The Ford Barn

adavis · 04-09-2012, 12:28 AM

To remove the door handle and then the latch plate to install new springs you must turn the handle 1/4 clockwise (like you're opening the door) and pull out (after you've removed the two screws). On my '31 I can not for the life of me get that dang handle to come out of the door. I verified that I'm doing it correctly by pulling the handle out of the driver's door and it worked fine, but the passenger handle will not budge. I watch the square shaft line up with the square hole as I turn the handle, but it acts like something else is holding it in the door. Could there be a clip or pin that I'm missing? Everything I've read states that all you have to do is turn the handle 1/4 turn and it should slide out, but I've even tried a brass drift punch a few times just to see if it would know it loose with no success. The door handle turns great and everything looks good....all I want to do is replace the broken spring for the latch. Any suggestions? I was considering using a small torch to heat up the assembly but I don't want to catch the window channel felt on fire.

What am I missing??

Tom Wesenberg · 04-09-2012, 01:05 AM

Actually it's 1/8th turn or 45*, then pull and wiggle the handle as you pull. I've had one or two that were also very stubborn as you described. I'd roll the window down and spray some penetrating oil on the shaft, then turn the handle 1/8th turn, wiggle it and pull. It should come out.

adavis · 04-09-2012, 01:10 AM

Thanks Tom. I can watch the two squares line up when I turn the handle and I've sprayed a bunch of PB Blaster on the whole assembly but it still won't come out. I even had my daughter hold the handle down while I tapped it from the back with a brass drift and it still wouldn't budge. Is it just a rust issue or is it possible that I'm missing a pin or clip that is holding it in?

Tom Wesenberg · 04-09-2012, 01:35 AM

I also hold the latch pushed in to take a little pressure off the handle. I would just keep pushing and pulling and wiggle it back and forth as you pull. I'd swear I hadn't removed the two screws on one handle, but it finally came.

BTW, this is my 2-23-29 Tudor handle, but I think it's like yours.

adavis · 04-10-2012, 12:59 AM

Thanks for the pictures. I sure wish I could get mine out. I've tried penetrating oil multiple times, a brass drift, a steel punch, and plenty of elbow grease and this sucker ain't coming out. It will move about 1/16-1/8" in and out so it doesn't seem like its bound. I wouldn't be so worried about it except it is the original door handle and I have the original key that works perfectly in the lock. All I want to do is replace the broken spring on the latch. Can I do that without taking out the door handle?

Tom Wesenberg · 04-10-2012, 05:12 AM

Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements)

My 29 Tudor had some springs stuck in behind the 2 latches to keep pressure on them. Back in the day that was the easy fix to a broken spring. I don't know what I did with those springs once I fixed the latches with the correct springs. Without getting the handle out I don't know of any way to get at the spring for the latch.

Brentwood Bob · 04-10-2012, 02:00 PM

Press the latch in to relieve the spring tension as you work the handle out. The second person does this so you don't bugger up the paint. Blue masking tape around the exterior bezel area first, again to protect the paint. If this fails go to the hammer and brass drift. The handle needs to be removed only in the open position. Bob

Bill Cilker · 04-10-2012, 02:33 PM

Make sure that the door handle is unlocked. You cannot get it out if it is locked.

Brentwood Bob · 04-10-2012, 02:40 PM

right on, Bill.

adavis · 04-11-2012, 12:36 AM

My guess is that some piece of the lock mechanism that the door handle shaft slides through is siezed on the shaft. I can tell if it is the large cam that moves the latch but I'd suspect that piece. The handle is unlocked and I can turn it until the square shaft lines up with the offset square hole (approximately 1/8 turn clockwise) but it will not slide out. I have jerked, wiggled, tapped, pried, and cursed at the thing for the last three days with no avail. It will pull in and out about 1/16" but it isn't even enough for the end of the square shaft to start into the square hole. I guess I'll just keep on soaking it with PB Blaster and tugging on it every time I walk by until something gives. I just wanted to make sure there wasn't a snap ring or roll pin that I'm missing and it sounds like there isn't. Thanks for the help.

