The Ford Barn

rotorwrench · 01-09-2017, 06:42 PM

Cotta Transmission Corp still exists but I don't know if you could find anyone there that remembers that old unit. There in Beloit, Wisconsin now days.

1952henry · 01-09-2017, 10:09 PM

That's the odd name I couldn't think of.

38 coupe · 01-29-2017, 02:06 PM

Since you already have an auxiliary transmission, the Cotta unit, you can swap in a different aux unit that has an overdrive. You want to look for a small Watson or Spicer unit. Here is a spread sheet of aux boxes and ratios I put together a while back. The 6000 series and larger Spicer units get pretty big and I wouldn't try to use one. Keep an eye on craigslist and ebay, you will eventually find one that will work for you.

42Ford M-H · 01-29-2017, 08:06 PM

If I read this right, those units have low, medium and high range?

42Ford M-H · 01-29-2017, 08:07 PM

Thank you for making the list btw

42Ford M-H · 01-30-2017, 07:49 AM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

which one is easier to find parts for? Spicer or Watson?

38 coupe · 02-12-2017, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sceptre155

which one is easier to find parts for? Spicer or Watson?

Sorry for the slow reply.

None are easier to find parts for, the units in the list haven't been manufactured for 50 years or more. The most common boxes seem to be the various versions of the Spicer 5831, followed by the 41 through 48 Watsons. As long as the gears and case are in decent shape you are in OK shape. The bearings are available and you make your own gaskets. The expensive part can be the yokes to work with your drive shafts, if needed. Also, finding a shifter can be interesting.

BouncinBetty · 09-03-2018, 11:46 AM

Just seen this , been away a while , my dump truck does not have the underdrive unit. No sign of it .

BouncinBetty · 09-11-2018, 07:35 AM

My Dump truck does not have this extra gear box , wonder why.

Any idea where I could get the tipping gear ?

1952henry · 09-12-2018, 12:19 AM

Plow trucks had it so the blower, which had its own engine, could chew through the snow whilst the truck provided the tractive force without burning up the clutch

BouncinBetty · 09-13-2018, 03:13 PM

Thanks for that it makes perfect sense now , mines a dump truck so would not require it.

Regards.

blucar · 09-15-2018, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 42Ford M-H

I forgot to mention I opened the under drive to check out the gear ratio. LOL 5:1

The older gentlemen i bought it from told me a quick story when i was loading the truck. Apparently his neighbor was bragging he could tow that backwards with his new chevy 4x4 I'm guessing late 80's early 90's. So they chained them up, he put everything in in low gear including the under drive, let out the clutch... Got out of the truck and was talking to the guy thru his drivers window as he was getting towed backwards.. LOL

The above comment brings to mind a demonstration I watched at a Ford Dealership in Idaho in the mid '50's.
Ford was touting the new automatic transmissions they were offering in the F100 pickups. Ford claimed that the automatic trans would pull a stick backwards, two F100's were hooked together, back to back.
No matter what the driver of the stick trans did, the automatic would pull the stick backwards with it's tires smoking.
Plain and simple, an automatic will put more usable torque to the wheels..

rotorwrench · 09-16-2018, 10:35 AM

If you change ratio of final drive. Make sure it affects the front and rear axle alike. This requires the gear change box to be between the engine and the transfer case. I can't really tell if the underdrive is placed that way or not due to the photo not showing placement well enough. If it is only placed in the rear drive then it can only be operated while the front axle is disconnected for rear wheel drive only. Both axles have to go the same speed. I know that Marmon Herrington added in a slip ratchet set up in the front axle drive with a lever to operate it but there is no way to lock out the front axle hubs like a later model 4WD vehicle.

42Ford M-H · 09-16-2018, 09:13 PM

Underdrive was between the motor and transfer case. And was only for sno go trucks as far as I know.

42Ford M-H · 09-16-2018, 09:19 PM

honestly at this point I think it would be easier to changed transmission to something with overdrive. For better high way speeds. What transmission I have no idea. Needs to have pto for dump box. I’m looking to do the same thing maybe at some point.

rotorwrench · 09-17-2018, 12:18 PM

You'll have to look into a New Venture NV4500 or an old Clark 280VO if you can find one. I have no idea how hard it would be to adapt but the NV4500 is a 5-speed OD transmission with PTO cover plate. The old Clark OD types are hard to find.

A gear vendors OD on an NP435 is another possibility. Most of the older 1 1/2-ton trucks had a 2-speed rear axle so they didn't need an overdrive.

