Mac's USA made master cylinder or so I thought

[Mart]

I'm sure no-one is out to deceive anyone. Let them sort things out. They have already started by altering the wording. It must take longer to change the images. When they started selling that part supplied by Federal Mogul, it was indeed made in USA. Unfortunately for Macs, Federal Mogul have outsourced it to Taiwan or China. It may still be a better product because it is supplied by Federal Mogul, a recognised brand. The other cylinder has no brand name to back it up.

Chill, guys, it's a holiday.

Mart.

[BILL WZOREK]

Just wondering if you walked into your local Ford dealer and asked for a master cylinder not saying it had to be made in the USA.
What would you get one made in USA - China - Taiwan or told we don't stock parts for some thing that old any more / And they are the ones that built the vehicle - - - -

This is just food for thought not to argue or make what happen CORRECT or WRONG ! ! !

[V8COOPMAN]

Just wait 'til this current failed-experiment dude passes his Pacific Trade Agreement with it's very-SECRET details. DD

[BABAR40]

V8COOPMAN, I do believe you are on to something. The episode "Selling Out", coming soon.

[KGS]

Originally Posted by johnh7

Funny you should ask, I just looked up the part I ordered on their web site, but the add has been changed and no longer says USA Made, they have changed it. But if you click on the picture, the side of the master cylinder still shows Made in USA. They are quickly covering their tracks, but I have news for them I copied the page showing USA Made before they changed it.

Mac's still has not contacted me, they probably won't until Tuesday because of the holiday. I am interested to see what they say and if they try to say the add never said USA made. Then I will send them a copy of the original page.
Lets all wait and see what they do?

FWIW, Mac's 2015-16 snail mail catalog states that the "-US" part is made in the USA.

[johnh7]

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Mac's never contacted me, so I called and spoke to a man who read the ticket information from my call last Thursday. He looked online and said, "Sir, this part does not say it was made in the USA." I informed him that it did prior to last Friday. I directed him to the thumbnail for the part and told him that it still said USA made, he looked and agreed that it did still say USA Made. I told him the picture still shows a master cylinder with Made in USA on the side. He said that means nothing because it is just a representative item. I asked him if he thought the Federal Trade Commission would have that same interpretation. He said, "No, Probably not."

I asked for a supervisor. The supervisor assured me no wrong doing was intended. I of course asked her if substituting foreign made parts for USA made parts was normal business practice. She assured me it was not. She told me she would find a USA made part and overnight it to me to make this right. She also told me she would take steps to make sure the advertisement was corrected and the parts department never again puts a USA Made sticker over a Made in Taiwan sticker.

A few hours later a man called me and told me he managed to find a USA made part and would overnight it to me along with a gift certificate because of the trouble I had been through. I will wait to see what comes.

[Mike B]

Well done John...glad the outcome will be satisfying, just a shame you have to jump through hoops to get it solved.

[34pickup]

John, if more of us were like you then they might get the message and start supplying what we want.

[Mart]

I'm sure Macs would love to be able to continue to supply USA made cylinders. Is there a USA manufacturer that still makes these cylinders in the USA? Or are any USA made cylinders that are available the last of a dwindling stock. Once they're gone, they're gone.

Can anyone guarantee they can supply USA made wheel cylinders into the future?

I dunno, but I would guess the answer is no.

Mart.

[hotrodA]

The squeaky wheel gets the grease. Good for you for sticking to your standards.
Be interesting to see if Mac's cleans up their act, or appeasing you is where it stops.

"If you want fresh, clean oats, they will cost more than oats that have already been through the horse." Just don't try to sell used oats at the higher priced oats' price.

[Mike B]

Originally Posted by Mart

I'm sure Macs would love to be able to continue to supply USA made cylinders. Is there a USA manufacturer that still makes these cylinders in the USA? Or are any USA made cylinders that are available the last of a dwindling stock. Once they're gone, they're gone.

Can anyone guarantee they can supply USA made wheel cylinders into the future?

I dunno, but I would guess the answer is no.

Mart.

Not sure Mart, but maybe in the future wording will be correct, and "Made in USA" won't be shown in the parts pic's, if the parts are not manufactured in the USA.

The old "photo is a representation....", doesn't substitute for what I feel is deceit...I mean why not use the Asian made part for the photo of a "Made in USA" part?

My gut tells me the photo with the "Made in USA" on the side of it, was done on purpose and the ""part pictured may not be the same" is a cop out.

[1931 flamingo]

johnh7: When/if you receive a Made in USA M/cyl please let us know who(m) the manufacturer is or who(m) Mac's got it from so others may benefit from this journey.
Paul in CT

[Fordors]

Originally Posted by 1931 flamingo

johnh7: When/if you receive a Made in USA M/cyl please let us know who(m) the manufacturer is or who(m) Mac's got it from so others may benefit from this journey.
Paul in CT

That may or may not be a help. In a perfect world warehousing is FIFO- first in, first out. Mac's may locate a USA made cylinder in their stock but it could be the very last one in existence, produced long before the off shore pieces.
I understand the original posters concern and he was correct in addressing the situation considering truth in advertising, but moving forward are we to believe that Wagner or any other major concern might have sub-standard components (particularly safety related) manufactured and marketed? Given the choice I would buy a Wagner component no matter where produced compared to a cheaper part produced by who knows who.

