Go Back   The Ford Barn > General Discussion > Model A (1928-31)

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-21-2011, 09:57 AM   #1
30Tudor
Senior Member
 
30Tudor's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 211
Default New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

I am replacing my oil pan gasket for the third time. I seem to have a recurring leak at the rear of the pan. (Oil is not coming out the flywheel housing cotter pin hole). The last two gaskets I have used are the cork gaskets and I think I have over tightened the bolts and squeezed the gasket out. I just got a new gasket from Synders (see picture) and had a couple of questions:
1. Has anybody had experience with this? It says don’t use gasket sealers. I normally use a light sealer to glue the gasket to the engine side. Also, what about the interface between the rear main cap gasket and the engine flanges?
2. I also have a set of paper gaskets – is that the way to go?
3. Any chance my pan flanges could be warped? – I will check this.
Thanks
Attached Images
File Type: jpg DSC01651.JPG (193.8 KB, 303 views)
30Tudor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2011, 06:13 PM   #2
john in illinois
Senior Member
 
john in illinois's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Illinois
Posts: 2,181
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

I use trhe Snyder cork pan gaskets with good results. Follow the directions and torque it as recommended. I only use silicone sealer at the front and rear corners where it meets the other gaskets. It also helps to cut the heads off 4 bolts and screw them into the block. They will guide the pan on and help position the gasket. remove after you install the other bolts.

John
john in illinois is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
Old 05-21-2011, 06:40 PM   #3
Elcastor
Senior Member
 
Elcastor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Oregon and Baja Mexico
Posts: 617
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

I just installed those and their instructions are a joke! It says to use no sealer. Ok, how do you hold the gasket against the block, and then install the rear main seal gasket against the pan gasket? Oh, I know, follow the instructions in the Les Andrews Mechanics Handbook. It says, "First rotate the engine upside down"!! Grrrrr.

Doing all this with limited space while the wife holds the oil pump from falling down. I used gasket sealer! I don't know if it will seal, but it saved a marriage!
__________________
Ben Purkey
Mexico and the Pacific NW
http://www.martin-parry.com/
Elcastor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-22-2011, 06:46 AM   #4
john in illinois
Senior Member
 
john in illinois's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Illinois
Posts: 2,181
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

Elcastor,you are right. I was thiking of installing pan with engine out. In the car we use patches of hi-tac gasket seal on the block.

The 4 guide studs help align the pan and compress the the oil pump spring. Lock the pump in with a locking tool available from suppliers cheap or make one from a pipe plug and a bolt. Tool screws into the hole in the block by the oil pump.

John
john in illinois is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-2011, 12:57 AM   #5
CarlG
Senior Member
 
CarlG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Anchorage, Alaska
Posts: 9,109
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

Quote:
Originally Posted by 30Tudor View Post
... I just got a new gasket from Synders (see picture) ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by fordgarage View Post
...For pan gaskets I use a coating of chassis grease on each side, no sealer...
Quote:
Originally Posted by john in illinois View Post
...Follow the directions and torque it as recommended...Lock the pump in with a locking tool available from suppliers cheap or make one from a pipe plug and a bolt. Tool screws into the hole in the block by the oil pump...
I pretty much followed the above, held the pan in place with a scissor jack, put 4 bolts in to locate everything. Have a couple hundred miles on it -- so far-so good!
CarlG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-2011, 07:25 AM   #6
MrTube
Senior Member
 
MrTube's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 1,471
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)
I installed those gaskets a few months ago. I used hi-tack in a spray can to get it to stick to the block.... sort of.


Pan seems to have sealed fine tho I had to drop it again for other reasons. Going to try the gasket set from Bratton's this time. Only reason being I figured i'd try both styles.
MrTube is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-2011, 11:00 AM   #7
1930artdeco
Senior Member
 
1930artdeco's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Lynden, Wa
Posts: 3,548
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

I have used this style with permatex 'aviation form-a-gasket' sealer and it works just fine.

Mike
__________________
1930 TownSedan (Briggs)
1957 Country Sedan
1930artdeco is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-2011, 09:57 PM   #8
30Tudor
Senior Member
 
30Tudor's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 211
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

Thanks for the responses. I am going to tackle it later this week. I have used the permex aviation gasket sealer before with great success to hold the gasket to the engine side. I may try the grease this time.
30Tudor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-2011, 10:53 AM   #9
Glenn C.
Senior Member
 
Glenn C.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Didsbury Alberta
Posts: 838
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

Maybe your flyweel housing to block is leaking. How are you sure that it is sealing?
You just must like rolling around on the floor for something to do. Ha!
Glenn C. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-2011, 11:32 AM   #10
Marco Tahtaras
Senior Member
 
Marco Tahtaras's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 3,099
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

Before you go to all the trouble it would be good to confirm the actual location of the leak. Remove the flywheel housing shield and wipe everything down well. As mentioned it COULD be coming down from the camshaft hole at the rear of the block. Additionally, many engine builders forget or neglect to true up the rear main cap surface. Many of these caps have been crudely filed over the years to take up bearing clearances and subsequently seep oil between the cap and block. This oil will usually exit the cotter hole in the flywheel housing, but not always.

If you do need to pull the pan then be sure the pan flange is flat. Over tightening the pan bolts over time can draw up the metal surrounding each bolt hole leaving the flange lower between bolts. This can be easily remedied with a hammer and dolly (and a little common sense).

