Early 28 roadster on ebay

[Mike Peters]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1928-Ford-Mo...m=311783740874

Early Canadian. I keep looking at the paint, and I don't think it's Niagara Blue light, so what is it? Looks original. Very interesting car.

[Tom Wesenberg]

That a nice original Roadster. Sure hope the buyer keeps it that way.

I saw a nice original 29 Phaeton at my first National meet, and I'd have bought it for 12K, except I'd just bought my 28 Phaeton 6 months earlier. Anyway someone restored that nice original Phaeton and took away a lot of value IMHO.

I wonder what the extra hole in the firewall was for?

[René W]

Nice car.
18000 miles.........are canadian cars from 1928 not doing kilometers?
The seat looks as it has done many more miles.........just my thoughts.

[TerryH]

That is an amazing car, with apparently very low original miles.....reminds me of Dave Lopes original Model A.

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by René W

Nice car.
18000 miles.........are canadian cars from 1928 not doing kilometers?
The seat looks as it has done many more miles.........just my thoughts.

I was thinking the same thing about the top edge of the passenger door. It must have always carried a passenger and the passenger always rested his arm on the door top.

[René W]

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And a worn out patch on the drivers side running board,also the spare tire cover is"interesting".
IMHO there are some places on the car that showes lots of "patina"while other parts like the engine look new.

[JDupuis]

All Canadian car milages were measured in "miles" until 1976. By the start 1977, we had just switched to the metric system as most of global world was also metric. Although metric is a more accurate form of measurement, many of us boomers still mentally convert our klm's to miles. Especially our fuel economy: I want to know the miles per gallon (mpg) rather than the litres per 100/kilometers. Hope this aids in clarification of Canadian Cars.
Jeff

[2manycars]

That is beautiful. I hope it does not get restored or hot rodded into a rat rod. The spare tire looks original. The body number is W232, which I presume is Windsor Ontario.

[JDupuis]

I like the picture of the seat back. The wear mark above above the driver's butt, looks like the "comb rub" when most guys used to Keep a comb in their back pocket. That was me; once upon a time. Jeff

[jm29henry]

Wondering where the reserve is at?

[3.6rs]

Originally Posted by René W

Nice car.
18000 miles.........The seat looks as it has done many more miles.........just my thoughts.

It's not by looking at the condition of a 90 years old seat that you can tell the real mileage of a car.

[Mike Peters]

The revised Judging Standards of 2016 has a special Canadian section which sheds much light on this particular early roadster. According to the JS, Canadian cars included a colour called 'Evergreen' for both open and closed passenger models. I don't have a chip for evergreen, but I'm thinking pine needles, or a deep green. JS also mentions that the windshield, stanchions and belt rail were painted black on roadsters, which is the case for this car. Also, on some roadsters, the body and belt moldings were painted just one colour, which appears to be the case here.
JS states that the Canadian open car tops were a 'salt and pepper' canvas which fades to tan with age. That could be the case here. In general, this top looks too good to be original, but what do I know?
The seller is very well informed, and I would agree that this is a wonderfully preserved original early roadster.
Any thoughts out there about the paint? What's 'evergreen'?

[wrndln]

The person driving the car must have ALWAYS had a passenger with him with so much paint worn off the top of the passenger door. It is very hard to believe the car only has 18K miles with the worn paint and seat. The car doesn't seen to have a secondary color, unless it is very close to the primary color, which wouldn't make much sense. I believe early cars were painted just one color, like Dean Drenzek's very early phaeton. Of course the car was manufactured in Canada, which I am not to familiar with. Overall the car looks very original. It will be interesting to see what it sell for.
Rusty Nelson

[Jeff/Illinois]

That IS a nice Roadster. I too hope the new owner keeps it as-is. Amazing for a Roadster to survive in that original condition all these years. I bet it has an interesting history.

It would be neat to see a Ford dealership buy it and put it on the showroom floor.

[al's28/33]

Maybe the Gilmore Museum could use another early original car ??????

[René W]

I have never been in Canada or even near it,but according to what i have seen on postcards and tv it is COLD! overthere with lots of snow most of the year....and freezing,brrrrrrr.
If what i have seen of Canada real it is no wonder a roadster has only 18000 miles on the clock,today i drove the Tudor for 90 miles at -2degrees celcius and my nuts nearly froze off........

