head gasket problem?

[cuzncletus]

Assembling my 59AB I noticed that both head gaskets were the same. I'm using Fel-Pro fiber gaskets with the stamped fire ring. I've always assembled motors with the print side up. In doing this with the Fel-Pro's, one side ends up with the print side down and the wider stamped fire ring away from the block and towards the head.

I just wanted to make sure everything was right before I torqued the heads down.

[Lawrie]

The fellers I just used (yesterday) had this side up on them,
Lawrie
Damm spell checkers, should be felpro

[cuzncletus]

If there's a "this side up", which I've seen before but is not on these, then they can't be correct as I have either two rights or two lefts.

[Brian]

What you have is how they make 'em. Fit one 'upside down' in your way of thinking.

[Bluebell]

I had the same problem a couple of weeks back. In my ignorance I thought there should be a left and right, so that the same side is up on both sides.
I had a Best gasket set, and checked with the supplier and on this forum.
I also checked the Best gasket web site. They only do one head gasket for the 46 engine, so one had to be "flipped" to keep the notch (and the small water holes) at the front.
I'm an old mechanic, but have done only a couple of V8s in the last 45 years. That probably tells you a bit about V8s in this country..... or maybe they were just avoiding me?

[JWL]

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It is only important to place the front of the gasket to the front of the engine. Which side is up or down will not be controlled by the mechanic.

[Kube]

Perhaps things have changed in recent times...and, if they have, it is with little doubt the "change" has been brought upon us by the manufacture choosing the "cheapest" way vs. the correct way.

When I was trained as a mechanic, there were two simple sayings to remember which side of a head gasket went upwards. One was "up, up and away", the other "shiny side up".
These sayings were in reference to the fire ring.

Not all gaskets had markings to indicate "up" and these sayings always aided in determining the correct orientation.

In reality did it make a difference? I will never know other than to say, I never had a head gasket fail.

There is always a "correct" way of doing things and numerous "it'll work" ways of doing things.

[JWL]

There is only one Fel-pro gasket for the 59A style engine. So, one side will have the "fire ring" down and the other side will have it up. As I said, it is only important to correctly orient the front/rear. And, again, the mechanic will not have a choice of up or down fire rings.

[Bluebell]

I now understand what the practice is, JWL, but as Cube points out, in all other applications that I have come across in more than 45 years, the fire ring goes up. With the old copper asbestos gaskets, the rolled over ring went to the head.
That's how I remember it anyhow.

[Kube]

Originally Posted by Bluebell

I now understand what the practice is, JWL, but as Cube points out, in all other applications that I have come across in more than 45 years, the fire ring goes up. With the old copper asbestos gaskets, the rolled over ring went to the head.
That's how I remember it anyhow.

You remember it well.
If only one gasket is being offered for both sides as JWL states, then the company producing them is taking the "cheap" route. Is it good enough? Probably. Is it correct? Not really.

[JWL]

I will need some help in understanding how it makes any difference which way the fire ring lip faces??? If there is a legitimate, scientific, documented, technical reason, I want to hear it.

Thanks,
JWL

[Walt Dupont--Me.]

I've been building these engines for 65 years, JWL is right, usually there is little bigger water hole that goes to the rear, also most of them have a notch that goes to rear, some of the brands are a little differant and it makes you think for a min. The fire ring don't make no differant up or down. Walt

[Russ/40]

Not yet mentioned, is the reason for any concern regarding orientation. I have always been of the belief the fire ring up is to prevent any scrubbing of the block surface and any consequent wear to that surface. On old heads, you can often see the witness marks of this wear. Theory is its easier to resurface heads than blocks. Is this warranted Concern, probably not.

[Bluebell]

Russ, I think your reason is what I was taught. I agree that it probably has no real justification.
There have been many different makes and models of copper asbestos head gaskets that can only fit, fire ring up. It has been a manufacturers decision to make them that way, as it is a manufacturers decision to make only one head gasket to fit both banks of these F.H. V8s. I now see that Ford has only ever made one gasket to fit both sides. (41-47 Chassis Parts Catalogue)(Ford of Canada)

[JWL]

Walt, all the gaskets I have used have the little notch to the FRONT.

Russ, when heads have the "wear pattern" you will find both sides look the same yet one has ring up and one has ring down. The heads wear because they do most of the moving during operation. The unit pressure in the area of the ring is the same whether up or down.

[Bruce Lancaster]

Ford gaskets (I think all years '32-48, certainly the 59) were all one type used on both sides. The front is important and in my experience is always so stamped or marked. Perfectly normal. There is only one part number for each, marked as use 2 in the good book.
There are two TYPES of 239 gasket, the 59 with round holes and the earlier one with big trapezoidal holes, but the latter is utterly obsolete because the Ford manual called for the prewar engines that used it to have their central head holes redrilled and the 59 gasket substituted.

(PS...if front location is unclear, the difference is in several small holes at front and back. You will see that one set is slightly larger than the other, and goes at the rear.)

[Ronnie]

The only orientation is "front",bore flange has no incorrect installation.A new gasket for a ford Windsor only have the front orientation also it has been that way forever.The reason some engines have a gasket that you have a choice on is there is no orientation at all for l/h r/h or front.A small block 350 gm is that way.Bore flange up or down it doesn't matter.Read a gasket catalogue the r/h l/h is described in the gasket set.As stated a new ford Windsor will have one up and the other down.

R