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Old 07-19-2020, 08:45 PM   #1
Bud
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Default Model A Estate Plans

I am wondering how those of you who have collected parts and memorabilia for many years have made plans for the dispersal and preservation of your collection(s). I would like to plan ahead and not make it a burden for my kids, plus I would like to make sure some things are preserved and not junked.
Please avoid replies like "I plan to live forever; It's my wife's/children's problem so I don't care; or once I am dead they can do what they want". That is not helpful. I know one can simply have an auction, but I know things get split up, stolen, or the value can be manipulated. I am interested in the advice of those who have a plan. Thanks.
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Old 07-19-2020, 09:29 PM   #2
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

I tend to tag certain items with a description of what it is and sometimes it's value. This way if it is still around when I'm gone folks will know what it is and hopefully keep it from going to waste.
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Old 07-19-2020, 09:55 PM   #3
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

I intend talking with the kids to see who wants what. Once I know that, those items are tagged or mentioned specifically in my will and everything else goes (they end up with the money eventually). I figure if I were to decide who gets what, much of the stuff will end up at a trash and treasure sale.
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Old 07-19-2020, 11:35 PM   #4
Brad in Germany
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

You should write what is called a "Personal Property Memorandum" (PPM) (sometimes called a "Tangible Personal Property Claus") which outlines your desires how or to whom you would like your tangible personal property disposed. For the PPM to be valid you must refer to it in your will. Also check with your state for specific requirements for such a memorandum (Click here to check your states requirements). You can then use the PPM to tell exactly who gets what of your tangible property (does not include money, investments, a house, property and most anything that would have a title).

For example, your PPM can include guidance on how to sell your oilcan collection through Auction House XXXXX and gift your NOS Model A parts to MAFFI and give the KRW Tools to your cousin Bob, and gift your toy trains to your son Jake, and sell your Snap-on tools for $12,000 to Billy Smith if he is still interested in the tools, if not, then sell them through Auction House XXXXXX, etc, etc.... You can also provide guidance on who to go to get an appraisal (assuming they are still alive and in business at that time); i.e. Joe Smithy from the Model A club can help you find a buyer for the Coupe, but do not sell to Kirby Marks (not a trusted person), etc, etc....

As for your vehicles (including your Model A's), you should file a "Beneficiary Designation for Vehicle Title" (or something similar, whatever your state calls it) (everyone in the US should have one of these, even if you do not plan on dying any time soon!). That will automatically transfer the ownership title of your vehicle to whomever you designate, when you pass away (Transfer on Death - TOD). That also keeps your vehicles ownership out of the often lengthy probate process and your heirs can then register your former car in their name as soon as they have a copy of your death certificate. The Maryland "Beneficiary Designation for Vehicle Title" (VR-471) can even be filed online and only costs a nominal fee payable by credit card. It looks like you are from Ohio, so the Ohio vehicle Transfer on Death Beneficiary Designation (form BMV 3811) is similar to Maryland's - here is the link to the Ohio Vehicle Title TOD procedure: https://www.bmv.ohio.gov/titles-transfer-death.aspx#gsc.tab=0

....and of course, if you do not think anyone will be interested in your tangible property, you can always just sell it or dispose of it yourself before you pass away (though usually difficult to make the decision as to when). That way you will be able to rest in peace knowing where your items went and who you made happy, etc.......then just put the cash in your bank account (or investment) or gift the proceeds directly to your heirs (if you are maybe trying to reduce the value of your estate prior to your demise). For example you could sell your Model A and tell the buyer to make the payment out to your sons XXXX or have them (or you) deposit the money equally in a 529 Plan for each one of your kids (or grand kids) and then they (or you) can take the tax deduction on their (or your) state taxes. That way you can make the gift with a warm hand instead of with a cold hand!

This is just some unqualified advice from a guy who plans to rest in peace when his time comes. Hope that gives you some ideas.

Brad in Maryland

Last edited by Brad in Germany; 07-20-2020 at 12:19 AM.
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Old 07-20-2020, 03:39 AM   #5
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

What I’m seeing is that what we now perceive the values to be is waning greatly.
Also the market (interested parties) is shrinking. If you have an abundance of “stuff” you should consider thinning the herd for your heirs. Hoarding unneeded stuff has many bad features. Included is the fact someone may now need what u are hoarding.
If you have club buddies or hobby friends, talk about how to pass stuff on locally. Possibly pre-arrange an auction yourself.
Unless your heirs have an interest, your hobby will become their burden
Brad gives several good points. Leaving your car(s) to charity to auction is a plausible idea!
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Old 07-20-2020, 06:39 AM   #6
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i just purchased a larger estate of parts. The way it worked was two friends made a clause in their wills that all car parts would be disposed of by the surviving friend. The friend ended up being a kind of go between between the estate and myself. To some degree it help make the transaction a bit smoother because the emotional attachment was removed a bit. One thing to think about though is prices on original parts don't seem to be bringing in the $$ like they used to though. It is starting to take a lot of work to move these parts and even then a lot end up at the scrap yard. Let's face it does one really need 30 used exhaust manifolds, or 20 hub and drum assemblies....?
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Old 07-20-2020, 07:20 AM   #7
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

"Not wanting to be a burden to your kids", wife, attorney, or fellow car buddies to dispose of your garage 'assets', MAYBE it's time you do it.

