Car Will Not Start--No Apparent Spark

[Patrick L.]

What you are now saying does not make sense. This is simple. Follow the easy diagnosis procedures some of us have stated.




What is that you're using to hold the points open ? It has to be non-metallic.

From the start.
Power at open point arm, good. That means all is good behind/leading up to it.
Power at closed point block, bad. Thats means points are dirty or not making ground or
primary lead maybe screwed in too far feeding powerto
dist. body.

[shew01]

Originally Posted by wmws

Something is very wrong if you are getting voltage to the junction box and coil with the fuse removed. Are you sure your fuse is hooked up correctly.

It’s the same fuse hookup that the car had when I purchased it a year ago. I’ve driven the car without issue several thousand miles.


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[shew01]

Originally Posted by Patrick L.

What you are now saying does not make sense. This is simple. Follow the easy diagnosis procedures some of us have stated.

Obviously it is NOT simple, or I would be finished by now. I have be trying to follow advice, especially yours. Your anger is not helping.


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[wmws]

Is the fuse on the starter next to the cable from the battery. Or is it a fuse for the lights.

[shew01]

Originally Posted by wmws

Is the fuse on the starter next to the cable from the battery. Or is it a fuse for the lights.

Here is a picture of the fuse holder. It is my understanding that if the fuse connection does not work, the lights and horn will not work, and the car will not start. I have the fuse out at the moment.




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[shew01]

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Originally Posted by Patrick L.

What you are now saying does not make sense. This is simple. Follow the easy diagnosis procedures some of us have stated.




What is that you're using to hold the points open ? It has to be non-metallic.

From the start.
Power at open point arm, good. That means all is good behind/leading up to it.
Power at closed point block, bad. Thats means points are dirty or not making ground or
primary lead maybe screwed in too far feeding powerto
dist. body.

I’m using a popsicle stick to hold the points open.

I removed the distributor to take the ignition switch out of the circuit and replace it with an emergency jumper I bought at a vendor site. I have the same behavior. So, no, I don’t think the lead is screwed too far into the distributor.


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[wmws]

The fuse holder looks normal in your picture but you said
"With the ignition switch on (popped out) and the fuse removed, I get 6 volts to flywheel side of fuse holder and 0 volts to the radiator side of the fuse holder as expected."
This is just opposite of what you should have. If your statement is correct you have something wrong with the fuse holder.
You seem to have several problems, in that sometimes you have power at one point and then you don't. I would take one wire at a time at the junction box and the coil and clean up the terminals well. If that doesn't help maybe it is time to get some help from a club member or a mechanic friend who can help you. It is very difficult for us to diagnose form afar.

[wmarcy528]

Shew01, please continue posting your results because I’m experiencing similar problems with my model A. Expect when I take the fuse out I get 6 v on the clip near the battery stud on the starter and 0v from the other clip. I’m sorry for your frustration but you are helping me.


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[Ernie Vitucci]

Good Morning...That looks like a very old fuse holder. Perhaps just remove it and see what happens with things in the stock position...I repaired an 'A' a couple of years ago that gave me fits until I figured out that the fuse holder was bad. Removed it and the car ran as it should...got a new one...heavy duty from Arizona Model A and all has been fine! Good luck. Ernie in Arizona

[Patrick L.]

I'm not angry, just frustrated that I can't explain things better than I am.

It sounds that at times that your test light or volt meter ground lead isn't always grounding.

With your popsicle stick between the contacts are you still getting voltage at both contacts ?

[jg61hawk]

Based on what you wrote (below) the first thing to do is do away with the fuse block and all. Simply put the wire on the starter switch where the battery cable is. It makes NO SENSE to have any voltage if the fuse is gone if it's installed properly. Take the wire from the starter to the fuse block off as well. Something right there sure sounds messed up.

With the ignition switch on (popped out) and the fuse removed, I get 6 volts to flywheel side of fuse holder and 0 volts to the radiator side of the fuse holder as expected. I also get 6 volts to both sides of the coil and 6 volts to both junction box studs. The movable point arm has 6 volts, and the stationary point arm gets 6 volts, which doesn’t sound right.

With the ignition on and the fuse in place, I see the following changes. I don’t see any voltage on either end of the fuse (while inserted into its holder), and the passenger side junction box stud drops to 0 volts. All of the other cited measurements are the same.

[shew01]

Originally Posted by Patrick L.

I'm not angry, just frustrated that I can't explain things better than I am.

It sounds that at times that your test light or volt meter ground lead isn't always grounding.

With your popsicle stick between the contacts are you still getting voltage at both contacts ?

