about the voltage...you just need to limit the current rush a bit. |
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07-08-2017, 08:15 AM | #40 |
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Re: How Ford Gauge Unit Work
The sender is not the problem so much as it is the generator output. It fluctuates even more on a generator than on an alternator but a change to 12-volts with an alternator changes things a lot. Fluctuation can be anything from 6-volts to 7.1 volts with the original set up but with 12-volts it's a different story (much more voltage spread at 12 to 14.7) and those little runtz regulators will keep it the same all the time and each gauge will be regulated separately so there are less chances of spikes creating any problems.
The gauges do care about voltage and especially amperage. Add twice the voltage to the mix also adds twice the amount of higher spike capability. Ford used constant voltage regulators on these systems for a long time after the change to 12-volt and for good reason. The runtz is a step down switching converter or regulator if you choose. A person can build one cheaper but the labor involved along with soldering skills makes the runtz a relatively inexpensive way to do things. Definitely less hassle unless a person just likes to do that stuff themselves. A person could make 4 of them for the price of one prefabricated one if they were so inclined. Last edited by rotorwrench; 07-08-2017 at 08:33 AM. |
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