Brake fades if hot
 

Hi, I have very much brake fading, if they get hot.

Is this normal that on steep downhill driving after about 1/8 ml the brakes are so hot that there is only a very little braking power?

The brake linings and the mechanics I have completely renewed / revised. The contact pattern of the friction shoes on the drums are good.

But all 4 brakes get so hot after this short time that I can no longer touch them. Spit against evaporates.

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

Do you have the original steel brake drums or cast iron brake drums? My brakes would fade when I was just driving around town until I switched out to cast drums. The problem is that the outer part of the drum expands so the lining only touches the inner part of the drum. (the side where the hub attaches). This becomes more pronounced after the drum has been turned a few times (which Ford recommended not to do).

Cast drums made all the difference in the world.

I got my drums and shoes from Randy Gross in California but he is a little far away for you. [email protected]

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

You need to let the engine help you do the braking on a long steep decline. When coming down a mountain you need to be in a lower gear. Without synchronized gears it's hard to down shift when coming down too fast. Ask me how I know.

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

Listen to Ivan... don't ride your brakes, of course they will fade out. Gear down, your're not in any race. Go at your own pace.

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

I installed the Rocky Mountain brake bands that worked for awhile. After blowing through a stop light in Scottsdale as the brakes faded, I switched to hydraulics on three of my A’s and never looked back. I don’t care if you can “skid” all four tires with properly maintained mechanical brakes. I drive my cars in traffic and there’s no room for error.

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

Good evening,


thank you all for the feedback!

There are brake drums that are cast iron.

Correct, downhill the engine brake helps very much. But when I'm sliding down in the 2nd gear, I'm very slow because I don't want to over rev the engine more than 2000 RPM.

In Germany, the road traffic is very dense! The drivers behind are impatient and especially black Audi/BMW/small Mercedes with loud roaring exhaust are aggressive drivers.

But back to the subject, I understand correctly that the pronounced fading is normal. Then I can not improve something mechanically, but must adjust my driving style slower.

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

I am sure aggressive driving is not unique to Germany! This is the greatest concern I have with driving a Model A in dense traffic. Even with good brakes it takes extra attention to stay out of trouble. This situation seems to have worsened considerably since I bought my first Model A 40 years ago.

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

I wonder of the 'rocky mountain' drums would help.

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

Are rocky mountain drums cast iron?

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

Werner,

Some bumper stickers available here in the States:

"Not so close, I hardly know you"

"Back off" with a cartoon of Yosemite Sam holding two pistols

"I am not in your hurry"

"Sorry for driving so close in front of you"

"This is not a race car"

"Thank you for not tailgating"

"Get off my ass"

There is more but you get the idea. I have a car camera in my back window that records any car behind me. In case I am hit from behind I have the evidence.

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

I wonder how juice brakes will solve brake fade?

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

Werner, as a rule of thumb, you should always descend a hill in the gear you would use to climb it and keep your foot off the accelerator. Let the engine do the braking and use the brakes only as a "top up".

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

Hydraulic brakes apply more force to the shoe. no lost force on all the pivots ,levers, bellcranks, bushings and wedges, rollers and pins.Plus they're self equalizing.
They won't solve the fade, but will give you much better brakes before they fade.
Bill

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

Bigger drums, more metal to absorb the heat, more surface area to cool.
The first Holden here came out with disc brakes in the mid 60's with small discs. If you had a hot motor in it on a mountain road, when you stopped the heat was such it would make the grease drip out of the ball joints.

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

Werner,

Friction is what causes the car to slow down. Friction creates heat. Your brake drums are doing their job.

Driving technique can minimize brake fade.
1. slow down before you start down he hill.
2. Make sure you are out of overdrive and transmission is in gear.
3. Make sure your hand throttle is all the way up and your foot is OFF the gas pedal and OFF the clutch until you are off the hill.
4. Let the engine compression regulate your speed.
5. If your speed increases too much apply the brakes FIRMLY to bring your speed under control then get OFF the brake to allow the drums to cool until your speed is again too fast.
6. Repeat #5 as needed. DO NOT RIDE THE BRAKE PEDAL. (verboten)

Richard
Anaheim CA

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

What type of brake pad material do you have on your shoes?

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

I have a Mitchell overdrive in my car and when descending a long hill I will be in second overdrive and switch to second direct when needed. The Mitchell overdrive is synchronized so switching from overdrive to direct and back to overdrive is easy. My car is a heavy Fordor.

Disk brakes are much more fade resistant because of the way they dissipate heat. I had disk brakes on my Model T and would ride them down a steep grade without fading. I cannot find disk brakes for a Model A without changing out the spindles and rear axle and using different wheels. It would be nice if a kit was available that used mostly stock parts.

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

How far oversize have your drums been turned?

Charlie Stephens

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

Guten Abend Richard & Dave,

yes, the way that Richard ("Dick"?) writes is the way I drive. But as written, the otherwise if cold good deceleration values drop a lot very quickly because the heat is dissipated too poorly.

Dave, in the rear I have mounted the bonded pads that Don Snyder III offers. In front, a specially made and grinded of the measure to the drum size, relatively soft brake pads are glued, which are used for industrial machines; they have an increased coefficient of friction.

btw.: Thanks at all for the helpin' hints!

Re: Brake fades if hot
 

man, Model 'A" brakes certainly occupy an inordinate amount of attemtion in the Barn!

after reading Werner's comments, do you guys think what he is using for brake shoes on front or rear is an issue? I understand his analysis and don't wish to second-guess him but how often have we seen modern-style improvements to original designs complicate performance?