Houdaille Shock Problem

[Dirtrack49]

Went to replace a missing shock link on the front left after hitting a manhole cover. Found that my Houdaille shock would not move up or down. Too much resistance? Maybe I am too weak? Anyways, I needed to move the shock arm up a little ways so that I could put on the upper shock link. I thought that if I changed the needle setting to less resistance, I could get the shock to move. Well, that was a bad idea. the end of the needle broke off the shaft. Now I am evidently stuck with a needle set in a fixed position.
My questions are, can I replace the needle without taking the shock apart?
Should I be able to move the shock arm up and down without taking it off the car, or maybe something has gone wrong internal in the shock that made it seize in place?
Thanks for your help.
Tom L.

[Ranchero50]

Sounds like the problem wasn't the man hole so much as the suspension that couldn't flex. The shock shaft should rotate.

My one shock is frozen as well. I assume that's why it was left on the chassis...

[Dirtrack49]

Ranchero,
Do you know why your one shock is frozen?
That might possibly be what happened to my shock also.
This car is new to me. It was so called restored over a 14 year period. All the other shocks appear to be normal. The front left is what I first investigated after the manhole hit. Maybe the link had gone bye by before I bought the car. Maybe the shock is seized causing the link to take flight.
Anyone else got any idea? Much appreciated for your input.
Tom L.

[Ranchero50]

I assume the shaft rusted to the body. I tossed it onto the shelf to look at later. I'm missing the other three so I assume they worked and one of the PO's needed them for another project...

[rotorwrench]

Who Die shocks should have no more resistance to movement that a regular piston type shock and likely somewhat less. It sounds like you need to find a shock rebuilder and hope that it's salvageable. Removing broken threaded parts is always difficult but with the right resources, it can be done. If the wing shaft & housing are bad then it's not worth the trouble of going any further.

[Kurt in NJ]

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Steady pressure on the arm should slowly move it, easier moving up than down---- and being seized could be why the link is off

[Dirtrack49]

Thanks for everyone's input so far.
I am now thinking that this shock might be an aftermarket item.
I thought that the original Houdaille shocks had either a needle valve pointer for adjustment for 1928, or a square with an adjustment screw in the center of the square for later models. This shock has neither.
Should it matter what I use for a replacement shock? Do they necessarily need to be all the same? The front right shock appears to be a 1928 with the pointer needle valve.
Thanks again,
Tom L.

[Kurt in NJ]

The 32 shock had a cover over the adjustment, it was the later replacement listed in parts book

[Dirtrack49]

Went into town to take a closer look at the front left shock. After removing it from the car, I opened up the fill hole and found that there was no glycerin or oil in the chamber. The only thing I can see in the chamber is rust. So I am assuming that since this car was restored over a 14 year period, the front left shock must have lost it's fluid and ended up rusting. Or, it was no good to begin with.
Now, the question is what to do next? Do I try to take the shock apart and see if it can still be used? Soak it in something to see if it will free up? Send it out for rebuild? Buy a new aftermarket shock?
Below is a picture of my right front shock. If you look close, you can see that the needle adjustment has a pointer on it, yet no number references. Three of the shocks are the same.
The picture of the left front shock has the needle adjustment broken off. It is also marked Houdaille with the exception that it had a square adjuster on the end prior to me breaking it off.
Any and all suggestions much appreciated.
Tom L.

[30 Closed Cab PU]

I had my shocks rebuilt by John Holland. I highly recommend him.
Is willing to talk to you and answer questions, very nice guy.
John Holland (330-483-3896) (Ohio) phone only, no email, no text

[Dirtrack49]

Okay, after some reading, there are several if not many versions of shocks that were produced by many companies.
Now, I am thinking, that maybe any shock that is reproduced, verses no shock, may be the answer?
Should I just replace the bad shock with anything available, or replace all of them with a known matching shock set from a well known manufacturer?
If replacing all of them vs. one, who should I look at?
Thanks again,
Tom L.

[Ranchero50]

Put a mix of ATF and acetone in the rusty shock and allow it to brew for a couple days. Might break it free.

[Dan Partain]

I don't want to open up a new can of worms here, but it looks like your brake lever, actuating arm, is either on backwards, or on the wrong side of the front end. This can cause your brake rods to rub on the shock adjusting valve. Also, maybe it's the angle of the photo, but it kind of looks like your shock arm may also be bent in toward the frame. The shock link looks like it has an odd angle. Just a "heads up," maybe take a closer look.

[Dirtrack49]

Dan, thanks for the heads up. Below is a picture of my left side brake arm with the tubular shock link missing. Should this brake arm be on the right side? The two arms are different.
I will need to go take another look at the shock link and arm on the right side and take another picture.

This is kind of getting out of control with so many things that I have found wrong so far on a so called restored vehicle. This car was the PO's third restoration. Makes me wonder.
Tom L.

[rotorwrench]

Some folks get the restoration publications and study the manuals & bulletins available to get things correct to their needs. Others take things apart for repair then put them back together the same way they came off. They don't take into account how previous owners might have gotten things wrong. It's been a lot of water and hard years under the bridge since the model A era. I've seen all sorts of shade tree changes over the years. The first model A I purchased had no shocks at all.

[Dan Partain]

Tom,
Your driver side lever looks fine, it's the pre 1930 style and will work fine no matter what year your car is. Your passenger side is the post 1930 style and it's on backwards or the wrong side, I don't know which. You could just find one like the one on the drivers side and change it. I would call Steve at Berts and I'm sure he has boxes of the parts you need, and good advice too.

Compare the shape of your shock arms, it looks like the one on the drivers side is the correct shape. The passenger side arm looks bent, you can bend the shock arm back to it's original curve by matching the other side.
-DAN

[Dirtrack49]

Rotorwrench, you are so right. I just need to take another step back and go over this car with a fine tooth comb. I've worked on bikes and cars that were older, and yes, things get turned around with time.
Dan, from what I see in the shop manual, the two fork arms are reversed? The offset fork goes on the drivers side.
I know that many things on this car are from other years. The engine is a 1929. The car is a 1930. The other three shocks appear to be 1928.
Maybe I should start thinking about dismantling some of this car and start from ground zero.
Tom L.

[Dan Partain]

Tom,
The shape of those levers was changed for 1930, so you have both the early style and the late style on your car. Here are some photos of both styles. 30 style on the left, and 29 style on the right.


It may be easiest to just buy the correct year assemblies and install them when you have time.
If your car is running and driving, I wouldn't tear it apart, just drive it, enjoy it, and fix the little things that need help as you have time.
-DAN

[30 Closed Cab PU]

If you go with new shocks, Stipes Shocks are the best original looking style - Expensive but are extremely high quality. If you do not mind converting to a tubular shock, try doing a search here, there are a few possibilities.

[rotorwrench]

I'm in agreement on the idea of continued use of a car as long as it's capable. Get everything you can right before a tear down for cosmetics and corrosion control. If it needs front end work, just do that in a couple of weekends and so on with each subassembly of the car. They can be a lot of fun even when they aren't 100%. When you tear one down, it should be as quick a job as possible so that you can get back to driving it. In other words prepare for it so it can be expedited. A parts pile in the garage is no fun at all.

Cars that are totally ragged out are another thing but it all depends on overall condition.