The Ford Barn

big job · 12-19-2016, 08:49 AM

Whats wrong with early Y blocks. Answer = junk oil, lack of oil changing. I remember
those so sledged up when they were only 4-5yrs old. Sad as it is, many back then
poured #90 gear oil in them. On or about 1964 the PVC valve came in, big improvement. I look back and people did stupid things back then - putting saw dust
in rear axles corn and pepper in radiators molasses in the crankcase. oh well thats
what was done. I have 4 big Y blocks 332's clean no problem at all. They really have
more power than my 460 injected 'dog' in a late F350. So now If one has a $30,000
vehicle would you do those things to your engine? NO

big job · 12-19-2016, 09:00 AM

We have 3, 337's in stock of which one has 12,000 miles. My above reply on the
460 'dog' I have been working time to time milling an adapter plate 337 to AOD
4x4. Thinking re drilling 460 to 337 flex plate keeping starter housing. Why, can't
deal with 3mpg down hill 460 fuel injected junk. Yes gone back to dealer with no avail.
Snow Sat plowed & got 4 hrs, tank of gas. thats not acceptable.. Meanwhile a F6
sander runs all night and use couple three gallons

rotorwrench · 12-19-2016, 09:41 AM

FoMoCo came out with the FE block in the late 50s but it didn't really come alive until the 390 cid was developed. That was one of Ford's "light bulb on" better ideas. The Y-blocks were good torque engines and could be built to be even better but the later 390 FE block was good right out of the box.

Vic Piano · 12-20-2016, 12:40 PM

That's almost as good lookin' as a Flat Motor.

rotorwrench · 12-20-2016, 01:39 PM

The aftermarket crowd latched on to the better bang for the buck that the bow-tie engines gave so the Ford engines were always more expensive to build. The bow-tie V8 was always a bit more compact too but not a lot. When racers tied in with Ford products, they always did well with them. The Purple Hogs could have been bigger winners in 1955 if they hadn't had so much trouble with their front suspensions. Later on in the 60s Caroll Shelby did well with Fords and others did too. Chrysler had to do a lot of work on the Hemi to get it to beat the Ford FE 427s.

Tim Ayers · 12-20-2016, 02:04 PM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

The aftermarket crowd latched on to the better bang for the buck that the bow-tie engines gave so the Ford engines were always more expensive to build. The bow-tie V8 was always a bit more compact too but not a lot. When racers tied in with Ford products, they always did well with them. The Purple Hogs could have been bigger winners in 1955 if they hadn't had so much trouble with their front suspensions. Later on in the 60s Caroll Shelby did well with Fords and others did too. Chrysler had to do a lot of work on the Hemi to get it to beat the Ford FE 427s.

I'm truly asking, but I thought by the time Shelby got involved, the Y block was a footnote in Ford's history books. I do know Shelby made some serious HP with Fords 289's.

Please correct me if I'm wrong for I'd really like to know. I don't know much about Shelby's beginnings.

The 354 and 392 Hemi's seemed to be immediate hit with racers. Guys realized very early that these motors could make some serious power, especially on juice. Desoto's baby hemi was cool, but weren't able to realize the tremendous power on tap with the big hemis.

Interesting, the Hemi wasn't anything new. The French and some Italian engineers introduced the hemi-head in the race engines in the teens. Once they tore things up, Miller jumped on the design and used it in his engines.

rotorwrench · 12-20-2016, 02:23 PM

Dale Earnhardt's first race car the Pink & Purple K2 car was a 1956 Ford. I don't know how well he did with it though.

Curtis Turner was probably the best Ford driver of the 50s. He did well in 1956 and could have won championship if he hadn't gotten started so late in the season. He had a reputation for blowing up engines but the Y-block survived that year. Some of the stories about the crazy things he did are legend.

The 1963 fast back Galaxie 500 with the R-code FE 427 was a monster. The Hemi 426 was developed to beat it and Ford came up with the SOHC 427 and both were promptly banned from NASCAR.

Tim Ayers · 12-20-2016, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rotorwrench

Dale Earnhardt's first race car the Pink & Purple K2 car was a 1956 Ford. I don't know how well he did with it though.