Tom Wesenberg · 04-11-2012, 08:43 AM

Could that square end be swelled from hammering on it? Can you file it or get to it with a Dremel?

adavis · 04-18-2012, 12:25 AM

The end definitely looks fine....no mushroom. I haven't beat that hard on it.....yet. I just add more penetrating oil and wiggle/pull on it every day. It still hasn't come out yet, but I guess that with time and patience hopefully it will.

Farrell In Vancouver · 04-18-2012, 08:52 AM

I wonder if the fact the spring is broken is what ails it. You are trying to line up to squares and are assuming one is stationary and in the correct position when you turn the handle to 45 degrees. What if the broken spring has allowed the inner square to move less or more than you can rotate the handle to? I would try as many positions of the handle as you can while keeping a snug pull on it. All else fails the keyed tumbler barrel could be saved and installed for another handle?
I had a drivers door problem similar on the Special Coupe that gave me fits for a couple hours. I ended up unscrewing the latch from the door to get a better look at the problem and by fussing with the backside of the latch, and wiggling, it fell on the floor. (yes it dented the handle). I have one stuck on the pass. side of the 31 AA truck, but the problem with it is that its in the locked position and no key. This explains the broken drivers side window.

adavis · 04-24-2012, 12:25 AM

OK, so I finally gave up on removing the handle. I tricked my neighbor into helping me for an hour and we could not get it to budge. The shaft is completely loose and can move in and out 1/8" but it will not come out. Something is holding it up, and I think the only way to remove it is to cut it off and buy a new one.
However, since it is the original handle and I have the original key that works perfect I did not want to sacrifice it to the port-a-band. I unscrewed the latch plate and after some work was able to get the latch pivot pin to a place where I could drive it out with a long punch. I replaced the latch spring with a pair of needle nose pliers and after 15 minutes was able to get the pin back in and the spring in place. Everything works perfect now and the door closes as it should. Thanks for all the help and suggestions. Hopefully this spring will last a long time, but if it fails or something else in that latch goes haywire I'll break out the saw and hack off the handle.

Tom Wesenberg · 04-24-2012, 01:30 AM

Could you see if it was held up by rust? Hopefully you were able to grease all the moving parts. New springs and grease sure made my door latches work nice.

Purdy Swoft · 04-24-2012, 09:29 AM

Outside door handles are a pain to remove. Its been a while since I removed one But I think that you need to pull up on the inside latch handle while gently moveing the outside handle and gently pulling outward. When the handle reaches the magic point it will slide right out. You don't need to pull real hard and I don't recommend using a punch and hammer or you may damage the lock and handle to the point that it will never come out without cutting.

41plym · 07-14-2013, 07:29 PM

O.K. so my passenger side door is locked and I have no key (that is why I am trying to remove it) Do I drill the lock out? or is there another way to get it out?

Reds34 · 07-14-2013, 08:59 PM

Call a locksmith?

Red

41plym · 07-14-2013, 09:47 PM

Thanks Red
I'm starting to think thats my best option.
41plym

midgetracer · 07-14-2013, 10:02 PM

Mr adavis,
I have had similar problems as you are having. I think as you are saying in #5, The cam is rusted to the door handle. I have seen this quite a number of times. That will allow you to move the handle about an eighth of an inch as that is about as far as the cam can move inside the lock. Sometimes I have been able to get a screwdriver between the plates of the lock and the cam and and get it to start moving. Patience and a good penetrant such as Kroil is the best solution. You can beat it out, but it will ruin the lock and quite possibly the paint. Good Luck.

