V8 Clutch conversion

[modelamodela]

Having had problems with the clutch chattering and unable to adjust it out, we are planning to replace the clutch with a V8 clutch. Where is a good supply source for a flywheel , pressure plate, and disc?

[700rpm]

Before you do all that, check to see that the shims at the top of the flywheel housing are in place, and check your flywheel runout. If your flywheel has been lightened or resurfaced, be sure everything there is still in proper alignment. Also, chatter can be caused by a bad pilot bearing or main drive gear where it goes into the pilot bearing. If all those things are good, then consider the V8 clutch. Unless, of course, you just want a V8 clutch.

I've also heard, though don't have confirmation of it, that float-a-motor mounts can cause chatter.

[James Rogers]

Originally Posted by modelamodela

Having had problems with the clutch chattering and unable to adjust it out, we are planning to replace the clutch with a V8 clutch. Where is a good supply source for a flywheel , pressure plate, and disc?

See my website.

[Timberbeast]

Never had a chatter problem with my float-a-motor kit.

[Mike V. Florida]

Why did you decide to use the V8 setup and not just the stock setup?

[CarlG]

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You could try one of these:

[PC/SR]

Good question by Mike V. Why?
If you want to chop the flywheel and do all the other stuff that goes with it for a V8 clutch, flywheel, linkage, etc, go ahead and do it, but just to stop chattering find the problem. You might try some brake cleaner on the clutch plate, or better, the flywheel face and get the grease off of it. Spray it in through the inspection plate. Chatter is caused by contaminants on the clutch, or a bad adjustment, or a bad spring.
Bill W and the dog knows how to do this.

[31 RPU]

I got mine from Ron's Machine shop. The price was $380 with core.

[jhowes]

I have the V8 clutch, lightened flywheel, and would never do it again, I see no advantage although they work fine. My engine has a 5-9 head and larger intake valves, dual carbs, B grind cam. What a waste except maybe the head and cam.
stay with the original setup and you can't loose and it saves a lot of money. Jack

[modelamodela]

This is the second time the clutch has given problems, the clutch in there has maybe 500 miles on it, and it grabs, sticks and sometimes chatters. I figured if I am going to tear it down again I might as well change everything including the flywheel, in case the flywheel is part of the problem. That being said, one of my cars has a V8 clutch in it and it does perform well. That's the rationale.

[Vic in E-TN]

To CarlG
What kind of pressure plate is in the picture and who offers it?

Vic

[CarlG]

Originally Posted by Vic in E-TN

To CarlG
What kind of pressure plate is in the picture and who offers it?

Vic

I'm not sure what the original application of the pressure plate was, believe it was Jeep, but not sure.

I got the flywheel/pressure plate from Ron Kelley in Dallas.

[TerryH]

I had the lightened flywheel and V-8 clutch and pressure plate done many years ago, and am very happy with it. There is much less pressure on the clutch pedal and for me, it works flawlessly. I also happen to like less weight on the rear main, but was told by some the car would never idle right with that flywheel...not true!

[larrys40]

ModelaModelA,

Your problem could be clutch fingers that aren't properly adjusted/set on your pressure plate. I responded recently to a gentleman who had some clutch issues and suggested a fix for adjusting them in the car. You might at least want to "check" them before pulling it as opposed to just installing a V8 clutch. A stock Model A clutch adjusted properly with good clutch disc, flywheel, etc will be silk smooth. I see NO reason to install a v8 clutch . If the V8 pressure plate needs finger adjustments ( and they do) unfortunately most rebuilders weld the adjustment on them rendering them difficult to adjust if needed.

My process could save you some time and money. (Previous post/process pasted below)Best of luck,
Larry Shepard
St. Charles, MO

10-28-2013, 09:31 AM #25 larrys40

Senior Member

Join Date: May 2010

Posts: 306

Re: Clutch adjustment

Barber, I know you've stated a couple of times the free play..... I would try and lessen the free play a little and see if that helps. You don't want the throwout turning when the clutch is released.... I suspect it is really the adjustment on the pressure plate fingers that are the culprit. When you replaced the clutch disk that factor changed as well. I've adjusted the fingers in the car before.....Not as precision as out with it in front of you.

If that doesn't do it here's my suggestion for trying it in the car. Otherwise I'd pull the rear and transmission to do it in the car.

With trans in car:

Inspection cover removed

You will need to used a small steel rule and another thin rule of sort to see what the distance is between the top of the clutch cover and the top of the contact area of the a finger. I would look for 5/8 on any one of the fingers. If you have that, mark that one with a permanent marker. If none of the fingers are close to that get them there by adjustment of the nut ( 1/2 wrench) and holding the screw and trying to adjust in to get your correct finger gap.
Caution: if the nuts are staked tightly you mar want to take a small screw driver and hammer and unstake them a little. The last thing you want it to break a 1/2 of the adjustment stud. Not trying to scare you but it can happen. When you're all done you can put a dab of thread locker on the outside ( it will creep a little and better than nothing) and also try to lightly restake. It's hard to do in the car.

once you have the finger depth at one near 5/8, undo the clutch arm and let it fully rest back on the trans hub. Using the finger vertically aligned at the top, find a socket that will fit perfectly ( outside diameter of the socket on it's side as a gap gauge. The is just your temporary gap gauge.

important note**** tie a long string through the socket so you can slip into place and pull up when done. You can use a feeler gauge to check your clearance between socket and finger. I know this is a tight two handed process but it is worth a shot.