FireEngineMike · 09-18-2018, 03:56 PM

I thought the 2-speed tonner truck axles were under-drive with a numerically higher gear for more low end grunt.

rotorwrench · 09-18-2018, 05:08 PM

The Sno Go is a 4WD so it can't use a 2-speed axle unless some company makes one for 4WD front end and I've never heard of one. These old trucks use the old Timken axles on both ends with the front one being modified by Marmon Herrington to work for 4WD.

There are other 5 and 6-speed transmissions but most of the newer ones don't have a removable bell housing so they would be very difficult to adapt.

01-09-2017, 06:42 PM	#21
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,422	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed Cotta Transmission Corp still exists but I don't know if you could find anyone there that remembers that old unit. There in Beloit, Wisconsin now days.

01-09-2017, 10:09 PM	#22
1952henry Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: North Dakota Posts: 1,615	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed That's the odd name I couldn't think of. __________________ I dig coal, which provides motivation for EVs.

01-29-2017, 02:06 PM	#23
38 coupe Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: South Texas Posts: 1,631	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed Since you already have an auxiliary transmission, the Cotta unit, you can swap in a different aux unit that has an overdrive. You want to look for a small Watson or Spicer unit. Here is a spread sheet of aux boxes and ratios I put together a while back. The 6000 series and larger Spicer units get pretty big and I wouldn't try to use one. Keep an eye on craigslist and ebay, you will eventually find one that will work for you.

01-29-2017, 08:06 PM	#24
42Ford M-H Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: NY Posts: 190	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed If I read this right, those units have low, medium and high range?

01-29-2017, 08:07 PM	#25
42Ford M-H Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: NY Posts: 190	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed Thank you for making the list btw

01-30-2017, 07:49 AM	#26
42Ford M-H Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: NY Posts: 190	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) which one is easier to find parts for? Spicer or Watson?

09-03-2018, 11:46 AM	#28
BouncinBetty Member Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Powys, Wales Posts: 61	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed Just seen this , been away a while , my dump truck does not have the underdrive unit. No sign of it .

09-11-2018, 07:35 AM	#29
BouncinBetty Member Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Powys, Wales Posts: 61	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed My Dump truck does not have this extra gear box , wonder why. Any idea where I could get the tipping gear ?

09-12-2018, 12:19 AM	#30
1952henry Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: North Dakota Posts: 1,615	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed Plow trucks had it so the blower, which had its own engine, could chew through the snow whilst the truck provided the tractive force without burning up the clutch __________________ I dig coal, which provides motivation for EVs.

09-13-2018, 03:13 PM	#31
BouncinBetty Member Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Powys, Wales Posts: 61	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed Thanks for that it makes perfect sense now , mines a dump truck so would not require it. Regards.

09-16-2018, 10:35 AM	#33
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,422	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed If you change ratio of final drive. Make sure it affects the front and rear axle alike. This requires the gear change box to be between the engine and the transfer case. I can't really tell if the underdrive is placed that way or not due to the photo not showing placement well enough. If it is only placed in the rear drive then it can only be operated while the front axle is disconnected for rear wheel drive only. Both axles have to go the same speed. I know that Marmon Herrington added in a slip ratchet set up in the front axle drive with a lever to operate it but there is no way to lock out the front axle hubs like a later model 4WD vehicle.

09-16-2018, 09:13 PM	#34
42Ford M-H Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: NY Posts: 190	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed Underdrive was between the motor and transfer case. And was only for sno go trucks as far as I know.

09-16-2018, 09:19 PM	#35
42Ford M-H Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: NY Posts: 190	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed honestly at this point I think it would be easier to changed transmission to something with overdrive. For better high way speeds. What transmission I have no idea. Needs to have pto for dump box. I’m looking to do the same thing maybe at some point.

09-17-2018, 12:18 PM	#36
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,422	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed You'll have to look into a New Venture NV4500 or an old Clark 280VO if you can find one. I have no idea how hard it would be to adapt but the NV4500 is a 5-speed OD transmission with PTO cover plate. The old Clark OD types are hard to find. A gear vendors OD on an NP435 is another possibility. Most of the older 1 1/2-ton trucks had a 2-speed rear axle so they didn't need an overdrive.

09-18-2018, 03:56 PM	#37
FireEngineMike Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Webster, NY Posts: 215	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed I thought the 2-speed tonner truck axles were under-drive with a numerically higher gear for more low end grunt.

09-18-2018, 05:08 PM	#38
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,422	Re: 43 Marmon Herrington 4x4 top speed The Sno Go is a 4WD so it can't use a 2-speed axle unless some company makes one for 4WD front end and I've never heard of one. These old trucks use the old Timken axles on both ends with the front one being modified by Marmon Herrington to work for 4WD. There are other 5 and 6-speed transmissions but most of the newer ones don't have a removable bell housing so they would be very difficult to adapt.