[Steve Wastler]

Would be interesting to see this in person, I'm not sold on it being low mile ve28. A lot can change in 80+ years, but has later radiator shell, chrome headlights, looks like bumpers have been rechromed or replaced edges look polished, hub cap scripts?, black intake.

wear on seats, drivers running board mat, door tops, interior firewall toe kick, engine bay firewall don't jive with shiney undercarriage paint. Looks to me made to deceive....

[wrndln]

The car is NOT a very early 1928. There was a link to more pictures in the Q&A section of eBay. A sign in the link below states the car was made mid May 28. There is also more information in the link for those that want to see it. The link is below for anyone that doesn't want to go to eBay.
Rusty Nelson

https://www.slickpic.com/share/NgjD0...es/?wallpaper#

[Steve Plucker]

I take it that the car is now in California?

Pluck

[ronn]

The car is NOT a very early 1928. There was a link to more pictures in the Q&A section of eBay. A sign in the link below states the car was made mid May 28. There is also more information in the link for those that want to see it. The link is below for anyone that doesn't want to go to eBay.
Rusty Nelson

https://www.slickpic.com/share/NgjD0...es/?wallpaper#

well, maybe it should be stated "very early for Canada"...........

[160B]

Here is the photo rotated so it easier to read

[Rancho Deluxe]

Very Interesting, A whole month between Engine build & installing in car.. It does have a lot of Early items on it such as, The correct, First of three intake manifolds & clamps.. The ring that is screwed to the floor around the transmission hole, But yet it does not have the Canadian type of Power House Generator..Notice the Ford Script tag in the wire harness, with the 2nd generation switch..Another thing I did notice was the mount on the gas tank for the choke rod, looks to be the last style made. I guess the radiator shell could be the later one if it was built in June. It also has the later fan shroud on it..

[Tom Wesenberg]

I also notice the lack of the Canadian powerhouse, but wasn't sure if all Canadian Model A's had them, or only a portion of Canadian A's came with that style powerhouse.

[jm29henry]

Thanks Rusty and Ronn

[George Miller]

Originally Posted by JDupuis

All Canadian car milages were measured in "miles" until 1976. By the start 1977, we had just switched to the metric system as most of global world was also metric. Although metric is a more accurate form of measurement, many of us boomers still mentally convert our klm's to miles. Especially our fuel economy: I want to know the miles per gallon (mpg) rather than the litres per 100/kilometers. Hope this aids in clarification of Canadian Cars.
Jeff

When we went on our honeymoon in Canada in 1959, I seem to remember your gallons were 5 quarts instead of 4 like the US. I could not believe how good the gas milage was. In the US we only got 20 miles per gallon with our 1956 Chev Bel air hard top. We were getting like 25 miles per gallon there. Also got my first and last speeding ticket.

[1931 flamingo]

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REMEMBER how old this roadster is. It's possible some changes/updates have been made. As for the wear on the upholstery and door tops, not everyone has/had a garage and many were left to fend in the elements. Mine stays outside April to early November. It's called patina. FWIW JMO
Paul in CT

[mhsprecher]

It probably belongs in a museum. It would be very cool to have a car as original as that one, but it would need a special caretaker. That person is not me.

[JDupuis]

George Miller! Excellent memory. Yes, there is difference between the "imperial" gallon and the "U.S." Gallon. The imperial gallon is larger than the U.S. Gallon. Too bad about your speeding ticket though.. What was the rate of exchange at that time? As our dollar is sinking still to the US greenback. Jeff

[frank55a]

The color appears to be gun metal blue with French gray stripe.

[George Miller]

Originally Posted by JDupuis

George Miller! Excellent memory. Yes, there is difference between the "imperial" gallon and the "U.S." Gallon. The imperial gallon is larger than the U.S. Gallon. Too bad about your speeding ticket though.. What was the rate of exchange at that time? As our dollar is sinking still to the US greenback. Jeff

Exchange rate was low. Not sure but it seems like 2 cents on a dollar.

[HoarseWhisperer]

The current bid of $12,600 US translates into $16,798.32 Canadian.

[clo2jim]

I saw seen this car at the 1996 MAFCA Meet in Toronto, Ontario. Great car from Saskatchewan. The gentleman that owned the car at that time was from California.

I believe that I also saw this car at the MAFCA Meet in Tacoma, WA

I did fine point judging at both meets so had a good close-up look at the car. Very nice original car.

[pookie55]

i like the pic's. nice car

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by pookie55

i like the pic's. nice car

Yep, my favorite kind of car to own, a well preserved original that should be left alone and carefully driven, and preserved as is for the future.

