New hi compression heads
 

I seem to remember synders heads many times need to be milled. I was wondering if it was baked in an oven for a few hrs, then milled,would that help alleviate future warping? Appreciate your insight and experiences. Thanks. Chuck

Re: New hi compression heads
 

Is this true, or is this another old wive's tale?
I wouldn't think a new head should need to be milled, but I haven't installed many either.
I will check mine before I install it.

Re: New hi compression heads
 

For what its worth, I just installed a new Snyder's 6.1 head about 4 months ago. Was it straight? Yes it was. No milling involved. I think Tod posted on this a while back, and said no new head should need milling. I will never understand why people mill a perfectly good head to up the compression. Why not just by the head needed. They are very reasonably priced I think. Just my 2 1/2 cents.

Re: New hi compression heads
 

Chuck, I too have installed the Snyder's heads without issue. Quite honestly, my personal experiences was it was the Brumfield heads that had the issues, -and not Snyders. Not always was the BF head needing trued out of the box, however more often than not, as soon as the engine was run thru a few heat cycles, then when checked they were always off.

Re: New hi compression heads
 

X2 on the Brumfield not being flat. My Snyders has been bolt on and go.

Re: New hi compression heads
 

I'm glad to see that people aren't having problems with the Snyder's head.

However every head that we have installed so far and most recently a week ago needed to be resurfaced.

We have in the past posted regarding the Snyder higher compression head and it's minus of surface finish and also the boss height being too high.
As far as we're concerned it hasn't been corrected.
I am enclosing pictures with layout blue showing the flatness of the head.
We removed .004" and the center cleaned up another .004" and the rest cleaned up.

We've had quite the contrary experience with Brumfield heads. Early on and used them right up until the end that they were no longer available.
We can honestly say we had a 95% success rate out of the box.
Naturally there will always be the ones who fail to retorque head and then blame the head. As long as head is flat to begin with you've minimized the failure.



To answer Mr.Wesenberg: You're right; one shouldn't have to resurface a new cylinder head. We would recommend you have it checked and also retap spark plug holes as that's another area needing to be checked.

Re: New hi compression heads
 

I installed my Snyder's head right out of the box. Checked it for flatness, used the gasket they recommended and have had no problems for 1000 miles. John

Re: New hi compression heads
 

We have found the same as J. & M. Machine!

Herm.

KohnkeRebabbittingService.com

Re: New hi compression heads
 

I had a head gasket blow and discovered that my Brumfield head was low in the center where the head gasket failed. I noticed that a few people mentioned that the head is not supported at this area. This may be the possible reason.

Anyways, I brought the head to my buddy's shop, Day Custom Engine and we had to skim off .010 to get the head flat again. It was also slightly warped at the front by the drivers front of the head but only by .003. Torquing head bolts would have corrected that, but I now have a truly flat head. You can see the pictures and video below.

Area drawn with sharpie is the low spot....

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w...w/IMG_2225.jpg


..so we built up a support table on his high speed mill..

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w...w/IMG_2226.jpg


http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w...w/IMG_2228.jpg


Fired up the mill. You can watch the video below...

LINK TO VIDEO

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w...h_IMG_2231.jpg

Here we are at about .007. Notice the center is still low and hasn't been cut yet.

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w...w/IMG_2232.jpg


And after the last pass at .010. Flat head again!

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w...g?t=1308753125[/QUOTE]

Re: New hi compression heads
 

I think you mean that area was high, not low?

Re: New hi compression heads
 

If you're standing upright and the head is upside down as in the pictures, that center area is "low". On the other hand, if you're laying on the floor on your back and holding the head above you, that area is "high"!

Re: New hi compression heads
 

X2,,,,,,,,my thinking also. ;)

Re: New hi compression heads
 

[/quote]

Re: New hi compression heads
 

Jason In Texas: I think you missed the point of this posting.
This posting is about new heads that need to be machined out of the box.
Your Brumfield head looks to me that is has been on your vehicle for years.
I understand that it's warped, looks to me from overheating as I mentioned in my earlier post.
Really doesn't have anything to do with the initial posters concern other than you resurfaced a Brumfield head and the pictures to prove it after it's been used.
Drilling the steam holes in the center didn't help either as Brumfield always spec'ed an R1-R3 gasket not Model B.

Re: New hi compression heads
 

Two hours ago, I was typing a similar reply as J and M Machine eventually posted, but I got interrupted and only now am able to finish mine. Now I see that J and M Machine has made points similar to the ones I was going to post. I've modified my reply so as not to appear to be "jumping on the bandwagon". :)
Even if the head in question was as flat as the proverbial board when the owner received and installed it, using a Model B gasket will virtually GUARANTEE premature gasket failure. That gasket is not the one that Brumfield specifies and in fact insists upon. A Model B gasket will burn out prematurely as the flame will go over the fire ring on a Brumfield Head.
Moreover, someone drilled a couple of extra water holes not specified by Brumfield. Not only could this weaken the chamber near its edge, it also will not allow the specified gasket (Fel-Pro 7013 C) to be used because it would barely cover the holes with almost no gasket at all.
That discolored metal in the center of the head says it all. ANY cylinder head can warp after a blowout if it gets hot enough. In this case, the blowout was made easier by using the wrong gasket. Improper use of the spark lever could also contribute to a head gasket blowing out. Just the fact the wrong gasket was installed was enough to make the gasket blowout.
Hopefully the correct head gasket will be used this time around. I'd like to hear down the road if that solves the "warpage" and blown head gasket problem for Jason.
Marshall

Re: New hi compression heads
 

By the way, I am assuming a Model B head gasket was used because of the two holes drilled in the Brumfield head. These holes could only be used if a Model B head gasket were installed. If, however, the correct and recommended gasket had been used, those two unplugged holes would compromise that area and would contribute to a blowout. This is akin to the four "steam" holes (or aids in the casting process) in a Model B block needing to be plugged if a Model A head and gasket are installed. Leakage, seeping and eventual blowout are to be anticipated if those holes are not plugged if anything but a Model B cylinder head with matching holes is installed.
Marshall

Re: New hi compression heads
 

It does look like the Head got hot, as it is really colored between cylinders 2 & 3. I also wondered what those two extra holes were doing between cylinders two, and three. It probably weakened it, in that area, it don't take much. If the recommended gasket was used on it, Fel Pro 7013, it might not have worked right!

Herm.

KohnkeRebabbittingService.com

Re: New hi compression heads
 

I purchased my 6.0 head at Hershey from Schwalm they surface the head so your good to go.
I love that head. Will buy another one this year.

Re: New hi compression heads
 

Last week we had a customer’s new Snyder’s 5.5:1 head shipped directly to the machine shop. We were there when the machinist opened the UPS box. The spark plug holes were tapped to a taper and had to be re-tapped so the plugs will seat properly. The stud bosses were different heights and had to be milled to make them even. The block mating surface of the head was out of flatness too and had to be milled. The first .001 pass contacted about 30% of the surface. Snyder’s recommended gasket may have taken up the difference temporarily, but our club does a lot of touring and, with proper maintenance and periodic adjustments, the engine should be expected to last 30,000 miles.

Re: New hi compression heads
 

My new 6:1 Snyder head was not flat when received a couple f years ago. They offered to trade me for another head & it had taken three weeks to get the first one. I had a local shop mill the original head and Snyders reimbursed my costs. I also installed their recommended gasket with the silicone ridges & torqued & retorqued to their instructions. I had a gasket failure but a copper gasket & the flattened head have been doing their job ever since. The block was checked & found to be flat.