Model A era tool?

[MrTube]

Hey guys, long time no visit but it's finally time to start working on the "A" again!

I'm hoping someone can tell me what this is other than the obvious (a drill press), and if it's from the "A" era or not. I suspect it may be but am not sure.

I have a chance to pick it up but wanted opinions first. Even if it's not from the "A" era, is it still worth taking?


Looks like the motor is crooked, but it also appears that can be easily fixed by loosening some bolts. Next question would be do these things come apart easily?

[Ray in La Mesa]

Looks like from the forties. Should be easy to disassemble and detail, including aligning the motor. I have an old Sears-Dunlap model from 1942 and they last forever.

[MrTube]

Originally Posted by Ray in La Mesa

Looks like from the forties. Should be easy to disassemble and detail, including aligning the motor. I have an old Sears-Dunlap model from 1942 and they last forever.

Hi Ray, thanks for responding.
This may be a dumb question, but what's with the shaft sticking out of the top of the front? I can't find a single picture on the net of anything like that.

[Farrell In Vancouver]

I have one too but the top belt shield is still in place. Yours may be missing?
Mine has also been extended in the main stand to add about 36" so it's at chest height from the floor. I replaced the burnt motor with one from a furnace fan and its been great for abot 15 years.

[Joe K]

This is pretty obvious. The canted motor is not "correct" - but it will work. This because of the stretch of the v-belts connecting it to the quill.

Were it mine I would straighten and align the motor - and be sure of tensioning.

If you're at the end of tension adjustment, it may be a simple trip to Autozone to get a belt that is 1/2" shorter.

You should join us at http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb...inery-history/ Your Delta (likely) DP would be welcome I'm sure.

Edit: the extra shafting may be to allow extra travel of the quill to reach things "lower?" Well, your table can be a LONG way down on a floor stand DP. Check with your "down drill" lever to see the limit of travel. I bet it hits the end of the rack & pinion before you run out of shaft.

Joe K

[MrTube]

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Wow, thank you for all of the responses!

Sounds like everyone feels I should take it even though it's newer than the "A".

I don't believe the guard is missing, but rather never existed judging by this advertisement, though it's not identical it certainly looks a lot like them.

Let me know if this link doesn't work.
http://dorsetfinds.files.wordpress.c...-ad-1944-2.jpg

[Tom Wesenberg]

It looks pretty much the same as my Delta Rockwell drill press.
Mine has a Montgomery Ward label on it.

[C26Pinelake]

You never mentioned how much it will cost to pick it up. That to me would definitely be a deciding factor. I'd say it better be cheap !
Wayne

[MrTube]

Originally Posted by C26Pinelake

You never mentioned how much it will cost to pick it up. That to me would definitely be a deciding factor. I'd say it better be cheap !
Wayne

Exactly $0.00
Only takes effort as well as having to get it down my basement winder stairs.

[billwill]

Cant bet the price good luck

[Tom Wesenberg]

It should be an easy knockdown to post, base, table, head, and motor.
That will make it easy to carry down the stairs.

[Joe K]

Just be careful moving it around pre-knockdown. You know how you might do it. Similar to moving a full size acetylene or oxygen tank by "rolling it along" on it's base.

The problem with the drill press is the "cantilever" of the upper works on that L shaped base. These are wont to crack where the post mounts to the base. If you pick it up with a two wheeler - try to get it on the "backside" rather than along the front. (yuh, I know, that square table looks like it would fit VERY nicely against a two wheeler - resist the temptation and do it from the backside.)

Joe K

[MrTube]

Originally Posted by Joe K

This is pretty obvious. The canted motor is not "correct" - but it will work. This because of the stretch of the v-belts connecting it to the quill.

Were it mine I would straighten and align the motor - and be sure of tensioning.

If you're at the end of tension adjustment, it may be a simple trip to Autozone to get a belt that is 1/2" shorter.

You should join us at http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb...inery-history/ Your Delta (likely) DP would be welcome I'm sure.

Edit: the extra shafting may be to allow extra travel of the quill to reach things "lower?" Well, your table can be a LONG way down on a floor stand DP. Check with your "down drill" lever to see the limit of travel. I bet it hits the end of the rack & pinion before you run out of shaft.

Joe K

I think I finally realized what you meant by "canted motor". It looks like the motor is hanging on a homemade hinge? I thought it seemed nifty that you could pick the back of the motor up to change the belt setting but now looking at it the motor is only hanging on two bolts.