[pooch]

Originally Posted by frank55a

The color appears to be gun metal blue with French gray stripe.

The colour looks green and the pinstripe looks white.

This car looks very much like my old phaeton of Canadiian origin june 28 cowl stamp, that has since been passed on to another member here .

I am sure he will post a pic for comparison.

Also just curious, if this car was identical, but a phaeton, would it fetch more or less or the same ?

[Mike V. Florida]

Originally Posted by jm29henry

Wondering where the reserve is at?

Anyone want to hazard a guess as to what it sells for if it sells?

[pooch]

Not as much as a ratrod V8 flattie half fibreglass cycle fenders 28 roadster I bet.

One just got passed in here at $32.999 AUD.

[Hoogah]

Originally Posted by pooch

The colour looks green and the pinstripe looks white.

This car looks very much like my old phaeton of Canadiian origin june 28 cowl stamp, that has since been passed on to another member here .

I am sure he will post a pic for comparison.

Also just curious, if this car was identical, but a phaeton, would it fetch more or less or the same ?

So here is the car to which Pooch refers. The body is unrestored, but has been oversprayed in some areas where the paintwork was deteriorating. However, the area under the side curtains at the tops of the doors shows what I think is original paint and has more blue than green. I wonder if the lack of sun damage in this area has better preserved it?

I wonder if this car was originally the same colour as the roadster? (Love the roadster!). I'm not sure if the Canadian cars that were assembled in Australia arrived here in their final topcoat of paint, or in undercoat (which would have made more sense to me). If they arrived here undercoated only, then any attempt to compare paint colours is probably pointless.

My car's body was transferred to a '29 chassis and mechanicals before I purchased it, but I'm told that the original chassis included the E28 style hand brake. One (!) front fender is the early style, and it originally had the early style wheels.

[pooch]

Yes, your car was multidisk clutch and right hand E brake with round pedals. and 1/2 inch starter shaft..

[Pinesdune]

Originally Posted by René W

I have never been in Canada or even near it,but according to what i have seen on postcards and tv it is COLD! overthere with lots of snow most of the year....and freezing,brrrrrrr.
If what i have seen of Canada real it is no wonder a roadster has only 18000 miles on the clock,today i drove the Tudor for 90 miles at -2degrees celcius and my nuts nearly froze off........

Haha, yes it can be cold, we just came out of a two week -30/40 spell, the prairie provinces (middle) can have snow from around November 1 to mid April, but that can vary greatly as the last few days have been plus 2-4 (Celsius). Other areas can speak for themselves. It's all a matter of what you're used to, -2 I'm running around in a t-shirt and sneakers after that cold snap haha. And hence the reason Bombardier built the snowmobile, to give us snowbound people a way to get around.
Sorry, not trying to change the topic gents, that is a fantastic model A and should be preserved!


Saving iron from the scrap pile one piece at a time

[JDupuis]

Hey Pinesdune, a friend of mine has an old snowmobile simular to that. It was eguipped with a single cyl engine mated to a Model A transmission. I donated a spare trans to the project. He has over 100 sleds, so you never know when he'll have it restored. Jeff

[Tony Hillyard]

That is almost identical to my May 1928 Standard Roadster. The one I am trying to fit side curtains on to.

Does anyone know if that was the style of seat, large pieces of cloth without lots of rib stitching. I know my car has the wrong recovered seat and I would like to put it back to the original style.

[lindy williams]

This roadster has the US style stamped rear engine mounts. The other Canadian cars I have seen have the cast or forged rear engine mounts.
I wonder when that changed?

[160B]

Originally Posted by lindy williams

This roadster has the US style stamped rear engine mounts. The other Canadian cars I have seen have the cast or forged rear engine mounts.
I wonder when that changed?

from RG&JS page F-3 1997









Maleable cast steel rear engine support used from June 1928 to
the end of production (left); stamped steel rear engine support
used from beginning of production to June 1928 and late 1931
(right)

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by Tony Hillyard

That is almost identical to my May 1928 Standard Roadster. The one I am trying to fit side curtains on to.

Does anyone know if that was the style of seat, large pieces of cloth without lots of rib stitching. I know my car has the wrong recovered seat and I would like to put it back to the original style.

Yes, it has the correct seat covers.

[Tony Hillyard]

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Thank you Tom.

[Jim Mason]

Went for less than I expected

[HoarseWhisperer]

US $38,500.00
Approximately $50,392.67 Canadian

[DougVieyra]

$38,500 US Dollars - went for a lot more than i expected.

