1940 1 ton express

[Ford-Farm-MT]

I'm new to the site and looking for little direction. I have as the title states a '40 1 ton Express in quite good shape. Shes a runner and driver with low miles. I plan on keeping it all original. I would however like to do a different wheel/tire combo that's a little safer. Also possibly updating the electrical to 12v. Anyone who's familiar with these pickups may know info is scarce. If anyone has some information on specs or vendors that could point me in the right direction I would greatly appreciate it! Thank you!

[flatford8]

Welcome to the ‘Barn......I can’t really help with info other than I’ve heard of people putting your rim centers in a more modern wheel to get rid of the lock rings. The 6V system should be fine if in proper repair. We all would like to see pictures of your truck.... Mark

[alanwoodieman]

the 3/4 ton and some 1 ton 122 inch wheelbase trucks used the same brakes up front as the car did with different size brakes in the rear. how about a picture of the wheels/hubs. measure the front brakes--if it is 12" then you can use the conversion brakes from bollin brothers which are self energizing and really increase the stopping power

[Kube]

Welcome aboard!

I vote for keeping it 6v. as well. Properly set, the 6v. system will serve you very well. It's easy and reasonable to get all parts in proper order. If ya need help, there's some very knowledgeable folks here willing to aid you.

[rotorwrench]

Wheels for larger trucks were subcontracted by Ford and could fit a number of different makes and models depending on size and application. A lot depends on what the lug bolt count and spacing are as to what can be done on truck type wheels. The originals predate the widow maker types but they have to be in good condition to be safe. If they are too crusty or the rings are damaged or cracked then a person would have to find replacements.

[VeryTangled]

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Hi Everyone. Ford-Farm-MT, Wheel-tire combo I can't help with... But as for the 6v/12V question. My experience is the more you deviate from stock, the harder it becomes to troubleshoot when necessary. I've got two 6V +Gnd vehicles that are very reliable drivers.

[expavr]

Welcome to the Barn. I'm looking forward to seeing some photos of your rig.
Attached are some photos of changes I made to my 40 Tonner that may be what you're looking for. Regarding the tires. Photos 1and 2 shows the Tonner with 16" Michelin LT M/S radials. Photo 3 shows the spare tire with the OEM rim using a locking ring and bias ply 17" Firestone tire. To convert to radials I took a spare set of the OEM 17" rims and had the centers machined off the rims then welded to a modern 16" radial rim. Doing this keeps both the OEM Ford lug bolt pattern and nubs for holding the hubcaps on and you have the benefit of a radial tire that can be serviced anywhere.

Regarding the question of keeping the 6V electrical system I added a ground cable that goes from the ground post on the firewall to the frame (Photo 4). I also grounded the headlights and taillights directly to the frame using 10 gauge wire and have had no issues whatsoever with the lights which seems to be a common complaint with the 6V systems.

[truckdog62563]

The 1938 to 1947 tonners have a 5 lug x 6 7/8” bolt pattern. Having researched this for other guys over the years I know that no other vehicle used that bolt pattern on a shallow dished single rear wheel application. So in a nutshell, no other wheels will substitute.

There were two optional widths in 1940. The Ford Green Bible chassis catalog lists them as 11Y 1015B, a 17” x 5” (3.75”) and 11Y 1015A, a 17” x 6” (4.33”). I’ve added the numbers in parentheses because throughout the entire decade of the 1940s Ford failed to adapt to an industry wide change in measurement standards. The National Wheel and Rim Association stopped measuring widths across rim lips in the 1930s and adopted the current system of measurement where width is the space between rim lips. Thus, a 5” became a 3.75”, and a 6” became a 4.33”. Both of these optional wheels were made by the Budd Company. The 3.75” is Budd 41620 and the 4.33” is Budd 41470. Your wheels will have one of the numbers stamped into the metal. Probably on a rear rim lip.

Both these wheels have outer rims made by the Firestone Steel Products Company and sourced to Budd. Using Firestone’s terminology, the design is called the Firestone RH. This rim shared its outer ring design with the Dayton style demountable rims, called the RI. Thus, the RH wheels having the riveted center disc used rings that are labeled RI. Different rings were used on the 3.75” and 4.33”, and they do not interchange.