I have to assume that isn't original by any means, but why was it done? Just as a cheat to make changing the speed easier? If that is what you were talking about the fact you could tell that from those horrible pictures suggests it was, or is a common thing?

I need to get a closer look at the press tonight, I have a feeling it's not a Delta because not a single Delta I can find has the spindle cover on the top. Maybe a Walker Turner?

[TonyM]

I used to repair Drill Presses like that when I worked for OK Champion Corporation in Hammond, Indiana. I would love to have one.

[TBone69]

Originally Posted by MrTube

Exactly $0.00
Only takes effort as well as having to get it down my basement winder stairs.

For that price my thread would have started out, check out this cool old drill press I got for free. No need to ask

Also check out garagejournal.com for lots of great information. Basically it's the FordBarn for tools.

Great find by they way!

[Joe K]

Originally Posted by MrTube

I think I finally realized what you meant by "canted motor". It looks like the motor is hanging on a homemade hinge? I thought it seemed nifty that you could pick the back of the motor up to change the belt setting but now looking at it the motor is only hanging on two bolts.

I have to assume that isn't original by any means, but why was it done? Just as a cheat to make changing the speed easier? If that is what you were talking about the fact you could tell that from those horrible pictures suggests it was, or is a common thing?

I need to get a closer look at the press tonight, I have a feeling it's not a Delta because not a single Delta I can find has the spindle cover on the top. Maybe a Walker Turner?

The hinge you speak of MAY be original - and is the means to tension the belt.

The side to side tilt of the motor in it's mounting slots is the "cant" I referred to. This I would straighten.

V-belts were such an advantage when they were first developed. Tensioning by using a tilting motor took advantage of the fact that v-belts "self track." But if it seems to be REALLY tilted out of alignment, then perhaps a smaller belt may be to your advantage? Best would be when both shafts are parallel when the belt seems as tight as you need it.

I have a Chinese drill press with perhaps 6 inches between the column and quill. As in SMALL. But it has a tilting motor aspect - with a little plunger and thumbscrew to hold everything "tight." More than once I have adjusted the tightness when a drill appears to not turn. This by putting a crowbar between the motor mount and the main casting while the plunger is loose. And then quickly tightened before removal of the crowbar. So this is proof that belts do stretch I suppose. Still on the original belt though - but approaching it's limit (now 20 years later.)

Good luck with this.

Yunno. As you may have seen over at Practical Machinist - collecting old tools is addictive. It's call the 'old iron disease.'

There is not cure.

Joe K

[MrTube]

Originally Posted by Joe K

The hinge you speak of MAY be original - and is the means to tension the belt.

The side to side tilt of the motor in it's mounting slots is the "cant" I referred to. This I would straighten.

V-belts were such an advantage when they were first developed. Tensioning by using a tilting motor took advantage of the fact that v-belts "self track." But if it seems to be REALLY tilted out of alignment, then perhaps a smaller belt may be to your advantage? Best would be when both shafts are parallel when the belt seems as tight as you need it.

I have a Chinese drill press with perhaps 6 inches between the column and quill. As in SMALL. But it has a tilting motor aspect - with a little plunger and thumbscrew to hold everything "tight." More than once I have adjusted the tightness when a drill appears to not turn. This by putting a crowbar between the motor mount and the main casting while the plunger is loose. And then quickly tightened before removal of the crowbar. So this is proof that belts do stretch I suppose. Still on the original belt though - but approaching it's limit (now 20 years later.)

Good luck with this.

Yunno. As you may have seen over at Practical Machinist - collecting old tools is addictive. It's call the 'old iron disease.'

There is not cure.

Joe K

Ah.
I'm sure the motor can be straightened. I believe when I glanced at it the holes in the mount were slotted. I was only able to glance at the Practical Machinist but I plan on signing up either tonight or tomorrow, thanks for recommending it.

[James Rogers]

The shaft sticking out of the top front is the spindle drive shaft. It has a keyway in it that corresponds to a key on the step pulley.

[MrTube]

It appears to be a "Royal" and has the same kind of mount setup as this one. The motor bracket swivels! I guess just turning it on would've straightened the motor.

http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/g...eer/press1.jpg

Best I can tell its a 16" or 18" as I measured just under 9" from the center of the chuck to the edge of the column. Spinning the motor by hand with the belt released the bearings sounded a hair noisy but smooth and no play so they might just want to be repacked.

