The Ford Barn

Pilotdave · 02-26-2012, 04:05 PM

Many of you have been answering my flood of questions as I rehabbed the brakes on our Tudor. I promised a report after the road test, so here goes.

First the background. Noticing that our brakes were less and less effective, I determined that the steel drums were beyond turning and that the shoe linings were glazed in places. I decided to replace the drums with cast iron drums and went through the process of marrying up the hubs to the new drums, having the latter turned and the shoes relined and arced. I replaced the other wearable parts in the brakes and installed a full Flathead Ted floating brake set.

Combining he last step with the rehab might have been an error - could have been simpler to fully restore the stock brakes and then convert to floating brakes. This was most noticeable when I was adjusting the floating brakes and found myself wrestling with questions about rear/front brake balance, excess drag, and so on.

I found that there is a critical step in the floater installation. Well, there likely are several, but this is one that I initially overlooked. The front brake conversion employs a centering spacer plate behind the operating wedge. The critical point that I missed is that the arms at the bottom of this plate must clear the inner surface of the brake shoe. In my case, they did not and the shoes were dragging on the drums with the adjusting screw turned all the way out. Once I fixed this, the excess drag went away. BTW, I found that the best way to check for clearance was to look for a small separation between the arm and the shoe. Much easier to see than whether the back roller is fully into the half-moon space that it occupies.

As to rear/front brake balance, I have, for the moment, opted for the traditional 60/40 balance resulting from the standard process for adjusting the stock brakes.

Now to the road test results. I put about 25 miles on the car, drifting to a stop occasionally to check for drum temps. With a couple of tweaks, I now have cool drums and rear brakes that lock up on my gravel lane, fronts that do not but are clearly contributing to the braking effort. I cannot lock up any of the brakes on dry pavement....though I'm not sure that this is something I want to be able to do! The car stops nicely - much improved vs. the pre-rehab effort. No squealing or pulling. I will run them as they are for a while and recheck.

I want to thank those who contributed to this effort - there were many steps when I turned to Fordbarn for guidance. You guys were terrific - thanks again.

Vanspeed · 02-26-2012, 04:12 PM

My coupe will lock up the brakes on pavement, don't ask me how I know.

jerry shook · 02-26-2012, 04:36 PM

Dave. The first floaters i installed was on my 30 cope, worried with then seam like foever. My fault not following instructions. Just got flustrated and parked it for about a mouth, when i did get it out to my suprise the brakes worked great the peddle was easy to push would slow like disk brakes and slide if i applied them hard. I think mabe they seated to the drums wile setting. No mater how long it takes it worth it in the end best brakes ever. That was over a year ago still working great.

Modelakid31 · 02-26-2012, 04:41 PM

Glad it all worked out well for you Dave! Nothing like a new set of brakes that stop well!

ps. been busy with midterms this past/coming week thats why I haven't called you yet.

Pilotdave · 02-26-2012, 04:43 PM

I'm going to drive it for a while and see what happens. For sure the braking power is much better already.

1931 flamingo · 02-26-2012, 06:50 PM

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Nice going!!!
Paul in CT

Keith True · 02-26-2012, 07:30 PM

Every single problem I've seen with the floaters have been installer error.Most have been people leaving out a step because it didn't seem important.Also people that bought them to use as a magic bullet to fix poor brakes that need 25 other things fixed first.Those things HAVE to be fixed first.If you try to get by without repairing everything else first,you need to be a mechanic and understand how they work,because you are going to take them apart a dozen times tweaking things to make them work.I have had people ask me to put them in,looking for the quick fix.I tell them I will put them in,as long as we can fix everything else first.Some have been told they can have perfect brakes with this $100.handful of parts.I still have two new sets I have not even bothered to put in.I bought them years ago,when I first saw them.When my knees get worse I will though.

Pilotdave · 02-26-2012, 08:02 PM

Mike - no worries - call when it's convenient and you're looking to get your hands into a Model A. Hope your exams went well.

Paul - thanks....so far, so good.

Keith - I get what you are saying. I do think that there's another category: the installer who lacks experience. If I were to do this again, I'd know how to check the fit of those plates. I find that there are enough instances where instructions tell me what to do but not how to make life challenging. This was the case here, and there's no way to visually check that the rollers are fitting properly into plate once the plate is on the car.

