1956 Victoria overdrive

[DaveBPT]

Just bought a 56 that was built with an overdrive transmission but is no longer part of the car. Looking to find out what overdrive transmission I need.

[Dobie Gillis]

The proper OD transmission would be the heavy duty Borg-Warner T-85 with R-11 overdrive. If the engine is a 272 you could get away with the T-86 with R-10 OD.

[Mac VP]

If it was originally built with the 223 six, or the 272 (and I think the 292) V8 it would have had the Borg Warner toploader T-86 overdrive transmission, which had the R-10 overdrive unit. If the car came with the 312 V8 it would certainly have had the bigger Borg Warner T-85 heavy duty R-11 overdrive. The T-85 was a sideloader transmission.

[DaveBPT]

It currently is a 292 which matches the VIN code

[Hot Rod Reverend]

If you are interested, I have quite a bit on my blog series. The link below is for the "transmission" category and if you scroll down you can find entries by title, from disassembly, rebuild, mistakes I made, etc.

https://www.hotrodreverend.com/blog/...s/transmission

HRR

[dmsfrr]

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Originally Posted by DaveBPT

Just bought a 56 that was built with an overdrive transmission but is no longer part of the car. Looking to find out what overdrive transmission I need.

Do you want to replace the missing transmission with an original, or something newer?

Original parts are getting harder to find (VanPelt Sales is a good source) but newer transmissions require more modifications to fit in the car.

I had a '57 T-85 & R-11 OD transmission rebuilt last year. The transmission shop was unable to get parts from their regular suppliers for more than several of the important overdrive pieces.
.

[rotorwrench]

The T-85 R11C was used on heavier applications like the Lincolns and 312 T-birds or possibly police & wagon applications. If the bolt patterns are the same, the T-85, T-86, or 259 series transmissions are possible fits. All of them could have R10 or R11 overdrives depending on application.

Later in the 60s & very early 70s Ford used some T-85 R11N transmissions with engines as large as the 390 FE. They were stronger due to the nodular cast iron case. They are not real common though since most folks were liking the automatic transmissions or they wanted a heavy duty 4-speed.

The R11 overdrive has the stronger 4-planet gear planetary set up. The R10 types only have 3-planet gears on their planetary.

[Late model]

DaveBPT,

I agree with the previous posters that the T85 transmission is stronger than the T86.
I don't believe however that the T85 was used in the 1956 passenger car behind the 312.
I am building a T85 to replace the Fordomatic in my Victoria hardtop and I have found very little to support that they were. It appears that the 56 Police Interceptors and station wagons may have, as the listing for the standard transmission crossmember for 56 models excludes PI and SW applications and lists another number for them. That may explain why the 56/57 parts manuals list A parts (fits passenger car) that would only fit a T85 and not a T86. They were for the PI and SW vehicles.
I've attached some info I put together after measuring some transmissions in my shop. It shows you really need a 57 tailhousing get the mounting holes within 3/4" of the crossmember. Then it just requires a flat plate and some drilling.
If you do go with a T85 you need to pull the side cover and check the low/reverse gear for broken teeth. T85's do not have a synchro low gear so the low/reverse gear takes quite a bit of punishment until you get in some practice double clutching.
So if you want replace what was in your car from the factory I believe it should be a T86, or even possibly a BW 259, but if acceleration and speed are in the mix, it really should be a T85.

Don

[DaveBPT]

I am thinking about going with at least a period correct transmission. Just curious what I currently have. It is marked AB-1222-B or 1 or B1. also marked A89 in another spot.

[Dobie Gillis]

If the cover where the shift levers are is "D" shaped it's a T-85. The T-86 has a rectangular cover.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by Dobie Gillis

If the cover where the shift levers are is "D" shaped it's a T-85. The T-86 has a rectangular cover.

The T-86 is a TOP LOADER. If the SIDE LOADER has a fully rectangular cover, it is a BW-259.

You know better ...

The trouble here is that FORD did not give an ID/APPLICATION CHART in the 1949-59 MPC.

[Late model]

Originally Posted by DaveBPT

I am thinking about going with at least a period correct transmission. Just curious what I currently have. It is marked AB-1222-B or 1 or B1. also marked A89 in another spot.

The main difference is the shift cover. Does it look like any of these?

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by DaveBPT

Just curious what I currently have. It is marked AB-1222-B or 1 or B1. also marked A89 in another spot.

What those are is CASTING ID NOS. There should be one on each part, i.e. main case, output shaft hsg, shift plate cover, etc. Can you provide a photo and a list of the nos.?

[rotorwrench]

7222 is a base number for shifter cover. This number was used on top shift types back into the 30s and side shift types from 1940 on. The prefix indicates mid 50s (52 or 53 and maybe later). AB-7222-B is a cover for the 1952/53 Ford/BW 259 type transmission.

The 1200 numbers are for the front wheel & hub.

[paul2748]

Saw this ad in the YBlock site. Not mine, have no interest in it. T85, R11 OD. Don't know if there are any fitment issues, but should have the Yblock bolt pattern



Hi After no interest I lowered price to 400. It is out of 1963 ford. Bill Oregon call or text 541 221 7941 8/2/2022

[DaveBPT]

I looked again at the transmission. It does have the shifter on the side and the cover is rectangle.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by DaveBPT

I looked again at the transmission. It does have the shifter on the side and the cover is rectangle.

It it appears as below, it is a BW259 w OD -

If no OD SECTION, it is a BW259. Is this your take-out you are describing?

[DaveBPT]

I found a trans with overdrive that came out of a 312 TBird. Would that work?

[dmsfrr]

Originally Posted by DaveBPT

I found a trans with overdrive that came out of a 312 TBird. Would that work?

Because the full-sized cars use a column shift with linkage coming from the front and Birds have a floor shift with linkage from the rear... the shift levers on the side of the transmission may be 'upside down' / reversed. I'm not sure which transmissions it applies to, manual or automatic or both ???

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by dmsfrr

I'm not sure which transmissions it applies to, manual or automatic or both ???

It would be both styles -

[miker98038]

If you’ve found a good T85 R11 at a decent price don’t let the shift arms bother you. That’s the easy part of the swap. The existing arms, the new arms, cut, weld, etc. I’m sure you can find or modify the parts at a reasonable price.

[KULTULZ]

Originally Posted by miker98038

If you’ve found a good T85 R11 at a decent price don’t let the shift arms bother you. That’s the easy part of the swap. The existing arms, the new arms, cut, weld, etc. I’m sure you can find or modify the parts at a reasonable price.

What Mike said. If it is a good one, don't let it get away.

The shift levers are different between FORD and BIRD but I would think you should be able to find them.

[DaveBPT]

yes

[DaveBPT]

Just picked up a T85C -1A with R11 OD and I believe 2 T86 w/ R10 OD. Will be checking for length and shaft diameters. Should be interesting!

[miker98038]

Great score. Remember, Ford (and many others) used the T86 and R 10 behind almost all (if not all) the 292’s. If it’s not a HP rebuild and you’re not side stepping the clutch they last just fine.

For your use as you check them out, the OEM BW manual

http://www.oldwillysforum.com/forum/...riveManual.pdf

[DaveBPT]

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Looks like lots of useable information in the manual.
Thanks