2024 Chickasha pre-war Swap Meet

[ssg57]

The difference between last year 2023 and this year 2024 swap meet is about half as many vendors. It's ashame to see a long time good swap meet just dwindling away.

The north building was just open to one section, and it was maybe half full.
The south building had maybe half the vendors, the paved parking lot was less than half full of vendors. The outside gravel/ grassy area was probably half full.

[Seth Swoboda]

I agree that the swap meets are dwindling away. However, the economy is in pretty rought shape also. I work at a bank and there are not many people spending money on much of anything.

[AzBob]

It’s official, 2024 will be the last Chickasha Pre War Swap meet.

[Hitman]

Originally Posted by Seth Swoboda

I agree that the swap meets are dwindling away. However, the economy is in pretty rought shape also. I work at a bank and there are not many people spending money on much of anything.

I disagree. I think this statement applies to regions. Some meets and economies are retracting but not all, out west we’re just not seeing this at all. Both are local issues though.

Swamp meets are growing, economies are growing. The Big 3 meet in San Diego quit only because the stadium and parking lot they used was torn down and redeveloped.

Chickasha is close to Pate next month, and Pate continues to grow turning into a huge regional meet. That’s likely contributing to the demise of other meets, and Dallas is a regional airport hub, making it cheap and easy to access.

[Fullraceflathead]

The economy is very bad very few people have money to spend you're very fortunate if you have money to spend this year.

[Ron Blissit]

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FleaBay and the internet has taken care of the swap meets.I have attended the Chickasha swap meet for many years.It was sad to see the low participation this. year.

[mcgarrett]

Not sure about the condition of swap meets in other parts of the country, but Pate Swap Meet in Ft. Worth, Texas this year has 13,000 vendor spaces available and I was told by one of the meet officials that they predict that they will likely sell them all. I had 4 spaces in 2023 and had a very profitable experience; sold lots of good vintage parts. My brother and I have 7 spaces booked for this year, so come on out April 25-27 at Texas Motor Speedway in Ft. Worth, Texas and bring plenty of money!!

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Yeah, my two-cents on this meet failing is more about the meet itself. I am a second generation attendee of Chickasha, and from my vantage point of what it used to be, ...and what it has become are two different things. I used to attend where I would typically buy a full pickup bed and two-car trailer load of Model-A bodies & parts each year. The last 3 years I have struggled to even fill a single axle trailer full of stuff. To prove my point, I posted some pictures of what I purchased in 2005. To compare, I posted a picture of what I purchased in 2019, and then in 2022. I barely covered my expenses in 2022, and I lost money attending in 2023.

As far as the meet itself, the Erslands who host the meet have also lost money the last couple of times they have hosted this meet. It isn't really their fault nor is it anyone's IMO. Grady County Fairgrounds used to be a 'rough & rugged' place however it now is a very, very nice facility today. Because of the Grady County's capitol outlay on building/renovating all the new facilities, the costs now to rent the fair grounds has grown considerably. Additionally, insurance costs to cover events like this in this day & time is stupid expensive too. When you consider two years ago attendance was way down, then last year there were only about ½ as many vendors as in that previous year, ...and this year was about ½ of what was there last year, it kinda makes it difficult to even break-even financially to host such an event.


FWIW, I don't necessarily think blaming the economy for affecting this meet is truly accurate since good Model-A parts still fetch strong money ....even in the present economy. It is my observation that the underlying reason this meet is failing is that the quantity of good parts are no longer being brought to this swap meet. Places like Luray, Hershey, Gilmore Model-A Day, a MARC or MAFCA National Meet swap meet, etc. is where the good stuff is going now. Likely because sellers can fetch a better price at these listed events.??.