[bikejunk]

we run about 4 drill preses in our shop at the bronx zoo just about like yours ,and it will last about 4ever free is a good price

[MrTube]

Two more pictures.
The hinged motor bracket is original, it appears Canedy-Otto bragged about this feature. It may also be a 1930s model.

What I don't know is what kind of fitting is this on the front? I've seen pictures of similar machines online and they had a standard grease fitting there.

[C26Pinelake]

Unanimous ! Free is a very good price!
Wayne

[Rowdy]

Free is a GREAT price. Hoist it over your shoulder and pack it up the stairs. When I worked for Tenneco we had several of those. They seem to never wear out and are easy to repair if ever needed. I replaced the spindle bearings on one and it was as good as new again. Rod

[Big John]

it would be to your advantage to make proper guard over those belt pulleys... just a big precaution to not accidently get a finger caught in there or a piece of clothing, gloves etc ... it will not be forgiving....

[MrTube]

Originally Posted by Big John

it would be to your advantage to make proper guard over those belt pulleys... just a big precaution to not accidently get a finger caught in there or a piece of clothing, gloves etc ... it will not be forgiving....

Hi John, thanks for responding.
This had crossed my mind but in the end would it be any less forgiving than the chuck or tool in the chuck?

Or is it just best to follow a "the less exposed fast moving parts the better" rule.

[Bob C]

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Originally Posted by MrTube

Two more pictures.
The hinged motor bracket is original, it appears Canedy-Otto bragged about this feature. It may also be a 1930s model.

What I don't know is what kind of fitting is this on the front? I've seen pictures of similar machines online and they had a standard grease fitting there.

You just lift the little cap on the fitting and add oil.

Bob

[Tom Wesenberg]

I have the identical setup for the belt and I would find a belt guard a nuisanse. I can't imagine how you would ever get any clothing or body part in the belt. The power would be off, then just lift the motor and shift the belt to change speed.

[MrTube]

Finally got it home and down the basement.
From what I understand it's a 1930s Canedy-Otto #16. It's probably a little on the new side to be "A" era, but close enough I think.

I need to modify the motor to raise it up some as I don't like the belt alignment. Also, whoever did it used the bottom half of the motor to mount the newer switch so the motor is actually only held on by two bolts currently. If I drill new upper and lower holes, or oval out the top ones vertically I should be able to achieve this easily. I just need to figure out new mounting for the switch but I'm not too worried, I'm sure I'll come up with something.

Press runs good, my only concern is there is a tiny bit of slop in the quill if you extend it almost all of the way down and try to move it side to side.

Still waiting for www.practicalmachinist.com to approve my new account.

[MrTube]

Two videos I took of the press running tonight after I remounted the motor.

http://youtu.be/G6VMf_ncxCk

http://youtu.be/nrtkE2kwxiI

The noise heard in the second video appears to be the spline chattering in the front pulley and isn't as noticeable in person. It does change as you lower and raise the quill though. The machine actually runs incredibly smooth. Seems like it could run all day and night without a care in the world.

I did notice if I put the belt tension too tight the motor bracket chatters as well, so I assumed that simply meant too tight. It does look like the hinged bracket originally had some kind of bolt in the bottom or something that is long gone. Perhaps a knob to lock it in place when not changing belts? The belt had been sitting in one position for I have no idea how long, but it had quite a bit of memory when I tried to spin the machine by hand. Not sure if that's working out automatically or not. The belt could be 40-50 yrs old for all I know. No visible cracks.


Question for others that own this type of press. Should I put any kind of lube on the spline where it goes through the pulley?

[bikejunk]

those came with a sheet metal belt guard that im guessing got tossed aside the first time it got taken off. You can oil the quill and the turning parts but not too much as it atracts dirt. yes the chatter could be from the belt being too tight

[MrTube]

Originally Posted by bikejunk

those came with a sheet metal belt guard that im guessing got tossed aside the first time it got taken off. You can oil the quill and the turning parts but not too much as it atracts dirt. yes the chatter could be from the belt being too tight

Hi bikejunk, thanks for responding!

Not a single advertisement I've seen for Canedy-Otto or Walker-Turner which is very similar showed any kind of belt guard.