One of my cars I bought from a gentleman who was 86 and believed it would be easier for his daughter to inherit a bank account than a garage full of cars. I've admired that fellow's sense of responsibility.

I've also accepted the task of disposing two car collections after the owners passed suddenly. A lot of work sorting the piles of debris to sell, only made more complicated by attempting to manage the expectations of the heirs.

No one else knows the value of your collection better than you, certainly not your heirs. The difference in price between what you paid and sell for is your life's enrichment while you owned & enjoyed your collecting. There will be comfort in your knowing you directed selling your collection to those who will appreciate and not total strangers.
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Old 07-20-2020, 07:25 AM   #8
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

I have spent the last three or four years selling off any thing I felt was not needed to keep our last car going.

Some of what I have been able to sell on e-bay, I didnít think had any value left. Someone out there saw value.

Planning is the answer. You are asking a great question.

Also think about what will become of your car or cars. Would you be better off selling a car earlier and saving your family that issue?

Enjoy.
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Old 07-20-2020, 07:39 AM   #9
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

I will sell much off, but in the end- I dont care. I wont be here.........
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Old 07-20-2020, 08:42 AM   #10
BRENT in 10-uh-C
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

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Originally Posted by ronn View Post
I will sell much off, but in the end- I dont care. I wont be here.........

Yeah, at first they are mourning for you, -then they will be moaning at you when they must dispose of it. For many widowers, their spouse's Model-A junk won't even bring enough in scrap price to even cover the labor to dispose of it all. As Jeff says, do you really need that many exhaust manifolds??
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Old 07-20-2020, 09:02 AM   #11
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

Good question and I think Brad hit spot on. Great Advice. My neighbors husband died unexpectedly and had a large garage FULL of parts. He had one car mostly complete, hot rod. She THOUGHT there was a title but not sure where, had another that was just a rolling shell (of a fairly desirable car), again not sure about the title. A dozen or more motors, and more small parts and tools than you could shake a stick at. I was trying to help out as much as possible. In the end she had an auction house load up everything, and sold the 2 cars. A lot of the stuff was valuable to the right guy, but in the end I doubt most ended up there.
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Old 07-20-2020, 09:14 AM   #12
Dave in MN
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

My wife has long been suggesting I get rid of my stuff (parts) so my two sons won't have to deal with the issue. I have been putting her off as I don't want to get rid of anything as I have plans to build a couple yet when I retire.

I recently came up with a solution. I set aside a sufficient amount of money in my retirement funds ear-marked as "Dave's clean-up fund". My "Will" states that the pile of parts is to be offered to my Local Club members first and what remains after they pick through it is to be disposed of using these funds. There are people that make a business of cleaning out storage areas...these people would do so with the parts. With this plan in place, my parts and future projects are safe. As far as the cars go, I told my sons they can each have one car they want out of the collection to keep or sell. They both have no interest in the hobby so I expect the cars will be sold. I also have lots of shop equipment. My direct is to hire an auction company and have at it with money going to family, wife first or 50/50 if to sons.
I'm going to drive and work on my cars as long as I am able. Then I am going to ask a son or interested nephew or great nephew to drive me around. If one of them shows interest in a car...maybe it will belong to them when I'm gone.
Good Day!

Last edited by Dave in MN; 07-21-2020 at 04:15 PM.
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Old 07-20-2020, 09:20 AM   #13
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

Far too many people in the hobby leave it up to who is left, which is a mess. I am young so I have plenty of time to think about this but I would definetely go the route of offering the parts to local club members first.
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Old 07-20-2020, 10:33 AM   #14
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

Not leaving a single rusty washer. No-one gets anything. Who said you can't take it with you? LINK
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Old 07-20-2020, 10:45 AM   #15
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

My personal experience. Please be considerate of your heirs. I have been through a nasty case of parents who were children of the Depression, and threw very little away.

Shortly before my Dad started going downhill, he auctioned off part of his antique tractors (qty 50-60)/parts/tools/misc which grossed I believe about $60,000. For 5 months I drove 180 miles round trip on Sundays to help him. Put a lot of stress on me/my family/my job.

4-5 years later he passed, and at that time had to put my Mom in an Alzheimer's unit. That year had 2 auctions, one in June (household) and 1 in October (tractors/land). June for the household which was held at the Fairgrounds, everything packed up/moved/unpacked. 60 years of accumulated antiques/collectables/misc things they considered important/valuable. took 5 months on weekends to go through/distribute things to the immediate family/prepare for the auction. So much stuff auction started at 9 AM, ended at 5 pm.

