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Old 05-17-2014, 02:11 PM   #1
Vanspeed
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Default front brake issues

My front brakes would hardly work on the front so I took them apart. Shoes were almost gone, so I sent them out to snyders to get re-lined. Tracks were very nice, as well as everything else. I put everything back together and I can't get the drums to go back on. I adjusted the top nut so that the top of the shoes are in as far as they will go. What is the problem here?
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Old 05-17-2014, 02:26 PM   #2
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Default Re: front brake issues

Were the linings arced to the drum size and are the linings centered.
Also the lining may be to thick.

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Old 05-17-2014, 02:37 PM   #3
Purdy Swoft
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Default Re: front brake issues

The shoes usually need to be tapered on both ends. This is the way that I was taught and do mine. Without this taper, it will be difficult or impossible to get the drums on.
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Old 05-17-2014, 03:22 PM   #4
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Default Re: front brake issues

Also be sure the brake rod is disconnected so the lever is full OFF. Once the drums are on and the shoes adjusted (tighten to lock the drum, then back off to slight drag) then you can adjust the rod to the correct length.
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Old 05-17-2014, 03:30 PM   #5
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Default Re: front brake issues

It appears to me that the linings are too thick? I did not turn the drums. The brake shoes are centered and they are tapered on the ends just like the pic Purdy posted. Before I put them in, I placed them in the drums and I had very nice contact all the way around. I have the brake rods off and everything appears to be correctly installed. Do you usually have to have the drums turned when putting on new shoes?
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Old 05-17-2014, 04:41 PM   #6
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Default Re: front brake issues

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No, the drums shouldn't need to be turned unless they are grooved or rusted.
How thick are the linings?
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Old 05-17-2014, 05:01 PM   #7
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Default Re: front brake issues

Pretty thick, 3/16. My drums measure 11 inches. No real issues, no groves.
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Old 05-17-2014, 05:24 PM   #8
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Default Re: front brake issues

Check for a "pill" in the top of the wedge.

Also try removing the rod that pushes down on the wedge. If the drums will go on with out the rod maybe it is a repro and too long.

Are the cotter pins on the outside of the pins?
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Old 05-17-2014, 05:31 PM   #9
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Default Re: front brake issues

You can remove your shoes and then wind "in" the adjustment wedge (at the top of the backing plate) until the little metal cap comes off (it's only pressed in)

With that off you can see if the angled end of the shoe extensions are contacting the adjustment wedge when it's fully retracted.

Sometimes the shoe extensions get hung up in the wedge housing.

Oh - and make sure the angle at the end of the shoe extensions are the correct "way." If you've reversed the shoes then you may have them touching the adjustment wedge at only the "tippy-tip." They should match the taper of the adjustment wedge (and seat themselves in the little grooves.)

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Old 05-17-2014, 07:45 PM   #10
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Default Re: front brake issues

No pills, original brake actuating pins. Shoes on my coupe are 1/16 thinner than the ones I got back. Tracks, rollers are very nice. Some guys told me that I need the shoes shaved. Does this sound right?
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Old 05-17-2014, 07:57 PM   #11
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Default Re: front brake issues

If the heads of the roller pins are not riding on top of the tracks, the shoes will drop down too low on the bottom and won't allow the drums to fit over the shoes. The heads of the roller pins go to the inside. The cotter pins go to the outside. if the roller pins are installed backwards, this could be the problem
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Old 05-17-2014, 08:03 PM   #12
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Default Re: front brake issues

I agree and checked that, everything is correct. There is not a spot where the drum fits better, you can tell that overall, the shoes contact the drum everywhere, in equal distances. They are just too darn thick. What was the factory spec on how thick the original linings were?
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Old 05-17-2014, 10:47 PM   #13
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Default Re: front brake issues

I have a pair of old shoes and I have measured the radius of the shoe WITHOUT any lining. The radius is 5.30". Since the drums have an 11" diameter (5.50" radius) the lining would have to be 0.20" to match a standard non-turned) drum. However if the radius of your shoes is different then the 0.20" number could be different.

I have a new set of unused linings and they are 0.20" thick.

Can you post a picture of the shoes installed on the car?


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Old 05-18-2014, 08:33 AM   #14
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Default Re: front brake issues

I had a friend who installed the shoes with the part that engages the adjusting wedge facing the wrong direction. Is the slant from the part on the shoe matching the wedge?
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Old 05-18-2014, 10:38 AM   #15
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Default Re: front brake issues

Just because the shoes match the arc of the drums doesn't mean that the brakes will be centered when the shoes are installed. I'm thinking its an issue with the tracks. This is where a centering tool comes in handy. The centering tool only shows where you are at and which way that the shoes will need to move so that they will actually center the drums as mounted. Usually the shoes will be low and the tracks will either need to be bent or built up with weld. Many times the heads of the roller pins will be just sliding over the tracks instead of riding on top of the tracks as they should. This is often hard to detect but will let the shoes drop too low for the drums to pass over the shoes.

I have used the lining from Snyders but installed it myself. I don't know if Snyders sends the shoes out to be relined with different thicker lining but that could be the problem. The lined shoe that I pictured has new never used lining. Maybe the picture will give some ides of what the thickness of the lining should be, It is certainly more than .020
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Old 05-18-2014, 12:26 PM   #16
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Default Re: front brake issues

Purdy,

Did you mean 0.20" and not 0.020" ?
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Old 05-18-2014, 12:46 PM   #17
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Default Re: front brake issues

Comparing lining thickness to points gap, It appears to be more than twenty two thousants. I didn't attempt any actual measurements. Twenty thousants ain't very thick, still just a guess.
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Old 05-18-2014, 03:20 PM   #18
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Default Re: front brake issues

Just had two ex-ford and Chrysler engineers here and they both agree that everything is correct and they think the linings are too thick. We took them apart several times to make sure everything was correct. One suggested shaving a bit off the adjusting wedge cam that attaches to the shoe. They feel loosing lining or drum surface is the wrong way to go. Your thoughts...
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Old 05-18-2014, 03:36 PM   #19
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Default Re: front brake issues

They are NOT too thick! Original linings were 3/16" thick. Do you have new cast iron drums? If so you need to measure them accurately to be sure they were turned to a true 11" after installation to the hubs.

You need to keep investigating. Maybe you can post some pics. Someone may spot a bad replacement part or something else.
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Old 05-18-2014, 04:07 PM   #20
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Default Re: front brake issues

Thanks Marco, pics coming.
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