Curtis Turner was probably the best Ford driver of the 50s. He did well in 1956 and could have won championship if he hadn't gotten started so late in the season. He had a reputation for blowing up engines but the Y-block survived that year. Some of the stories about the crazy things he did are legend.

Did Turner have FordMoCo support or was he an independent racer?

Funny, I'm an elementary principal and one of my parents, Rob Edelstein, wrote a book about him. It's called:

Full Throttle: The Life and Fast Times of NASCAR Legend Curtis Turner.

I'll have to read the book again, but from I recall Curtis was certainly a character.

Last question: My mechanical knowledge stops at '53, so I don't know the difference of the Y blocks and Fords FE OHV's. Do they share any lineage or are they completely different animals?

On a side note, a hard top R code Galaxie is one of my bucket list cars. I've always loved them.

rotorwrench · 12-20-2016, 05:15 PM

[QUOTE=Last question: My mechanical knowledge stops at '53, so I don't know the difference of the Y blocks and Fords FE OHV's. Do they share any lineage or are they completely different animals? [/QUOTE]

The Y blocks share some similarities in induction systems with the MEL (Mercury-Edsel-Lincoln) blocks of the later 50s even though one is a small block and the other is more of a medium to large block but the FE (Ford-Edsel) has a different induction system design even though is shares some characteristics in valve train of the earlier Y-block and is considered a medium block. The early 1958 332 and later 352 FEs were disappointing in performance standards but the 390 that came along in 1961 was a good one. The later 427 & 428 engines had a lot more torque and horsepower.

Ol' Ron · 12-20-2016, 02:35 PM

In an effort to beat the Cheavs in the late 50's I built a 342 stroke Hilborne Fuel injected "Y" block. This drove a 37 cad/La-Sal trans. 4.11 rear in a 56 Ford HT. Unortunately it took too long to get the stupid factor undercontrol. By the time I got the engine tuned any way near right, them money just ran out and the engine was sold for 500 bucks and a rebuilt 292 Y block. It was a great education. Those Hilborns are trickiy.

rotorwrench · 12-20-2016, 03:03 PM

I think he started with Ford Support but somewhere in there they pulled the plug for a long time. Holman & Moody got together due to the exit of factory backing. I think Ralph Moody might have driven one of those purple hog cars.

Jason in TX · 12-20-2016, 03:34 PM

Video of that V12 Racer doing victory donuts

https://www.instagram.com/p/BGSV1h9upUr/

41ford1 · 04-01-2017, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jason in TX

Video of that V12 Racer doing victory donuts

https://www.instagram.com/p/BGSV1h9upUr/

Look again. That's a 337 V8.

Vic Piano · 12-20-2016, 05:27 PM

I'm curious to know just how many FordBarner's are looking to build HV-12's and/or 337's to race? I've got a V-12 in my '39 LZ and a 337 in my '49 Cosmo, they are excellent cruisin' engines in their intended vehicles. I, for one, don't feel the need for speed between traffic lights, in the Cosmo or the Zephyr however, I'm certainly not opposed to putting a little eye candy on them.

Pilot31135 · 03-30-2017, 03:28 PM

Here is my Lincoln/Ford 337...

Newc · 03-30-2017, 09:24 PM

Hi all; Did'nt the Munz cars use 337's. Some had aluminum heads ect. I think I saw one on HAMB. Newc

Pilot31135 · 04-02-2017, 05:53 AM

Regardless of which side your on regarding the Lincoln flathead, I hope we could all agree that at least it's a fairly rare engine being made from late 1948-1951, and it has a cool sound just like the smaller flathead...

https://youtu.be/JjW_Z3r5rDg

Jason in TX · 05-25-2017, 09:53 AM

I wanted to comment on the above post about the desirability of the SBC in the 1950s.

I'm pretty sure the 1955 Corvette product that was wrapped around the 265 cu.in. SBC had a lot to do with that desirability. That race looking body and suspension showing up at the tracks and in magazines. Seeing those new factory available race cars would make me want to put one of those mills in my Ford if I was around in the 1950s.