04-09-2012, 12:28 AM	#1
adavis Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Washington State Posts: 289	1931 coupe passenger door lock removal To remove the door handle and then the latch plate to install new springs you must turn the handle 1/4 clockwise (like you're opening the door) and pull out (after you've removed the two screws). On my '31 I can not for the life of me get that dang handle to come out of the door. I verified that I'm doing it correctly by pulling the handle out of the driver's door and it worked fine, but the passenger handle will not budge. I watch the square shaft line up with the square hole as I turn the handle, but it acts like something else is holding it in the door. Could there be a clip or pin that I'm missing? Everything I've read states that all you have to do is turn the handle 1/4 turn and it should slide out, but I've even tried a brass drift punch a few times just to see if it would know it loose with no success. The door handle turns great and everything looks good....all I want to do is replace the broken spring for the latch. Any suggestions? I was considering using a small torch to heat up the assembly but I don't want to catch the window channel felt on fire. What am I missing??

04-09-2012, 01:05 AM	#2
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal Actually it's 1/8th turn or 45*, then pull and wiggle the handle as you pull. I've had one or two that were also very stubborn as you described. I'd roll the window down and spray some penetrating oil on the shaft, then turn the handle 1/8th turn, wiggle it and pull. It should come out.

04-09-2012, 01:10 AM	#3
adavis Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Washington State Posts: 289	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal Thanks Tom. I can watch the two squares line up when I turn the handle and I've sprayed a bunch of PB Blaster on the whole assembly but it still won't come out. I even had my daughter hold the handle down while I tapped it from the back with a brass drift and it still wouldn't budge. Is it just a rust issue or is it possible that I'm missing a pin or clip that is holding it in?

04-09-2012, 01:35 AM	#4
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal I also hold the latch pushed in to take a little pressure off the handle. I would just keep pushing and pulling and wiggle it back and forth as you pull. I'd swear I hadn't removed the two screws on one handle, but it finally came. BTW, this is my 2-23-29 Tudor handle, but I think it's like yours.

04-10-2012, 05:12 AM	#6
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) My 29 Tudor had some springs stuck in behind the 2 latches to keep pressure on them. Back in the day that was the easy fix to a broken spring. I don't know what I did with those springs once I fixed the latches with the correct springs. Without getting the handle out I don't know of any way to get at the spring for the latch.

04-10-2012, 12:59 AM	#5
adavis Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Washington State Posts: 289	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal Thanks for the pictures. I sure wish I could get mine out. I've tried penetrating oil multiple times, a brass drift, a steel punch, and plenty of elbow grease and this sucker ain't coming out. It will move about 1/16-1/8" in and out so it doesn't seem like its bound. I wouldn't be so worried about it except it is the original door handle and I have the original key that works perfectly in the lock. All I want to do is replace the broken spring on the latch. Can I do that without taking out the door handle?

04-10-2012, 02:00 PM	#7
Brentwood Bob Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: brentwood, ca Posts: 4,273	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal Press the latch in to relieve the spring tension as you work the handle out. The second person does this so you don't bugger up the paint. Blue masking tape around the exterior bezel area first, again to protect the paint. If this fails go to the hammer and brass drift. The handle needs to be removed only in the open position. Bob

04-10-2012, 02:33 PM	#8
Bill Cilker Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Milpitas, CA Posts: 399	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal Make sure that the door handle is unlocked. You cannot get it out if it is locked. __________________ Bill Cilker, Jr Unrestored 190A Victoria 45B, 160B & 189A Victoria Association President

04-10-2012, 02:40 PM	#9
Brentwood Bob Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: brentwood, ca Posts: 4,273	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal right on, Bill.

04-11-2012, 12:36 AM	#10
adavis Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Washington State Posts: 289	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal My guess is that some piece of the lock mechanism that the door handle shaft slides through is siezed on the shaft. I can tell if it is the large cam that moves the latch but I'd suspect that piece. The handle is unlocked and I can turn it until the square shaft lines up with the offset square hole (approximately 1/8 turn clockwise) but it will not slide out. I have jerked, wiggled, tapped, pried, and cursed at the thing for the last three days with no avail. It will pull in and out about 1/16" but it isn't even enough for the end of the square shaft to start into the square hole. I guess I'll just keep on soaking it with PB Blaster and tugging on it every time I walk by until something gives. I just wanted to make sure there wasn't a snap ring or roll pin that I'm missing and it sounds like there isn't. Thanks for the help.