As far as Pate goes, as a child I was at the first dozen or so when it was actually held at the Pate ranch in Cresson, TX. Even that swap meet has changed from what it made it successful back then until now where many feel it is now too big to serve the average single-marque hobbyist. Like many others, I would rather spend my time & travel money to attend a swap meet where there are only 50 or so vendors however ALL these 50 vendors only have Model-A related parts, vs. attending a 10,000 vendor swap meet where there may be 100 vendors with Model-A parts but you must sift thru all of the Mustang, Chevelle, Camaro, Mopar, Early V-8 Ford, AND the crafts/memorabilia stuff to find that really nice Model-A item. Additionally, the costs to attend these larger swap meets have become a deal-breaker for many unless you live fairly local. Having to spend $150 a night for lodging plus high-priced food concessions at the event diminish the costs of what you can spend whereas these one-day smaller meets held in rural areas tend to make whatever you purchase a much better value IMO.

.

[oldspert]

I'm with Brent, I think the smaller swap meets are better bargains because the space cost is usually less than the big meets thereby the vendors don't have to charge an arm and a leg for their stuff to make even money. I went to the Decatur swap meet (I would call it medium size) with three others and we came out with some bargain pieces. An A bell housing for $15, a 29 radiator (looks new) for $80, other miscellaneous odds and ends for cheap. Smaller is getting to be the better shopping venue.
Ed

[Hitman]

Again, I’ll say things are regional. Some meets are doing well and others aren’t for various reasons. A lot of people on here enjoy the benefits of what the country’s population looked like in the 30’s. A lot of that was real and mostly located east of the Missouri River with the exceptions of California, Seattle, or Denver. Where I live, most of our Model A’s are imported from other states. Our population didn’t take off until after WW2 and air conditioning, A’s were rare since our population was low. As a result, I have to drive 500 miles for a decent and even small swap meet. Lodging, food, and gas factor into my total costs. My alternative for parts is eBay and the shipping costs with that.

So if I’m committing to the cost of airfare, parts hauling home, hotel, food and other expenses, I’m going to Pate where I can find the gems among 13,000 vendors vs the couple hundred Chickasha likely offers. I’m also looking or more than A parts, the benefits are greater for me at Pate, Hershey. Etc.

Our British, Kiwi and Australian friends could provide their perspectives, which would blow everyone’s budgets out of the water. We all see them at Pate, Hershey, etc.

[ronn]

It looks like everyone has a differing opinion on this subject. I do think quite a bit of it is regional. Pate is so dam far away from me, I wouldnt even give it a 2nd glance. Same with chickasha.
I live only 2 hours from Hershey and if I were to attend anywhere, that would be it. But,

everyone is stating the last 5 yrs how much Hershey is diminishing....... so........
I buy every week on ebay and have now for 25 yrs. I find pretty much everything I want at the leisure of sitting at my computer. Better yet, I can do it at 1am in the morning or whenever I feel like. There are so many brick and mortar costs with swaps, that I do believe as a whole, they are dwindling.
and then finally, there is the age out process. None of us are getting any younger.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Hitman

Again, I’ll say things are regional. Some meets are doing well and others aren’t for various reasons. A lot of people on here enjoy the benefits of what the country’s population looked like in the 30’s. A lot of that was real and mostly located east of the Missouri River with the exceptions of California, Seattle, or Denver. Where I live, most of our Model A’s are imported from other states. Our population didn’t take off until after WW2 and air conditioning, A’s were rare since our population was low. As a result, I have to drive 500 miles for a decent and even small swap meet. Lodging, food, and gas factor into my total costs. My alternative for parts is eBay and the shipping costs with that.

So if I’m committing to the cost of airfare, parts hauling home, hotel, food and other expenses, I’m going to Pate where I can find the gems among 13,000 vendors vs the couple hundred Chickasha likely offers. I’m also looking or more than A parts, the benefits are greater for me at Pate, Hershey. Etc.

So what are you calling "Gems" -and what items are you looking for specifically at these larger meets?