Car and Driver did a test of the TEN fastest 1950s cars and FIVE of them were the Corvette, one the 1958 Chevy Del Ray, and then the 1957 Porsche, 1958 Ferrari Europa and the 1959 Ferrari california Spyder.

And who was responsible for that??? Zora Arkus-Duntov! The Godfather of the Corvette,

....but also the inventor of the Ardun OHV conversion for the Ford Flathead.

(see how I brought it back to the Ford Flathead?)

Henry Floored · 05-25-2017, 08:56 PM

The Conforth Lincoln V8 special is also featured in the current Rodders Journal.

See here's the thing gang. Look at all the very quick diesel powered trucks you see today. Are those high winding screamers or do they produce gobs of torque and are geared accordingly?

The 337 Lincoln is never going to be a high winder but if built in accordance with its strengths and geared properly it's gonna give you a kick in the pants.

corvette8n · 05-26-2017, 09:49 AM

Saw this V12 at a car show 10 years ago, never did get to hear it run.

12-19-2016, 08:49 AM	#1
big job Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Dighton, Mass Posts: 1,268	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads Whats wrong with early Y blocks. Answer = junk oil, lack of oil changing. I remember those so sledged up when they were only 4-5yrs old. Sad as it is, many back then poured #90 gear oil in them. On or about 1964 the PVC valve came in, big improvement. I look back and people did stupid things back then - putting saw dust in rear axles corn and pepper in radiators molasses in the crankcase. oh well thats what was done. I have 4 big Y blocks 332's clean no problem at all. They really have more power than my 460 injected 'dog' in a late F350. So now If one has a $30,000 vehicle would you do those things to your engine? NO

12-19-2016, 09:00 AM	#2
big job Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Dighton, Mass Posts: 1,268	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads We have 3, 337's in stock of which one has 12,000 miles. My above reply on the 460 'dog' I have been working time to time milling an adapter plate 337 to AOD 4x4. Thinking re drilling 460 to 337 flex plate keeping starter housing. Why, can't deal with 3mpg down hill 460 fuel injected junk. Yes gone back to dealer with no avail. Snow Sat plowed & got 4 hrs, tank of gas. thats not acceptable.. Meanwhile a F6 sander runs all night and use couple three gallons

12-19-2016, 09:41 AM	#3
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 18,018	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads FoMoCo came out with the FE block in the late 50s but it didn't really come alive until the 390 cid was developed. That was one of Ford's "light bulb on" better ideas. The Y-blocks were good torque engines and could be built to be even better but the later 390 FE block was good right out of the box.

12-20-2016, 12:40 PM	#4
Vic Piano Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Odessa, FL Posts: 7,612	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads That's almost as good lookin' as a Flat Motor. __________________ Imagination is more important than knowledge.

12-20-2016, 01:39 PM	#5
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 18,018	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads The aftermarket crowd latched on to the better bang for the buck that the bow-tie engines gave so the Ford engines were always more expensive to build. The bow-tie V8 was always a bit more compact too but not a lot. When racers tied in with Ford products, they always did well with them. The Purple Hogs could have been bigger winners in 1955 if they hadn't had so much trouble with their front suspensions. Later on in the 60s Caroll Shelby did well with Fords and others did too. Chrysler had to do a lot of work on the Hemi to get it to beat the Ford FE 427s.

12-20-2016, 02:23 PM	#7
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 18,018	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads Dale Earnhardt's first race car the Pink & Purple K2 car was a 1956 Ford. I don't know how well he did with it though. Curtis Turner was probably the best Ford driver of the 50s. He did well in 1956 and could have won championship if he hadn't gotten started so late in the season. He had a reputation for blowing up engines but the Y-block survived that year. Some of the stories about the crazy things he did are legend. The 1963 fast back Galaxie 500 with the R-code FE 427 was a monster. The Hemi 426 was developed to beat it and Ford came up with the SOHC 427 and both were promptly banned from NASCAR.