[CarlG]

Wonder how long before it is re-listed 'cause the winning bidder couldn't come up with the cash? (happens there all the time)

[pooch]

If this was a phaeton in same condition, same colour , would it have sold for more or less than this roadster?

[DJ S]

That's an interesting question, I'm going to guess about the same as any open car to have survived this long in that condition is incredible.

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by DougVieyra

$38,500 US Dollars - went for a lot more than i expected.

X2 and I think a similar Phaeton would be about the same price.

Years ago at the Madison national meet there was a very nice original Coupe for sale in the 30K range. I wonder if it ever sold?

[Jeff/Illinois]

Just curious. What would that Roadster have sold for had it been restored, and not an original condition car?

$38,500 US seems pretty strong for a '28-'29 Roadster. I was thinking low 20's for this car.

The '30-'31's go for more than the '28-'29's.

[barry022]

It appears the winning bidder offered $18,500 over the previous bid just to be sure he would end up as the next owner.

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by Jeff/Illinois

Just curious. What would that Roadster have sold for had it been restored, and not an original condition car?

$38,500 US seems pretty strong for a '28-'29 Roadster. I was thinking low 20's for this car.

The '30-'31's go for more than the '28-'29's.

Yes, I was going to bring up the same thing. This is a good example of why a good original car should be left original. Far too many good cars have been restored at a great expense, only to see the actual value dip in many cases.

[ronn]

so when the car jumped from 20k to 38k, it was the same bidder.............

so who knows if it really sold................

obviously the owner wouldnt let it go for less then 38k.

[pooch]

If you check out the automatic bids, I reckon the last genuine bid was $12000.

The other two in the sham bidding war were schill bidders.

[Bob C]

Originally Posted by ronn

so when the car jumped from 20k to 38k, it was the same bidder.............

so who knows if it really sold................

obviously the owner wouldnt let it go for less then 38k.

My guess is that $38,500.00 was the reserve. If the winning bidder bid
$40,000.00 it would only show $38,500.00 that's why the big jump from
$20,000.00.

Bob

[ronn]

true Bob

but how many people say- think I'll bid 20k for that car, then turn around and say- alright now Im going
40k

lil fishy to me. I could see 5k increments........... to win it.

[Jeff/Illinois]

Originally Posted by ronn

true Bob

but how many people say- think I'll bid 20k for that car, then turn around and say- alright now Im going
40k

lil fishy to me. I could see 5k increments........... to win it.

I quite agree was thinking the same thing..... a scam in the works

Never been to an auction where somebody throws out 'double the bid' to win an item. $5,000 would have been MORE than enough.

I think we haven't seen the last of this Model A.

[Jim Mason]

Car probably had a 38k minimum

Bid 1 5k max reserve not met
Bid 2 10k reserve not met
Bid 3 12.5k reserve not met
Bid 4 40k max auto bid to reserve, bid shown 38k winner
Any bid less than reserve would not have won

[41plym]

Maybe I'm wrong, but It seems like someone else would have to bid him up to that price.

[briphaeton]

I had dealing with the same seller 10 years ago. After telling him I had 1928 cars. I pointed out several things that were not correct and he took offence. We could not agree on a lower price. He buys and sells mostly vintage trucks and I wouldn't be surprise if he drove the price up.

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by 41plym

Maybe I'm wrong, but It seems like someone else would have to bid him up to that price.

Yes, I was thinking the same thing. I might be wrong, but even if the guy's max bid is over the reserve, I'm sure another bidder needs to bid against him.

[Bob C]

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Originally Posted by 41plym

Maybe I'm wrong, but It seems like someone else would have to bid him up to that price.

Not if there is a reserve. You can just keep upping your bid till you
hit the reserve.

Bob

[mshmodela]

Nice roadster but for me there is but one roadster I' d want

[Jim Mason]

Everybody is bidding against the reserve, until the reserve is met.

Reserve 38k.
Bid max 12k. reserve not met
Bid 2 max bid 39k. bid shown 38k reserve met
Bid 3 max bid 38.5k bid 38.5k auto bid goes to 39k (2nd bidders max)
Rebid by 3 max 41k bid shown 39k plus increment on 39k (increment probably 500) so 39.5k

[WTSHNN]

It is also possible the seller lowered the reserve at some point after the winning bid was made which could indicate such a large gap between the last two bidders.

-Tim

[pooch]

Originally Posted by Bob C

Not if there is a reserve. You can just keep upping your bid till you
hit the reserve.

Bob

Yep, that sounds the most plausible so far .