Adjust all other fingers to match. rotate engine so that each respective finger is at the top to check and adjust. Mark those done with a permenant marker. Be patient, keep a string on the socket and around your wrist or anchored somewhere ( like gas pedal) It's worth a shot before pulling rear end and trans to reset .

This works... as I have done this several times of the years. It is exactly why when installing an engine, new clutch, etc, I make sure all fingers are set. It is much easier out of the car than in.

Don't forget to reset your clutch free play.

One more parting note. Don't drop the socket and string!!! or you have to go fishing...
Best of luck,
Larry Shepard

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Originally Posted by PC/SR

Good question by Mike V. Why?
If you want to chop the flywheel and do all the other stuff that goes with it for a V8 clutch, flywheel, linkage, etc, go ahead and do it, but just to stop chattering find the problem. You might try some brake cleaner on the clutch plate, or better, the flywheel face and get the grease off of it. Spray it in through the inspection plate. Chatter is caused by contaminants on the clutch, or a bad adjustment, or a bad spring.
Bill W and the dog knows how to do this.

Thanks for the acknowledgement, P.C, I always "wonder" if folks out "there" pay attention to proven helps/advice. Bill W.

[Chris Haynes]

I had my flywheel lightened, set up for V-8 clutch, and resurfaced for under $150.00. My local auto parts machine shop did it by using a blueprint I found somewhere on this web site.
I bought a NOS automobile V-8 clutch and pressure plate on eBay for under $125.00. Be sure you don't buy the similar looking Ford tractor pressure plate.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by CarlG

I'm not sure what the original application of the pressure plate was, believe it was Jeep, but not sure.

I got the flywheel/pressure plate from Ron Kelley in Dallas.

S10 pressure plate. They work wonderfully, better than the V8. I can push my clutch down with my hand, I've seen one that could be pressed all the way done with just 2-3 fingers.

[MikeK]

Originally Posted by Chris Haynes

I had my flywheel lightened, set up for V-8 clutch, and resurfaced for under $150.00. My local auto parts machine shop did it by using a blueprint I found somewhere on this web site.
I bought a NOS automobile V-8 clutch and pressure plate on eBay for under $125.00. Be sure you don't buy the similar looking Ford tractor pressure plate.

I happen to prefer the non-flyweight Borg & Beck style pressure plate. I guess it's a matter of driving style. There is more spring pressure, but still much less pedal pressure than stock. This results in less slippage (and heat & wear) during heavy throttle and load slow speed pulls.

Most people think once a clutch plate is clamped, the plate never moves. This is not true. All clutch plates, no matter how strong the clamp, continuously drift while under heavy load. When you reach the point where the shock springs built into the disc hit their travel limit the same hammering forces that harmonically plague the crank begin working directly on the clutch plate. Imagine applying a 1/2" air ratchet to the splined hub. When those hub springs hit bottom the plate gets hammered along in a circle despite the clamp pressure. If you do a lot of heavy, slow pulls a weaker spring clutch will slip, heat, and wear more.

At higher speeds the counterweighted V8 clutch centripitaly applies more clamp pressure to compensate for the weaker springs. The result is a pedal that is actually harder to push down than the non-counter weighted version. If you run the engine rpm way up before shifting like I do, the non-counterweight version is actually easier to depress during gear up-shifts. Again, driving preferences.

The diaphragm clutch shown by Carl and mentioned by Logan (S10 style) has a very different pedal pressure profile than a straight spring plate like the stock or either of the later Borg & Beck styles, both the flyweighted V8 and stronger spring no flyweighted versions. A diaphragm clutch has maximum spring pressure when engaged and the pressure diminishes when the pedal is all the way down. Opposite of a straight spring. The result is a pedal that is very light to hold down for extended periods, like crawling in very slow stop/go modern traffic. They tend to have a bit of an engagement 'bite', requiring a bit of relearning for the feather point if you jump from one car to another. Again, driving preferences.

[Chris Haynes]

Is the bolt pattern on the S10 pressure plate the same a Ford V-8? Is the S10 compatable with the A throwout bearing?

[modelamodela]

Although I greatly appreciate the input regarding trying to adjust the assembly on the car, I removed the tranny and found: many small cracks and scoring in the flywheel surface; irregular wear on the disc; funny looking wear and hot spots on the pressure plate surface. As far as I could tell, everything was screwed up. So I went through my collection of flywheels and found one that looked perfect, installed it and bought a rebuilt pressure plate from Bratton's, together with new bearings and disc. Put it all back together, but there is snow around and haven't yet driven the car. I suspect it will be much improved, or at least much different, since everything is changed. Only thing I didn't do was balance the assembly, no machine shop around here does that routinely.
Thanks to everyone who chimed in .