Safety? This design has gotten an undeserved bad rap. These wheels in their various configurations were an industry standard from the early 1930s well into the 1980s. They have suffered from their association with the Firestone RH-5° (widow maker) that was introduced in 1948 and was itself an industry standard until it was removed from the market in the mid 1970s under recall threat by the NHTSA and IIHS. Today few if any service shops will work on the RH-5°, and fewer and fewer are training techs to work on the RH and related RHP designs. So you may have to look for a shop with an old guy that knows his trade to get tires mounted. I think it’s worth the effort to keep them in service if they are not damaged, heavily rusted, etc.

If you really want to go the route of custom wheels I can go further into it. But for now I’ve rattled on long enough. Stu

Three RH/RI widths:



Note the indents on opposite sides of the ring:



Note the molded identifying info on the inner ring:

[50fordcoupeman]

I dont know where in Montana you live, but there is a place in Missoula called NW Classics that may be able to help you with questions,parts, etc.

[blucar]

Ford Farm, FYI
We have a complete tonner chassis, no engine but all of the wheels/hubcaps are on the chassis, sitting out on the farm in central Montana.

[expavr]

“I think it’s worth the effort to keep them in service if they are not damaged, heavily rusted, etc.”.
I agree with Stu. I was able to cull thru two sets of the OEM 17” rims and make up one set of 17” rims and tires that are original and would pass muster for judging. If you decide to go this route I would recommend that you have the locking rings magnafluxed for cracks. The acquisition of Blucar’s tonner chassis or a search for another set of 17” rims to modify for radials opens the door to the radial option without losing the value of the OEM rims to your truck. As I recall the cost to remove the centers, weld them to a radial rim and balance was about $150.00/each. If you’re interested PM me and I’ll look for the invoice and vendor name. I found that the radials made a big difference in handling especially at freeway speeds (60+ MPH).

[blucar]

Ford-Farm... In your original posting you made mention that you were considering converting the electrical system on your Tonner to 12 v. I have to agree with the comments made that there is no need to change from 6v, which opens up a whole can of worms with instruments, etc. A well maintained 6v system works just fine.

As mentioned a few added ground cables, cab to chassis, bed to chassis, etc., will improve the system.
When I lived in Eastern Idaho during the '40's-50's, temps down to -30 it was very common to use 8v batteries in 6v systems. Just a simple matter of turning the voltage reg up to 8'+ volts.
When I moved to So Cal in '56 I brought my '36 with me, still have it. I continued to use a 8v battery in the car until the mid '60's. The 8v batteries have no effect on the instruments, lights, radio or heater.

Of course there are people that will disagree with my statement, however, my car is living prove that an 8v only improves starting due to the increased cranking power.
Make sure you use the heavy 6v cables, don't use small 12v cables on a 6v system.
The 6v systems have high resistance, that is why large cables are used.

[rotorwrench]

8-volt in a 6-volt system reduces the life of the basic components. How much is a mystery but they don't make many 8-volt bulbs. To charge the battery properly, it would need a minimum of 9.1-volts output from the generator. Rather than mess with that, a person should just either update it to 12-volts or properly repair it for 6-volts. 6-Volt would be the easiest way to go. 12-volts would only be necessary if a person want more accessories like AC or audio systems.

[tubman]

Eight volt batteries are for old, worn out tractors. In my opinion, they have no place in quality early Fords. They are a band-aid. Decide where you want to be.

[Ford-Farm-MT]

Thank you for all the replies! Life got busy and I haven't had a chance to get working on her yet. I'll get some photos uploaded as soon as I can. I do believe I'll keep the 6v and add the grounds as suggested. I need to get myself educated up on the the old flathead and how to keep it running well. This pickup was left to me after my dad passed away so it definitely want to keep it in running order!

[alanwoodieman]

life does have a problem getting in the way of playing. definitly would like to see pictures, glad you are back

[flatford8]

I agree.....glad your back!!!.....love the big pickups......Mark

[GB SISSON]

And I am Also glad to see you show up. I have a lot of experience with the jailbar tonners. Hey, what about those pictures?

[cas3]

Admirable fleet you have there GB !

[petehoovie]

Originally Posted by GB SISSON

And I am Also glad to see you show up. I have a lot of experience with the jailbar tonners. Hey, what about those pictures?