I use a 3/8" drive ratchet with a long extension to tighten the pan bolts. I position my hand right at the hub of the ratchet to reduce leverage and tighten by feel. Does anyone ever think about why a standard 1/2" wrench is so short?
__________________
http://www.abarnyard.com/
Marco Tahtaras is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-2011, 12:08 PM   #11
CarlG
Senior Member
 
CarlG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Anchorage, Alaska
Posts: 9,109
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

The instructions that came with my gasket said to tighten to 6 ft lbs. Since that is the very bottom end of my torque wrench, I got a 1/4" inch-pounds torque wrench so that I could measure it more accurately. Obviously it doesn't take much, my gasket isn't leaking (so far!).
CarlG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-2011, 12:26 PM   #12
msmaron
Senior Member
 
msmaron's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Wauconda, IL
Posts: 3,600
Send a message via AIM to msmaron
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marco Tahtaras View Post

I use a 3/8" drive ratchet with a long extension to tighten the pan bolts. I position my hand right at the hub of the ratchet to reduce leverage and tighten by feel. Does anyone ever think about why a standard 1/2" wrench is so short?
VERY Good point, i too have seen too many bolt heads sheared off. Good advice
__________________
Mark Maron
Ill., Region MARC & MAFCA
MARC JSC Member MAFFI Trustee
National Facebook Admin.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/MARC.group/

A7191-Sport Coupe
29 Roadster
29-Town Sedan
29-Original Special Coupe
msmaron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-2011, 02:32 PM   #13
30Tudor
Senior Member
 
30Tudor's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 211
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenn C. View Post
Maybe your flyweel housing to block is leaking. How are you sure that it is sealing?
You just must like rolling around on the floor for something to do. Ha!
I had considered the flywheel housing to block gasket leaking, however, this was discussed a couple of posts back and people seamed to think it was not that common. I checked into the flywheel housing through the clutch inspection hole and also through the flywheel housing inspection plate and as far as I could tell it was dry at the bottom (I will check again). I am really starting to think, as Marco has indicated, that the pan flanges may be warped.

All of this is a bit of a mystery for me as I had what local Model A folklore refers to as the smartest and best mechanic in Western Canada assist me with the engine rebuild last year.
30Tudor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-2011, 02:58 PM   #14
mot
Registered User
 
mot's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Sacramento Ca
Posts: 1,179
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

one question was asked how to hold the gasket while installing the pan?
we used to use thread,tie the gasket to the pan or block whichever was easier,then before you tighten the bolts tight ,just snip the thread and finish tightening or some times we just left the thread in
mot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-2011, 05:20 PM   #15
Kirby1374
Senior Member
 
Kirby1374's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Coquille, Or
Posts: 280
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

mot, I love your avatar
Kirby1374 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2011, 10:51 PM   #16
30Tudor
Senior Member
 
30Tudor's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 211
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

I just wanted to update this post that I created earlier this year.

I installed the pan gasket earlier this summer using grease to hold it in place during the installation - which worked really well. I used a liberal amount of "right stuff" gasket sealer in the front and rear where the pan gasket intercepts the rear main gasket and the front rope seal. I also used allignment pins in the two front and two rear pan bolt holes which stopped the gasket from moving around when I pushed the pan up.

The other thing I did was to put gasket sealer on all the pan bolts that go through into the crankcase. In hindsight I think this issue was causing my original leaking as the repo pan bolt threads likely were different than the female threads in the block. This cleared up the majority of the drips. I am down to the occaisonal drip or two ending up at the drainage plug - but fortunately nothing out of the cotter pin hole in the flywheel housing.

Thanks for all your help and advice.
30Tudor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-10-2012, 02:09 AM   #17
columbiA
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: B.C. Canada
Posts: 1,746
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

I always stick the side gaskets,with some permatex on the block first since the gasket tabs fit into the rear main groove before the rear cork is put in place &front tabs fit between upper & lower packing.Use grease on lower side of gaskets w-a small dab of permatex in the corners.With this method Ive used the same gaskets several times with no leaks.
columbiA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2012, 11:52 AM   #18
V4F
Senior Member
 
V4F's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: ca.
Posts: 2,522
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation

i use the "ford" T handle tool . hard to over tighten at my age !
__________________
V4f
V4F is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2013, 09:54 PM   #19
30Tudor
Senior Member
 
30Tudor's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 211
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation - Thanks Marco

I just wanted to update this post. I had been fighting an oil leak coming from the back of my oil pan for a couple of years and tried various gaskets and installation techniques to no avail.

I ended up getting a new pan and bolted it on with the cork gaskets - problem solved. As Marco suggested, the pan flanges must have been warped.

Thanks everybody.
30Tudor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2013, 12:00 AM   #20
Mike V. Florida
Senior Member
 
Mike V. Florida's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: South Florida
Posts: 14,054
Send a message via AIM to Mike V. Florida
Default Re: New Type Oil Pan Gasket Installation - Thanks Marco

Quote:
Originally Posted by 30Tudor View Post
I just wanted to update this post. I had been fighting an oil leak coming from the back of my oil pan for a couple of years and tried various gaskets and installation techniques to no avail.

I ended up getting a new pan and bolted it on with the cork gaskets - problem solved. As Marco suggested, the pan flanges must have been warped.

Thanks everybody.
Thank you for giving us the update!!
__________________
What's right about America is that although we have a mess of problems, we have great capacity - intellect and resources - to do some thing about them. - Henry Ford II
Mike V. Florida is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:20 PM.