The Ford Barn

Don/WI · 08-09-2011, 02:48 PM

I am assembling my rebuilt short-block and using Les Andrews manual as a guide. While I would not be without his manual it does leave out a lot of detail. Except for you who make a living at rebuilding engines, how many of us have done a short block assembly? The manual says to install the rope seal (after soaking in oil for a day or so) in the front timing cover and then goes on to say install the spring and cam plunger and then the gasket. WAIT JUST A MINUTE HERE!! Can someone tell me in detail how to go about installing the rope seal? It don't just slip in there and fit real snug without some outside influence. When it does finally shape up so you can get the bolts in the front cover, there is some of the rope seal sticking out on either side of the cover. Does this get trimmed off? What is the best way to do that? A sharp razor blade? After the rope seal is fitted to the cover, I'm assuming that you then remove it to install the spring, cam plunger and gasket. Then you need to do the same with the rope seal in the pan. So how do I accomplish that? Where does the excess rope go when I bolt the pan to the block and timing cover? Can someone give me some guidance for this part of the assembly? Please don't suggest that I should have let my engine rebuilder do the complete thing. I know that I could pay for having it done, but I am not a rich man and I'm even poorer now that our government has let us down with their latest budget balancing. Thanks for any and all advice. Don/WI

Special Coupe Frank · 08-09-2011, 03:29 PM

Don,

From what I've read between Les Andrews Vol I, Jim Schildt's "Restorers Shop Manual", and recommendations in Bratton's Catalog, the rope seal for the timing cover should not be trimmed. The excess will push back-up into the groove.

I did a timing gear replacement a month or so ago, and that upper rope seal makes installation of the timing cover a real bear, due to its thickness.

I wound-up using a drift-pin through one of the upper front holes to pull cover down low enough to get another ( lower ) front bolt started, then got another front bolt started on the opposite side, then used the drift to get the holes from the oil-pan lined-up and those bolts started. Once I had all the bolts started, I went back and started snugging things down.

I had the spring and plunger in-place, as I did not want to remove this cover again.

If you must trim the end of the seal, use a sharp ( new) single-edge razor blade, and try not to "fray" the end of the seal.

This is a whole lot easier of the engine block is on a bench or stand... trying to do it with the engine in the chassis is a bit more challenging.

Good luck !

SC Frank

James Rogers · 08-09-2011, 06:03 PM

Frank is correct. I usually place the grub in the cover and seat it with a socket approximately the same size as the pulley shaft by whacking it with a hammer. I put the cover on and install a bolt in the bottom right hole loosely. I use a phillips screwdriver to align the cover and install a bolt in the opposite side. The rest will be easy. The gasket is the hard part but, after about 50 or 100 motors it gets easier.

BRENT in 10-uh-C · 08-09-2011, 06:12 PM

One other little "tip", soak the seal in motor oil overnight prior to the installation. An old "spray bomb" plastic lid makes a great holder to put the oil in and it holds the seal in a "U" shape.

Brentwood Bob · 08-09-2011, 06:40 PM

Try putting the seal in a zip lock sandwich bag along with 1/2 cup 30 wt. oil. Seal the bag squeezing out the air. Take a 1 pound mt coffee can. Put the zip lock inside. Add boiling water to cover, maybe 1/2 a can full. Soak in this hotwater bath at least 10 minutes. Remove and use Jim's method of installation. I cut the "grub" with a sharp utility knife to leave a 1/8 inch exposure on either end.

Tom Wesenberg · 08-10-2011, 12:01 AM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

Be sure to have a good dab of grease on the end of the pluger, or you'll have a mysterious squeal that takes a while to go away.

Jim Brierley · 08-10-2011, 10:00 AM

Seating the dog t--d like James Rogers says is very important. I rarely find one that doesn't need the ends trimmed. I don't do a lot of engines but have an old Armstrong olive jar with a few soaking at all times.

RHD · 08-10-2011, 04:09 PM

I would never trim the ends of the front seal. Same goes with the cork strip for the pan seal on the main rear bearing cap. They are both made to a specific length on purpose.
I have never experienced any problems or leaks with the front seals. I soak the seal in oil overnight, press into place and as previously said, insert one lower bolt and with a strong screwdriver locate a top hole and get a few more bolts in place. Always works well. I use a good gasket sealer and "glue" the gasket to the cover. I always use gasket cement both sides.
I don't see the need for any modern seals (although most work well). I like the Model 'A' just the way it was meant to be.