Although to do that thru ebay would have been very lucky to fluke the reserve at just 6 seconds to go.

The winner in the end was the highest bidder at the $20000 mark.

Then he threw a high bid in either exactly at $38500 or higher.

His bid won at 6 seconds to go, so it was probably a high bid thru a sniper program.

I don;t know how a sniper program could detect a reserve , maybe they can.

I doubt if it was the seller himself or a pal as this would be dumb to bid at the exact reserve himself , then he would have to either make a bad seller claim or pay the fees to ebay himself for a no sale.

If the reserve was $38500, a smart seller would have $38400 bid for himself on a snipe with enough time to allow another snipe to win..

[Arcieri]

Looks like the seller lowered the reserve before the deadline to do so.

If the high bidder is who I think he is there won't be much of a problem with the financial part of this deal.

I was very tempted to bid on this car, but if I was the high bidder my wife of 46+ years would have had what my grandparents used to refer to as a "hissy fit".

I am very fortunate to already own three white ribbon 1st place National Show "A's" and maybe that should be enough. (That's what I tell my wife anyway.)

Ray

[dean from bozeman]

With the bidding process, I learned along the way. If I went up increments then the bidding could get into a p*ssing match. The best way for me to bid was to decide what I was willing to pay and then create a snipe with that amount. If my bid was the highest and higher than the reserve, I won. If not, then I was happy not to pay too much.

It looks like the winning bidder said something like, 'I'd be willing to go $40k'. He snipes that (remember the earlier snipe if there is a tie wins) $40K and the reserve is $38,500. He wins.

Don't know if the seller lowered his reserve but if he did, it was a good choice because his car is now sold.

Personally, from what I know about prices for original cars, that $38,500 is on the high side of reasonable. I understand that many Model Aers would not even consider paying half of that, but as they say, 'They don't make original cars anymore'. Original cars are very special. If given the opportunity to drive an original car you will find out that they handle in a way that restored Model A's only approach, but don't quite duplicate.

[pooch]

A shiny coat of paint don't make it go any better.

[Jim Mason]

I place my max bid early, and let the auto bid 'snipe'. most of the time I have been sucked into paying more than I wanted for a part I really needed

[pooch]

Ebay high bid is not snipe.

[Bob C]

Originally Posted by pooch

Ebay high bid is not snipe.

Why do you say this, it came in 6 seconds before the auction end.

Bob

[Tom Wesenberg]

I always snipe my max bid with 6 seconds to go. It my best hope of getting what I want. If I loose, then it went for more than I wanted to pay, and I wait for another one to show up.

[pooch]

Originally Posted by Bob C

Why do you say this, it came in 6 seconds before the auction end.

Bob

It could have been a snipe in its own right,and it could also be an ebay high bid, but they are two completely different things.

If you put a high bid in Ebay, your bid is shown immediately, and if it is still above anyone else who bids, they are overbid by yours automaticlally.

Everyone can see you bidding from the time you placed your high bid.

This particular sale was a strange one where the final winner had a very high offer over his own high bid waiting in the background .

Personally I would have let the auction run and be the highest bidder reserve not met and then have negotiation advantage with the seller.

But it seems the winner wanted this car at any cost, who knows he may have had $100K as a bid .........

Sniping is using a third party program with your high bid totolly anonymous until,seconds before the end, and of course it only shows if you are in fact the highest bidder and won..


I have no experience on what may have happenend here....

The final winner may have had a bid that was exact to or over the reserve and it was an ebay automatic bid , but it was not what is called a snipe.

The only thing I can think of, it was a third party snipe and the program can detect a reserve.

[matt_field]

The car is in Minnesota now. 200 miles from where it was built. Absolutely love the car!

[JDupuis]

Congratulations on the "new" car. Jeff

[motordr]

Congrats!! They don't make originals anymore!

[Bick in New Zealand]

Well done, fabulous car!

[Jeff/Illinois]

Originally Posted by matt_field

The car is in Minnesota now. 200 miles from where it was built. Absolutely love the car!

Nice, and nice that it went to a good home. Our '28 Roadster was a Sept. 17, 1928 build out of the Twin Cities Plant had a body code of TC528 if I recall. Originally had a black top, yours was probably built before June '28 that is when they were using the tan top. Another indication of an 'early' car. It's amazing that Roadsters would be built in and for one of the coldest environs in the U.S.

Cost I suppose

What is your body code? You'll see it stamped on the floor sill about where your left foot rests in front of the seat riser.