I’m scratching metal to make sure I’m getting an accurate reading. The volt meter seems to be consistent.

I’ve used the popsicle stick for all of the measurements I’ve reported.


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[shew01]

Originally Posted by wmws

The fuse holder looks normal in your picture but you said
"With the ignition switch on (popped out) and the fuse removed, I get 6 volts to flywheel side of fuse holder and 0 volts to the radiator side of the fuse holder as expected."
This is just opposite of what you should have. If your statement is correct you have something wrong with the fuse holder.
You seem to have several problems, in that sometimes you have power at one point and then you don't. I would take one wire at a time at the junction box and the coil and clean up the terminals well. If that doesn't help maybe it is time to get some help from a club member or a mechanic friend who can help you. It is very difficult for us to diagnose form afar.

Understood. I’ve called our closest member, but I haven’t been able to reach him.


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[jg61hawk]

Based on the below you posted I'm asking does the amp meter still discharge every time you turn on the battery (not the key...just the battery)? I am thinking if the system discharges with KEY OFF and just turning on battery you have a problem right there at the battery connections or the fuse block. Check the battery hold down frame make sure the posts are not hitting the frame and shorting to the car. It sounds like it's right in this area.

I have horn and lights.

When I turn on the main battery kill switch, I see the ammeter move a tad left. So, the ammeter looks good. Tonight, my multimeter shows that both sides of the coil have 6 volts. Last night, I was using a test light. That light is unreliable.

[jg61hawk]

What could be worse than one of our old cars not working!!!! Oh yeah all that other stuff....Relax it'll get fixed it ALWAYS DOES. It's a puzzle and at least you're HOME!!!

[jm29henry]

Shew01,
I first want to sympathize with your situation! This is not the fun part but this is apart of learning. Personally I am not a fan of parts swapping with knowing why I am changing them but if you have or know of someone with a good working distributor and is willing to let you try it may narrow it down and plus it would a good way to learn how to time your car ? Best of luck to you don’t give up no car or wire are smarter than you

[Patrick L.]

Originally Posted by shew01

I’m scratching metal to make sure I’m getting an accurate reading. The volt meter seems to be consistent.

I’ve used the popsicle stick for all of the measurements I’ve reported.


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Please, please answer my question. Thats part of the frustration.

Are you getting voltage at the open movable point arm ? I know you are saying you're getting 6v.

Are you getting voltage at the stationary point block with the popsicle installed ? This is what we need to know.

Are you getting voltage [6v] at both points contacts when popsicle is removed ? You have said yes, but, want to make sure.

[shew01]

Originally Posted by jg61hawk

does the amp meter still discharge every time you turn on the battery (not the key...just the battery)? I am thinking if the system discharges with KEY OFF and just turning on battery you have a problem right there at the battery connections or the fuse block. Check the battery hold down frame make sure the posts are not hitting the frame and shorting to the car. It sounds like it's right in this area.

I have horn and lights.

No, the ammeter does not show discharge when I turn on the batter kill switch. I no longer have horn or lights. I do have turn signal lights, but they go through a different fuse. Although I’ve engaged the started a number of times for testing today, the battery is holding at 6.27 volts.

I rechecked the fuse holder, and I think I checked it incorrectly earlier. This picture is checking the radiator side of the holder with the black probe and the flywheel side with the red probe without a fuse installed. The holder itself seems good.



The fuse still tests okay too. In this picture, I have the fuse in the black alligator clip, and I’m holding it against the negative battery terminal. The red probe is on the positive battery terminal. I think the fuse and holder are working properly.




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[shew01]

Originally Posted by jg61hawk

What could be worse than one of our old cars not working!!!! Oh yeah all that other stuff....Relax it'll get fixed it ALWAYS DOES. It's a puzzle and at least you're HOME!!!

Oddly, I enjoy puzzles. This time, I seem to be missing a piece or two. ;-)

[shew01]

Originally Posted by jm29henry

Shew01,
Personally I am not a fan of parts swapping with knowing why I am changing them but if you have or know of someone with a good working distributor and is willing to let you try it may narrow it down and plus it would a good way to learn how to time your car ? Best of luck to you don’t give up no car or wire are smarter than you

The only part that I've swapped so far is the condenser, and it did not change anything.

I do have a new Nu-Rex distributor that I purchased from the guy who sold me the car a year ago. However, I cannot get the new distributor to seat fully into the head (even after twisting the cam to match up with old shaft). The new distributor comes with a new distributor shaft that apparently only mates with the new distributor, and, unfortunately, I cannot get the old distributor shaft out of the car. So, my new distributor is useless to me, at least for now.