08-09-2011, 02:48 PM	#1
Don/WI Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Kaukauna, Wisconsin Posts: 394	Help! - Installing rope seals for crank pulley. I am assembling my rebuilt short-block and using Les Andrews manual as a guide. While I would not be without his manual it does leave out a lot of detail. Except for you who make a living at rebuilding engines, how many of us have done a short block assembly? The manual says to install the rope seal (after soaking in oil for a day or so) in the front timing cover and then goes on to say install the spring and cam plunger and then the gasket. WAIT JUST A MINUTE HERE!! Can someone tell me in detail how to go about installing the rope seal? It don't just slip in there and fit real snug without some outside influence. When it does finally shape up so you can get the bolts in the front cover, there is some of the rope seal sticking out on either side of the cover. Does this get trimmed off? What is the best way to do that? A sharp razor blade? After the rope seal is fitted to the cover, I'm assuming that you then remove it to install the spring, cam plunger and gasket. Then you need to do the same with the rope seal in the pan. So how do I accomplish that? Where does the excess rope go when I bolt the pan to the block and timing cover? Can someone give me some guidance for this part of the assembly? Please don't suggest that I should have let my engine rebuilder do the complete thing. I know that I could pay for having it done, but I am not a rich man and I'm even poorer now that our government has let us down with their latest budget balancing. Thanks for any and all advice. Don/WI

08-09-2011, 03:29 PM	#2
Special Coupe Frank Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Northeast Penna Posts: 2,108	Re: Help! - Installing rope seals for crank pulley. Don, From what I've read between Les Andrews Vol I, Jim Schildt's "Restorers Shop Manual", and recommendations in Bratton's Catalog, the rope seal for the timing cover should not be trimmed. The excess will push back-up into the groove. I did a timing gear replacement a month or so ago, and that upper rope seal makes installation of the timing cover a real bear, due to its thickness. I wound-up using a drift-pin through one of the upper front holes to pull cover down low enough to get another ( lower ) front bolt started, then got another front bolt started on the opposite side, then used the drift to get the holes from the oil-pan lined-up and those bolts started. Once I had all the bolts started, I went back and started snugging things down. I had the spring and plunger in-place, as I did not want to remove this cover again. If you must trim the end of the seal, use a sharp ( new) single-edge razor blade, and try not to "fray" the end of the seal. This is a whole lot easier of the engine block is on a bench or stand... trying to do it with the engine in the chassis is a bit more challenging. Good luck ! SC Frank

08-09-2011, 06:03 PM	#3
James Rogers Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Asheville,NC Posts: 3,104	Re: Help! - Installing rope seals for crank pulley. Frank is correct. I usually place the grub in the cover and seat it with a socket approximately the same size as the pulley shaft by whacking it with a hammer. I put the cover on and install a bolt in the bottom right hole loosely. I use a phillips screwdriver to align the cover and install a bolt in the opposite side. The rest will be easy. The gasket is the hard part but, after about 50 or 100 motors it gets easier.

08-09-2011, 06:12 PM	#4
BRENT in 10-uh-C Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Eastern Tennessee Posts: 11,520	Re: Help! - Installing rope seals for crank pulley. One other little "tip", soak the seal in motor oil overnight prior to the installation. An old "spray bomb" plastic lid makes a great holder to put the oil in and it holds the seal in a "U" shape. __________________ . BRENT in 10-uh-C . www.model-a-ford.com ...(...Finally Updated!! ) .

08-09-2011, 06:40 PM	#5
Brentwood Bob Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: brentwood, ca Posts: 4,247	Re: Help! - Installing rope seals for crank pulley. Try putting the seal in a zip lock sandwich bag along with 1/2 cup 30 wt. oil. Seal the bag squeezing out the air. Take a 1 pound mt coffee can. Put the zip lock inside. Add boiling water to cover, maybe 1/2 a can full. Soak in this hotwater bath at least 10 minutes. Remove and use Jim's method of installation. I cut the "grub" with a sharp utility knife to leave a 1/8 inch exposure on either end.

08-10-2011, 12:01 AM	#6
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: Help! - Installing rope seals for crank pulley. Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Be sure to have a good dab of grease on the end of the pluger, or you'll have a mysterious squeal that takes a while to go away.

08-10-2011, 10:00 AM	#7
Jim Brierley Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Temecula, CA Posts: 4,091	Re: Help! - Installing rope seals for crank pulley. Seating the dog t--d like James Rogers says is very important. I rarely find one that doesn't need the ends trimmed. I don't do a lot of engines but have an old Armstrong olive jar with a few soaking at all times.

08-10-2011, 04:09 PM	#8
RHD Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: New Zealand Posts: 670	Re: Help! - Installing rope seals for crank pulley. I would never trim the ends of the front seal. Same goes with the cork strip for the pan seal on the main rear bearing cap. They are both made to a specific length on purpose. I have never experienced any problems or leaks with the front seals. I soak the seal in oil overnight, press into place and as previously said, insert one lower bolt and with a strong screwdriver locate a top hole and get a few more bolts in place. Always works well. I use a good gasket sealer and "glue" the gasket to the cover. I always use gasket cement both sides. I don't see the need for any modern seals (although most work well). I like the Model 'A' just the way it was meant to be. __________________ R.H.D. Author of Model 'A' Ford technical manuals. Supplier of good original RHD parts.