Dad still had 35 of his good tractors, more parts, tools, etc that he had kept. So from the end of June spent weekends setting up for the tractor auction, and auction of the 5 acres/buildings he had. Had to hire a guy to help me get all the tractors running - cleaning out the tanks, no batteries so had to buy batteries. Getting tires pumped up and holding air, etc, etc. Auction started at 8:30 am , ended about 5 PM.

I was 57 at the time, It took a lot out of me emotionally and physically. Did not feel close to right until the following summer, and feel I never returned to my old self. Am not looking for sympathy. Just be aware decisions you make later in life affects others, especially family for a long time. Forcing your heirs through your poor planning will affect their families, lost time with their kids, spouse scabbling, and also perhaps financial issues getting the estate settled. Make sure you at a minimum have a Will, Durable and Medical Power of Attorneys. Set up a Revocable Living Trust to avoid heirs from having to go through Probate if you have assets that exceed the level that triggers Probate.

My advice, at the very least talk with an Estate/Probate lawyer and a Certified Investment Planner that is a Planner, avoid those that are associated with selling products.



Sorry for the rant, I have very strong opinions on this.
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Old 07-20-2020, 11:11 AM   #16
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

I've been in the performance part of the hobby all my life, I'm now 83. I have been selling things off as I find someone that wants something but have a long way to go. I have done an inventory of most everything in my garage, and have it on my computer desktop, easy to find, includes perceived values and locations. My family knows who to call, and who not to call. The plan is to offer first to my Club members, then it is up to a couple of them (already designated) to dispose of the remains. My son wants 1 of my cars, another already has my name, and his, on the pink slip.

A friend a few year ago was a pack-rat, he was fortunate to have family and friends willing to sort everything, place them on temporary "racks" and auctioned off. The remains (all junk) were hauled to the iron yard. First to the auction were Club members, at somewhat reduced prices, next open to all, including local Model A clubs.
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Old 07-20-2020, 11:27 AM   #17
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Not leaving a single rusty washer. No-one gets anything. Who said you can't take it with you? LINK




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Old 07-20-2020, 01:54 PM   #18
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

The biggest key to remember in all of this is the stuff is only worth what somebody is willing to pay. Doesn't matter if you spent $75 on a part the next person may only value it at $25. So it either gets sold or continues to sit around. What a lot of people don't realize is the amount of work that goes into buying a larger collection. For example I just bought a collection, i've made 9 trips back and forth (2 hours round trip each way) and i'm still not finished moving everything. And then moving it is just the tip of the iceberg, there is sorting the stuff, trips to the scrap yards.... all of that takes time and money to do. I always tell the estate here is my offer, when i'm done it will be cleaned up and you will be able to move on with your life. Some people take the offer, some people spend years going to flea markets to try to sell the stuff. Unfortunately the cost of time and labor must be calculated into pricing. As well as how long will it take to at least break even or even make some money on these. There have been several occasions where i've even told people to contact Maffii or AACA and have all of the parts donated to those organizations. Then it's their problem to move, and store....
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Old 07-20-2020, 06:51 PM   #19
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

The strange thing about selling off your cars and parts and tools is, then what?

So I sell my hobby and then sit in a chair and twiddle my thumbs and wait for the end. Everybody is going to die one day we all know that. You can hurry the process up mentally, and it will translate to physically, by depriving yourself of something you love to do.

That seems like a lousy way to end your life. You have to have fun as long as you can.

My suggestion is to thin out the herd but not necessarily kill your passion. Maybe keep one car and a few parts, that will be easier to get rid of than a barn full of stuff. And then get out and have fun with the car you saved back.

After all we probably all started off with one car anyway, one had to be first. And it was as much fun then as it is all these years later.
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Old 07-21-2020, 03:17 AM   #20
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Default Re: Model A Estate Plans

I’m a lifelong Model A guy and an attorney and do quite a bit of estate planning work. You all have brought out some excellent points and considerations. Of course there is no one size fits all solution and your varied ideas demonstrate that well.

Over my years of practice I have seen a big change in the “next generation”. Very few heirs have the same interest in vintage cars as their parents. Most don’t have the skills to keep old cars running. Many couldn’t even start and drive an old car. Many of them are completely helpless to fix anything. Sad to say, but overall we’ve done a poor job of raising a new crop of old car enthusiasts.

However, do you really want to cut back doing what you love so that the next generation doesn’t have to liquidate a collection they don’t understand or appreciate?

I’d say if you and your spouse aren’t burdened by your cars, keep them, enjoy them, and don’t feel guilty. After you are gone, the kids might have to learn something about your cars, take some action, do some research, and get motivated. It might do them some good.

Last edited by Fairview; 07-21-2020 at 03:24 AM.
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