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by ronn

It looks like everyone has a differing opinion on this subject. I do think quite a bit of it is regional. Pate is so dam far away from me, I wouldnt even give it a 2nd glance. Same with chickasha.
I live only 2 hours from Hershey and if I were to attend anywhere, that would be it. But,

everyone is stating the last 5 yrs how much Hershey is diminishing....... so........
I buy every week on ebay and have now for 25 yrs. I find pretty much everything I want at the leisure of sitting at my computer. Better yet, I can do it at 1am in the morning or whenever I feel like. There are so many brick and mortar costs with swaps, that I do believe as a whole, they are dwindling.
and then finally, there is the age out process. None of us are getting any younger.

Ronn, I also have not attended Hershey in the past 7-8 years because I feel it is too much real estate to effectively cover, the overhead (lodging, food, etc.) costs are expensive, ...and for each out-of-state vendor, Pennsylvania collects sales tax on all their sales. This has caused many vendors to leave their parts at home and just use their spaces to park their modern vehicle so they can go walking around. For me, that means there is too much time wasted walking past all of the modern cars to get to the next vendor with parts for sale.

Again, these smaller one-day or two-day meets have become very popular because they are held in more rural areas where the overhead costs are much lower than the larger meets. And to your point about us aging out or getting older, these smaller meets are much better suited to our aging bodies.

[ronn]

totally agree Brent


headed to Woodstown this Sunday. A very small 1 day meet. Went last yr and had a blast. about 30 minutes away and maybe 150 vendors.


dont think there were 20 cars in the corral, but you cant have everything. It was a fun day out and I did buy a few things.

[Hitman]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

So what are you calling "Gems" -and what items are you looking for specifically at these larger meets?

The gems are the parts I need for my various projects that are nearly impossible to find locally. Other than A parts, I look for early V8 parts, and things for other makes and models of cars I have.

The smaller meets tend to focus on a limited number of makes or models. The bigger meets tend to have good deals when you find a VW or Porsche part among the Camaro and Mustang stuff.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by Hitman

The gems are the parts I need for my various projects that are nearly impossible to find locally. Other than A parts, I look for early V8 parts, and things for other makes and models of cars I have.

The smaller meets tend to focus on a limited number of makes or models. The bigger meets tend to have good deals when you find a VW or Porsche part among the Camaro and Mustang stuff.

I understand now why you prefer larger, and more diversified meets such as Pate. With that said, you must also realize that you are in a very small minority in that you are looking for parts for multiple marques. Most hobbyists today are only collecting parts for one or maybe two vehicles, -and even with multiple vehicles they typically are of the same brand (-i.e.: two Model-As or a Model-A & a Model-T) where the smaller shows have been found to be more favorable for both Buyers & Sellers.

Not sure if you are already doing this but if I were in your shoes, I would compile a list of ppl at Pate that you meet who are selling parts for vehicles like you own. Later on, you can contact them and ask if they have that item. Even if they have what you are needing, they likely know someone who they can refer you to.

[Hitman]

Originally Posted by BRENT in 10-uh-C

Not sure if you are already doing this but if I were in your shoes, I would compile a list of ppl at Pate that you meet who are selling parts for vehicles like you own. Later on, you can contact them and ask if they have that item. Even if they have what you are needing, they likely know someone who they can refer you to.

That's exactly what I do, and it's worked out well for me both ways. They find what I need, and I've helped them find what they need.

[WRA]

Unfortunately it became a self fulfilling prophecy. Last year there was some very strong criticism on FB and MTFCA Forum. This bad press grew over time and discouraged a lot of people.

The criticism last year and the resulting changes were the final straw. They should of never broke tradition and eliminated the Thursday evening set up. With this also went the RV & Overnight camping. Thursday was more about fellowship and tradition. Somehow it got twisted into an unfair advantage for certain people.

The Friday set up didn’t work out very well with a number of vendors still covered or setting up after 11 am. There were also a number of customers who made it on the fairgrounds during set up. Saturday was a ghost town with majority of the vendor leaving Friday afternoon. In the end the changes only hurt the meet.