[1oldtimer]

As of 9:30p 5/26 is still says US. I'm all for spending more for quality or supporting a local mom and pop place, but that much more for the exact same part?.

[ford38v8]

Originally Posted by 1oldtimer

As of 9:30p 5/26 is still says US. I'm all for spending more for quality or supporting a local mom and pop place, but that much more for the exact same part?.

That would depend on what the exact definition of exact is.

[JWL]

Mart is on to something---we (United States) have pretty well priced ourselves out of business. If companies do not "outsource" or sub-contract they will soon die. We all want USA made but most of us cannot afford it. A new car or truck which is totally USA produced would cost as much as a Rolls Royce. Maybe a slight exaggeration?

[1938 Coupe]

Originally Posted by Talkwrench

I bought this up about Timken... Hardly anything made in the good ol' USA any more.

Babies.....we still make babies here, but that's about it!

[rowens55]

Originally Posted by ford38v8

That would depend on what the exact definition of exact is.

Come on now "Mr. 38v8" we've been around that mall berry bush!!
"Is","is"...... No one takes responsibility any more, not even our "chief executives"....

[Eckler's]

Sorry guys i've been away from the office. Long story short the USA made are no longer being made and are dang near impossible to find a supply. We switched to Federal Mogul
not knowing their supply was not US made when we did the switch to them. We should have done better research before we pulled the trigger. It's never our intention to advertise USA made parts and send you guys imports that's bad business. Sometimes things do get lost in the shuffle, still not an excuse. We need to do a better job in sourcing our parts for you guys. And trust me this thread has been show to everyone in the sourcing department to show them how big of deal this really is. I'd also like to comment on why we changed the website and pictures so fast. I didn't want the next guy ordering the same part and we have this same problem again. Once we found out that these are not USA made anymore we changed everything for that reason. it wasn't to cover our tracks i can assure you of that. Luckily we find one on our warehouse that was USA made and shipped it overnight. Again Johnh7 i'd like to i apologize for any inconvenience caused during your build.

[johnh7]

Originally Posted by Eckler's

Sorry guys i've been away from the office. Long story short the USA made are no longer being made and are dang near impossible to find a supply. We switched to Federal Mogul
not knowing their supply was not US made when we did the switch to them. We should have done better research before we pulled the trigger. It's never our intention to advertise USA made parts and send you guys imports that's bad business. Sometimes things do get lost in the shuffle, still not an excuse. We need to do a better job in sourcing our parts for you guys. And trust me this thread has been show to everyone in the sourcing department to show them how big of deal this really is. I'd also like to comment on why we changed the website and pictures so fast. I didn't want the next guy ordering the same part and we have this same problem again. Once we found out that these are not USA made anymore we changed everything for that reason. it wasn't to cover our tracks i can assure you of that. Luckily we find one on our warehouse that was USA made and shipped it overnight. Again Johnh7 i'd like to i apologize for any inconvenience caused during your build.

Thanks and I appreciate your wanting to do good business, the only problem is I received the part this morning and it is identical to the first one you sent me. All the marks and letters on it are exactly the same. The only difference is it did come with a push rod and this one is not in a Wagner box. It came rolled up in bubble wrap.

There are no stickers on it except for the one on the bag which reads: "Master Cylinder / Federal Mogul / W / Boot & Pushrod." What are the odds that Wagner made this exactly the same way before outsourcing to overseas? There is nothing on it or with it that says USA Made. What about it distinguishes it from the foreign made one? I guess if you say so? hahahaha

If I choose to push this I am sure it can be proved this came from the same overseas manufacturer. You say that selling something as being made in USA when it is not, is "bad business", that is a nice way of saying it is illegal.

Your company violated the Federal Trade Commission Act when it listed it as USA Made. Selling it to me with your sticker saying USA Made over the one that says Made in Taiwan furthered the crime. Charging me a premium because it is USA Made is tantamount to theft. I am guessing that you must think me stupid and easily fooled and appeased? Wrong is wrong, it doesn't matter how much you sweet talk it or candy coat it.

It is my opinion that I now have two foreign made master cylinders. The tooling and casting marks are identical. Both have B-34 stamped on the left side. Want me to call the Federal Trade Commission and let them investigate this and see if they agree with me? If they do, and find this one is exactly the same as the first one which clearly was marked made in Taiwan, you will have made their case for them. You are a company representative who is talking to thousands of customers and you wrote that this one is Made in the USA, your company told me on the phone it is USA Made and your receipt says "USA" behind the item description. Is that supposed to mean it was manufactured in the USA? I was promised this one is USA made and that it would be overnight-ed to me that day and they would also send me a gift certificate to appease me for my troubles. They waited a full 24 hours to even submit it to Fedex and there was no gift certificate. Let's see if two out of three promises were broken what are the odds the third one was broken too? If this one is determined to be also foreign made your company will pay millions in fines. Just the news that you are being investigated will cost you many sales. Not a good way to go.

I spent most of my police career as an investigator. After I retired, I spent almost 4 years in Iraq investigating, locating, arresting and prosecuting terrorists. I had a top secret clearance. I don't think I will have much trouble getting the Federal Trade Commission to listen to me. My investigative skills have not diminished.

Do you really want to pass this one off as USA Made? The ball is in your court. Don't test me to see if I will really push this. You won't like how I play. I will wait for your personal response to me. [email protected].

Not getting back to me will be interpreted by me as "go for it".