Go Back   The Ford Barn > General Discussion > Model A (1928-31)

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-12-2020, 11:59 AM   #61
daren007
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Saint Cloud Mn
Posts: 745
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

The Chicken.
daren007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-12-2020, 01:16 PM   #62
A 2 B
Junior Member
 
A 2 B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Canada
Posts: 9
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

Just my opinion, but I believe it is a question only answerable by the jurisdiction that makes the laws and will surely differ state to state. Ford may have had their system of assigning identification numbers but certainly were not the legal authority after the sale. Federal regulations were firmly in place after the V.I.N. system was instituted but previous to that a lot of wiggle room and discretionary decisions were obviously made by individual states and their employees.
It leads me to believe that, previous to V.I.N.s, the person who had their name on the title was free to sell all or any component (engine, frame, body) along with the title, simply because all parts are replaceable.
A 2 B is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Old 09-12-2020, 09:31 PM   #63
daren007
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Saint Cloud Mn
Posts: 745
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

Or many it was the egg.
daren007 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2020, 06:40 AM   #64
Chris in WNC
Senior Member
 
Chris in WNC's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Spruce Pine, NC
Posts: 1,458
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

Licensed to Kill-
Restamping your replacement engine to match your title is a LOT different from stealing a car.
No evil intent and no defrauding of anyone, including a subsequent buyer.
And most of the time the first engine is junked, or if not the number can be removed to prevent any duplicate number problems.
__________________
our next Model A is out there in the unknown......
Chris in WNC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2020, 08:25 AM   #65
eagle
Senior Member
 
eagle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Eagle Bend, MN
Posts: 2,025
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris in WNC View Post
Licensed to Kill-
Restamping your replacement engine to match your title is a LOT different from stealing a car.
No evil intent and no defrauding of anyone, including a subsequent buyer.
And most of the time the first engine is junked, or if not the number can be removed to prevent any duplicate number problems.
FINALLY! Some common sense.
__________________
"There are some that can destroy an anvil with a teaspoon and shouldn't be allowed to touch anything resembling a tool."
eagle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2020, 09:01 AM   #66
Licensed to kill
Senior Member
 
Licensed to kill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Alberta
Posts: 930
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris in WNC View Post
Licensed to Kill-
Restamping your replacement engine to match your title is a LOT different from stealing a car.
No evil intent and no defrauding of anyone, including a subsequent buyer.
And most of the time the first engine is junked, or if not the number can be removed to prevent any duplicate number problems.
You are missing the point. The point is that, if it's legal to restamp the VIN on a replacement engine, then how do you determine a "legal" restamp from an "illegal" restamp?. Yes, the old engine is often replaced because it is junk, but not always and "junk" to one guy is "rebuildable" to another AND many engines get replaced with OTHER engines (V8's). Then what??. If you put a flathead V8 in your car, where do you stamp the VIN?. There are a LOT of reasons people remove serviceable engines. The point is, if it is LEGAL to restamp the VIN, that leaves the door open for all kinds of abuse and problems.
Licensed to kill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2020, 01:08 PM   #67
john charlton
Senior Member
 
john charlton's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,304
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

In the UK the frame is the item which has the title .High end cars mostly before WW 2 were sold as as a rolling driving vehicle with cowl instruments steering etc etc . These were bodied by coachbuilders to the customers requirements . Rolls Royce ,Bentley etc etc .Sometimes these cars were rebodied several times as fashions moved on . They kept their same VIN identity throughout .

John in Suffolk County England .
john charlton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2020, 01:16 PM   #68
Tinbasher
Senior Member
 
Tinbasher's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Innisfil, Ontario Canada
Posts: 1,173
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

Same thing her in Ontario. The VIN. is the important number. But not a big deal to get a ownership. A bill of sale, a Affidavid and a appraisal and your all set. The big part is the province getting the sales tax. The rest doesn't matter.
Tinbasher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2020, 03:42 PM   #69
Chris in WNC
Senior Member
 
Chris in WNC's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Spruce Pine, NC
Posts: 1,458
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

Licensed to kill-
And you also missed my point- I did not say it was necessarily LEGAL to re-stamp an engine, just that is was by no means the equivalent of stealing a car as you implied.
Done correctly there will be NO negative consequences for anyone.
__________________
our next Model A is out there in the unknown......
Chris in WNC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2020, 05:32 PM   #70
PotvinV8
Senior Member
 
PotvinV8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 114
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C View Post
This is probably the last time I am going to discuss this until I hear back from how the lawsuit comes out.
Wow. I couldn't imagine dragging this into court. It's not that difficult to register a car with zero paperwork, I just did two last year. To think that the title is worth a lawsuit, that's some craziness there...
PotvinV8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-14-2020, 06:49 AM   #71
Chris in WNC
Senior Member
 
Chris in WNC's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Spruce Pine, NC
Posts: 1,458
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PotvinV8 View Post
Wow. I couldn't imagine dragging this into court. It's not that difficult to register a car with zero paperwork, I just did two last year. To think that the title is worth a lawsuit, that's some craziness there...

Maybe they are OCD like me and want to actually have the engine number on the title,
rather than a non-Model A state-assigned serial number.
I would not consider litigation worth the cost, but clearly someone does.
__________________
our next Model A is out there in the unknown......
Chris in WNC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-14-2020, 09:23 AM   #72
Licensed to kill
Senior Member
 
Licensed to kill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Alberta
Posts: 930
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris in WNC View Post
Licensed to kill-
And you also missed my point- I did not say it was necessarily LEGAL to re-stamp an engine, just that is was by no means the equivalent of stealing a car as you implied.
Done correctly there will be NO negative consequences for anyone.
I re-read my previous post and you are correct, I didn't word that right. What I meant to say was how would DMV determine whether a restamp is legit or fraudulent in the case of a stolen car?. Also, if we lived in a world where everyone was honest and everyone ALWAYS did everything "correctly", we not would not need most of the laws and regulations we have.
Licensed to kill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-14-2020, 11:16 AM   #73
Hoop
Senior Member
 
Hoop's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Jacksonville FL
Posts: 1,137
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

Lic to kill,

Can one ever legally alter, remove or obliterate a VIN in Canada?

If so, or if not, post a link to the appropriate Criminal Code.
__________________
"Remember that when it comes to intelligence, half of all of us are below average."
Hoop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-14-2020, 08:14 PM   #74
Denali
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 33
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

That happened to me. The fella at Bert's put the s/n of my old engine on the new engine. I power sanded the s/n off the old engine and drew a s/n out of the air and stamped it on the engine and it passed the local police VIN background.
Denali is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-14-2020, 09:44 PM   #75
Bill G
Senior Member
 
Bill G's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Walla Walla, WA
Posts: 1,044
Default Re: Title goes with Frame or Engine?

My opinion - the title-able vehicle was parted out. The vehicle is just parts now and the vehicle no longer exists. I think you have to draw the line somewhere.
Bill G is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:13 AM.