I go every year and it’s never as bad as people said it was. I do well as a customer and a vendor. Yes, vendor turnout was low, but I still did great and managed to find a few items I need.

I’m very glad I was able to enjoy it while it lasted.

[BRENT in 10-uh-C]

Originally Posted by WRA

Unfortunately it became a self fulfilling prophecy. Last year there was some very strong criticism on FB and MTFCA Forum. This bad press grew over time and discouraged a lot of people.

The criticism last year and the resulting changes were the final straw. They should of never broke tradition and eliminated the Thursday evening set up. With this also went the RV & Overnight camping. Thursday was more about fellowship and tradition. Somehow it got twisted into an unfair advantage for certain people.

The Friday set up didn’t work out very well with a number of vendors still covered or setting up after 11 am. There were also a number of customers who made it on the fairgrounds during set up. Saturday was a ghost town with majority of the vendor leaving Friday afternoon. In the end the changes only hurt the meet.

I go every year and it’s never as bad as people said it was. I do well as a customer and a vendor. Yes, vendor turnout was low, but I still did great and managed to find a few items I need.

I’m very glad I was able to enjoy it while it lasted.

Interesting view on this. I personally felt it was as bad as many said. Many of the vendors who attended Chickasha are people who either side-line, -or make their living attending. Their sales, -or their purchases made at the meet are critical to their business. Allow me to explain. When was the last time you saw a tire dealer at this meet? (It has definitely been awhile). Most quit coming because it was unprofitable.

Next, if vendor count is low, -likely so are available cores for rebuilders. A carburetor rebuilder (-or a generator/starter rebuilder, et/al) needs to be able to purchase enough cores to make it worth the overhead costs to attend. The same with sellers of good merchandise. A couple of years ago I brought quite of bit of really nice or NOS parts to sell, and no one wanted to pay 'real world' prices at Chickasha. For example, I had two professionally restored radiator shells priced at $750 ea. that were near show quality and I had some tell me they would buy a repro for less than half that amount. My point is many of the people looking for and bringing top quality merchandise had quit coming ...which means the costs to attend far exceeded the value the meet brought to their sales.

As far as the unfair advantage and changing that, I think there was more to that also, -at least from my perspective and the vendors I have discussed this with. The issue regarding the Thursday set-up was attendance was down however the Erslands still had to pay for the extra day (Thursday) of fairgrounds rentals and insurance. If more vendors had attended, it probably gave them the extra revenue to help offset this. As far as the pre-setup sales, this has been going on here and other meets such as Hershey & Carlisle too. To me, it likely was the people who were unwilling to come early that were complaining about this. Like you, I have no regrets and it was enjoyable creating good memories for many years.

[alexiskai]

Originally Posted by Seth Swoboda

I agree that the swap meets are dwindling away. However, the economy is in pretty rough shape also. I work at a bank and there are not many people spending money on much of anything.

Originally Posted by Fullraceflathead

The economy is very bad very few people have money to spend you're very fortunate if you have money to spend this year.

If you work at a bank and you're not seeing people taking out loans like they used to, that's downstream of higher interest rates – which were instituted to put the brakes on an economy that was running too hot. Loans and other credit activity boost the money supply, and in a hot economy that causes inflation. So the lack of loan activity is intentional and good, from an economic stability perspective.

I think the Model A hobby could well be experiencing an economic slump even while the broader economy is doing fine, because the hobby consists mostly of retirees, whose income streams are typically less responsive to inflation than the wages of those still in the labor force. So even though real wages are trending up (particularly for young, low-income workers), the buying power of the specific people in this hobby is going down.

There's also likely something of a hangover effect from all the stimulus money that was spent in the hobby in 2020-22. If you were paying attention then, you remember a rapid run-up in market prices for cars. Now that bubble has popped and demand is returning to normal, or even below normal (because the cars are a durable good).