02-26-2012, 04:05 PM	#1
Pilotdave Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Grafton, MA Posts: 1,273	Brake Rehab - Road Test Report Many of you have been answering my flood of questions as I rehabbed the brakes on our Tudor. I promised a report after the road test, so here goes. First the background. Noticing that our brakes were less and less effective, I determined that the steel drums were beyond turning and that the shoe linings were glazed in places. I decided to replace the drums with cast iron drums and went through the process of marrying up the hubs to the new drums, having the latter turned and the shoes relined and arced. I replaced the other wearable parts in the brakes and installed a full Flathead Ted floating brake set. Combining he last step with the rehab might have been an error - could have been simpler to fully restore the stock brakes and then convert to floating brakes. This was most noticeable when I was adjusting the floating brakes and found myself wrestling with questions about rear/front brake balance, excess drag, and so on. I found that there is a critical step in the floater installation. Well, there likely are several, but this is one that I initially overlooked. The front brake conversion employs a centering spacer plate behind the operating wedge. The critical point that I missed is that the arms at the bottom of this plate must clear the inner surface of the brake shoe. In my case, they did not and the shoes were dragging on the drums with the adjusting screw turned all the way out. Once I fixed this, the excess drag went away. BTW, I found that the best way to check for clearance was to look for a small separation between the arm and the shoe. Much easier to see than whether the back roller is fully into the half-moon space that it occupies. As to rear/front brake balance, I have, for the moment, opted for the traditional 60/40 balance resulting from the standard process for adjusting the stock brakes. Now to the road test results. I put about 25 miles on the car, drifting to a stop occasionally to check for drum temps. With a couple of tweaks, I now have cool drums and rear brakes that lock up on my gravel lane, fronts that do not but are clearly contributing to the braking effort. I cannot lock up any of the brakes on dry pavement....though I'm not sure that this is something I want to be able to do! The car stops nicely - much improved vs. the pre-rehab effort. No squealing or pulling. I will run them as they are for a while and recheck. I want to thank those who contributed to this effort - there were many steps when I turned to Fordbarn for guidance. You guys were terrific - thanks again.

02-26-2012, 04:12 PM	#2
Vanspeed Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Suttons Bay, Mich. Posts: 3,444	Re: Brake Rehab - Road Test Report My coupe will lock up the brakes on pavement, don't ask me how I know. __________________ *Respecting and Resurrecting Ford Model A's.*

02-26-2012, 04:36 PM	#3
jerry shook Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 516	Re: Brake Rehab - Road Test Report Dave. The first floaters i installed was on my 30 cope, worried with then seam like foever. My fault not following instructions. Just got flustrated and parked it for about a mouth, when i did get it out to my suprise the brakes worked great the peddle was easy to push would slow like disk brakes and slide if i applied them hard. I think mabe they seated to the drums wile setting. No mater how long it takes it worth it in the end best brakes ever. That was over a year ago still working great.

02-26-2012, 04:41 PM	#4
Modelakid31 Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Foxborough, MA Posts: 364	Re: Brake Rehab - Road Test Report Glad it all worked out well for you Dave! Nothing like a new set of brakes that stop well! ps. been busy with midterms this past/coming week thats why I haven't called you yet.

02-26-2012, 04:43 PM	#5
Pilotdave Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Grafton, MA Posts: 1,273	Re: Brake Rehab - Road Test Report I'm going to drive it for a while and see what happens. For sure the braking power is much better already.

02-26-2012, 06:50 PM	#6
1931 flamingo Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: new britain,ct 06052 Posts: 9,428	Re: Brake Rehab - Road Test Report Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Nice going!!! Paul in CT

02-26-2012, 07:30 PM	#7
Keith True Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: Epping N.H. Posts: 3,423	Re: Brake Rehab - Road Test Report Every single problem I've seen with the floaters have been installer error.Most have been people leaving out a step because it didn't seem important.Also people that bought them to use as a magic bullet to fix poor brakes that need 25 other things fixed first.Those things HAVE to be fixed first.If you try to get by without repairing everything else first,you need to be a mechanic and understand how they work,because you are going to take them apart a dozen times tweaking things to make them work.I have had people ask me to put them in,looking for the quick fix.I tell them I will put them in,as long as we can fix everything else first.Some have been told they can have perfect brakes with this $100.handful of parts.I still have two new sets I have not even bothered to put in.I bought them years ago,when I first saw them.When my knees get worse I will though.

02-26-2012, 08:02 PM	#8
Pilotdave Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Grafton, MA Posts: 1,273	Re: Brake Rehab - Road Test Report Mike - no worries - call when it's convenient and you're looking to get your hands into a Model A. Hope your exams went well. Paul - thanks....so far, so good. Keith - I get what you are saying. I do think that there's another category: the installer who lacks experience. If I were to do this again, I'd know how to check the fit of those plates. I find that there are enough instances where instructions tell me what to do but not how to make life challenging. This was the case here, and there's no way to visually check that the rollers are fitting properly into plate once the plate is on the car.