12-20-2016, 05:15 PM	#9
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 18,018	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads [QUOTE=Last question: My mechanical knowledge stops at '53, so I don't know the difference of the Y blocks and Fords FE OHV's. Do they share any lineage or are they completely different animals? [/QUOTE] The Y blocks share some similarities in induction systems with the MEL (Mercury-Edsel-Lincoln) blocks of the later 50s even though one is a small block and the other is more of a medium to large block but the FE (Ford-Edsel) has a different induction system design even though is shares some characteristics in valve train of the earlier Y-block and is considered a medium block. The early 1958 332 and later 352 FEs were disappointing in performance standards but the 390 that came along in 1961 was a good one. The later 427 & 428 engines had a lot more torque and horsepower.

12-20-2016, 02:35 PM	#10
Ol' Ron Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Chester Vt Posts: 8,985	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads In an effort to beat the Cheavs in the late 50's I built a 342 stroke Hilborne Fuel injected "Y" block. This drove a 37 cad/La-Sal trans. 4.11 rear in a 56 Ford HT. Unortunately it took too long to get the stupid factor undercontrol. By the time I got the engine tuned any way near right, them money just ran out and the engine was sold for 500 bucks and a rebuilt 292 Y block. It was a great education. Those Hilborns are trickiy.

12-20-2016, 03:03 PM	#11
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 18,018	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads I think he started with Ford Support but somewhere in there they pulled the plug for a long time. Holman & Moody got together due to the exit of factory backing. I think Ralph Moody might have driven one of those purple hog cars.

12-20-2016, 03:34 PM	#12
Jason in TX Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: ⓉⒺXⒶⓈ Posts: 2,047	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads Video of that V12 Racer doing victory donuts https://www.instagram.com/p/BGSV1h9upUr/ __________________ -------------- Drive it like you know how to fix it! DMAFC / OILERS CC-MC

12-20-2016, 05:27 PM	#14
Vic Piano Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Odessa, FL Posts: 7,612	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads I'm curious to know just how many FordBarner's are looking to build HV-12's and/or 337's to race? I've got a V-12 in my '39 LZ and a 337 in my '49 Cosmo, they are excellent cruisin' engines in their intended vehicles. I, for one, don't feel the need for speed between traffic lights, in the Cosmo or the Zephyr however, I'm certainly not opposed to putting a little eye candy on them. __________________ Imagination is more important than knowledge.

03-30-2017, 09:24 PM	#16
Newc Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 3,053	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads Hi all; Did'nt the Munz cars use 337's. Some had aluminum heads ect. I think I saw one on HAMB. Newc

04-02-2017, 05:53 AM	#17
Pilot31135 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: Maine Posts: 109	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads Regardless of which side your on regarding the Lincoln flathead, I hope we could all agree that at least it's a fairly rare engine being made from late 1948-1951, and it has a cool sound just like the smaller flathead... https://youtu.be/JjW_Z3r5rDg

05-25-2017, 09:53 AM	#18
Jason in TX Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: ⓉⒺXⒶⓈ Posts: 2,047	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads I wanted to comment on the above post about the desirability of the SBC in the 1950s. I'm pretty sure the 1955 Corvette product that was wrapped around the 265 cu.in. SBC had a lot to do with that desirability. That race looking body and suspension showing up at the tracks and in magazines. Seeing those new factory available race cars would make me want to put one of those mills in my Ford if I was around in the 1950s. Car and Driver did a test of the TEN fastest 1950s cars and FIVE of them were the Corvette, one the 1958 Chevy Del Ray, and then the 1957 Porsche, 1958 Ferrari Europa and the 1959 Ferrari california Spyder. And who was responsible for that??? Zora Arkus-Duntov! The Godfather of the Corvette, ....but also the inventor of the Ardun OHV conversion for the Ford Flathead. (see how I brought it back to the Ford Flathead?) __________________ -------------- Drive it like you know how to fix it! DMAFC / OILERS CC-MC

05-25-2017, 08:56 PM	#19
Henry Floored Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Florida Posts: 630	Re: Pros and cons of Lincoln flatheads The Conforth Lincoln V8 special is also featured in the current Rodders Journal. See here's the thing gang. Look at all the very quick diesel powered trucks you see today. Are those high winding screamers or do they produce gobs of torque and are geared accordingly? The 337 Lincoln is never going to be a high winder but if built in accordance with its strengths and geared properly it's gonna give you a kick in the pants.