04-11-2012, 08:43 AM	#11
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal Could that square end be swelled from hammering on it? Can you file it or get to it with a Dremel?

04-18-2012, 12:25 AM	#12
adavis Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Washington State Posts: 289	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal The end definitely looks fine....no mushroom. I haven't beat that hard on it.....yet. I just add more penetrating oil and wiggle/pull on it every day. It still hasn't come out yet, but I guess that with time and patience hopefully it will.

04-18-2012, 08:52 AM	#13
Farrell In Vancouver Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Pitt Meadows BC Posts: 1,003	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal I wonder if the fact the spring is broken is what ails it. You are trying to line up to squares and are assuming one is stationary and in the correct position when you turn the handle to 45 degrees. What if the broken spring has allowed the inner square to move less or more than you can rotate the handle to? I would try as many positions of the handle as you can while keeping a snug pull on it. All else fails the keyed tumbler barrel could be saved and installed for another handle? I had a drivers door problem similar on the Special Coupe that gave me fits for a couple hours. I ended up unscrewing the latch from the door to get a better look at the problem and by fussing with the backside of the latch, and wiggling, it fell on the floor. (yes it dented the handle). I have one stuck on the pass. side of the 31 AA truck, but the problem with it is that its in the locked position and no key. This explains the broken drivers side window.

04-24-2012, 12:25 AM	#14
adavis Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Washington State Posts: 289	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal OK, so I finally gave up on removing the handle. I tricked my neighbor into helping me for an hour and we could not get it to budge. The shaft is completely loose and can move in and out 1/8" but it will not come out. Something is holding it up, and I think the only way to remove it is to cut it off and buy a new one. However, since it is the original handle and I have the original key that works perfect I did not want to sacrifice it to the port-a-band. I unscrewed the latch plate and after some work was able to get the latch pivot pin to a place where I could drive it out with a long punch. I replaced the latch spring with a pair of needle nose pliers and after 15 minutes was able to get the pin back in and the spring in place. Everything works perfect now and the door closes as it should. Thanks for all the help and suggestions. Hopefully this spring will last a long time, but if it fails or something else in that latch goes haywire I'll break out the saw and hack off the handle.

04-24-2012, 01:30 AM	#15
Tom Wesenberg Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Mpls, MN Posts: 27,582	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal Could you see if it was held up by rust? Hopefully you were able to grease all the moving parts. New springs and grease sure made my door latches work nice.

04-24-2012, 09:29 AM	#16
Purdy Swoft Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Alabama Posts: 8,099	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal Outside door handles are a pain to remove. Its been a while since I removed one But I think that you need to pull up on the inside latch handle while gently moveing the outside handle and gently pulling outward. When the handle reaches the magic point it will slide right out. You don't need to pull real hard and I don't recommend using a punch and hammer or you may damage the lock and handle to the point that it will never come out without cutting.

07-14-2013, 07:29 PM	#17
41plym Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Ridgefield Washington Posts: 87	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal O.K. so my passenger side door is locked and I have no key (that is why I am trying to remove it) Do I drill the lock out? or is there another way to get it out?

07-14-2013, 08:59 PM	#18
Reds34 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Eastern, CT Posts: 527	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal Call a locksmith? Red

07-14-2013, 09:47 PM	#19
41plym Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Ridgefield Washington Posts: 87	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal Thanks Red I'm starting to think thats my best option. 41plym

07-14-2013, 10:02 PM	#20
midgetracer Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Bismarck ND Posts: 1,189	Re: 1931 coupe passenger door lock removal Mr adavis, I have had similar problems as you are having. I think as you are saying in #5, The cam is rusted to the door handle. I have seen this quite a number of times. That will allow you to move the handle about an eighth of an inch as that is about as far as the cam can move inside the lock. Sometimes I have been able to get a screwdriver between the plates of the lock and the cam and and get it to start moving. Patience and a good penetrant such as Kroil is the best solution. You can beat it out, but it will ruin the lock and quite possibly the paint. Good Luck.