wireless lower plate
 

If you are using a wireless lower plate in your distributer I would appreciate any feedback, good and bad, on your experience.

I am entertaining the idea of getting rid of 'the wire'.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

i have seen nothing but problems with those. from intermittent driveability to full blown break downs. IMO its one of the worst things to do

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I agree with Mitch. Keep the wire, the ultra fine strand wire.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I found I have one on my Vicky. Didn't know I had one until I was trouble shooting a problem which turned out to be ignition switch related. Looked good, been working good. I will continue using until I have a reason not to.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I never had a problem with mine ...this will be the 5th year

Re: wireless lower plate
 

If you want to go the next 40 or 50 years without troubles then keep all original with a new wire between the plates.

See Vince Falters website on the proper type of wire to use and Marco's website to learn about tightening up the upper plate.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

The wireless lower plate mod relies on a sliding contactor on a brass plate to carry current from the battery to the ignition points. It is not a positive connection. Each time you move the spark advance handle with the engine running the sliding contact emits tiny sparks during its travel. Eventually It will create a burn trail between full retard where you start the car and the advance location where you normally place the handle while you are driving. Engine vibration and bumps in the road will cause more sparking, most predominately at either end of the burn arc. Eventually you won't be able to start the car in the full retard position because the contactor and the brass plate will be severely burned at that position and will not allow current to pass from the battery to the ignition points

My own experience with the lower plate mod occurred a number of years ago when they first came on the market. I thought this was the answer to that pesky little lower wire Henry came up with. I rebuilt two distributors with the lower wireless mod. One I put on the Vic the other I put under the back seat. Shortly there after I embarked on a tour from Southern California to Montana. At about Salt Lake City (1500 miles) the car began to miss as cruising speed. It became hard to start at gas stops. Finally it wouldn't start at all. I replace the distributor with the one under the seat and it fired right up. later that evening at the hotel I took the removed distributor apart and found a burn arc on the brass plate, with a severe burn at each end of the arc.

When I got home from the trip I removed and inspected the distributor I had installed at Salt Lake City and it had a severe arc burn as well. needless to say I removed both wireless lower plate mods and threw them in the trash.

I have since learned that Henry's wayward wire is not a bad design after all, as long as you use the proper wire and orient it properly during installation. I have taken countless numbers of distributors apart and found any number of incorrect wires installed. Some looked like solid wire the previous owner found on a fence post.

Bratton's carry the proper wire. It is made up of very small strands of copper wire that makes the overall wire very flexible and able to withstand 80 years of spark handle movement and it is a positive connection from the battery to the ignition points.

My advice is to stay with what Henry ordered.

Tom Endy

Re: wireless lower plate
 

Tom we respect your model A wisdom,but 1000s of these were sold. with no problems, and worked very well , still have 2 in a couple of cars .no problem

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I have fixed a couple of wire less lower plates for other people when there car quit on tours. Get a 100 strand wire. Fix it once and forget it.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I had a customer that insisted on the wireless plate. I had to grind away some metal from the plate before I could even install it or the brass strap would have been touching it and shorting out.

I use 160 stand wire with original plates and don't expect to touch it again in my lifetime.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I hated mine when it was in the car. Tried figuring out all kinds of ways to make it work right, and always make good contact no matter what position the spark was in. Ended up just chunking it.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

ok you had a customer 1 problem, why down grade what sold so many with no problems ? we are really done with mis information

Re: wireless lower plate
 

All the ones that have been installed in the cars in our club have been removed due to problems. The only one left, the owner made it himself.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

Yes why down grade. Put in a wire.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

A 160 strand would even be better than a 100 strand.
Where do you get the 160 strand Tom.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I also don't like the wireless plate for personal reasons that others have stated here. I believe that many of those sold are in the trash or on owners work benches, never to be used after being removed for problems. I don't know anyone that uses one but do know several people that have them in their junk boxes, including me. However, I don't like beets either so,its up to the owner to make their own judgement.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I looked for a few years and finally found it at the electronics surplus store. It wasn't cheap, but at least now I have a spool of it. It also works great for the output wire on generators, from the brush to the stud.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I used the long wire plate that Snyders sells when I rebuilt mine. So far no problems.................Pete

Re: wireless lower plate
 

Thanks Tom

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I think the wires less plate would work fine for a parade car or one that is not used much. For guys like me that drive there cars a lot and move the spark lever for varying condition it is not a good thing. It probable would have worked a lot better with a carbon brush under spring tension instead of brass dragging on steel.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

There are two styles of wireless lower plates. There is the style that is used with the V8 points that is nothing but a problem. The wireless lower plate that is designed for use with the original points is a way better idea than the wire that was originally used . There is no doubt a lot of confusion between the two different wireless lower plates. I have used the acorn nut style wireless lower plates for nearly 20 years with no problems . The style that I have uses a brass acorn nut and there is nothing to fail. The other style uses a brass strip that can and does short against the distributor housing. The plate that uses the acorn nut has been fail safe for me. Unless a person drives with their hand on the spark lever, constantly moving it untill they wear a groove through the lower plate, there should be no problem. Unlike the V8 points style wireless lower plate the acorn nut contacts the special lower plate at all times, the acorn nut can not short against anything and is fail safe unless unreasonably used . If a person runs a compression ratio that is so high that constant movement of the spark lever is needed, the practical approach would be a centrifugal advance distributor.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

It's like most modifications, some hate, others love it. I have run one for 30 years and have not had a problem (probably should not have said that, because I've now jinxed myself.

Mine has a brass ring on the lower plate and copper spring arm that attaches to the original style points.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

Everyone in our club that has wireless plate has had problems and no longer run wireless plate .

Re: wireless lower plate
 

Ooooooooookay.....thanks for the input.

But should I go with the detergent or non-detergent wireless lower? :D:D:D:D:D

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I have the wireless bottom plate and the original upper with the acorn nut that rubs the lower plate I have 6V at the points which are new and gapped at .20 but cannot get the spark to jump the points. Would this be caused by the lower plate. I have a nice spark at the end of the coil wire.

Sewall Tyler

Re: wireless lower plate
 

When the points and condenser are working correctly there will be little to no spark at the points. If you have good spark at the end of the coil wire, then the ignition primary circuit is fine, as well as the secondary circuit up to the end of the coil wire.

If the plugs aren't firing then the problem could be in the rotor, distributor cap & body or the spark plug.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

Check with a hobby shop for wire for electric RC cars. I've seen 12 ga at 720 strands.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

Thse wiress contarptions WILL wear out, arc, & fart out in time!!!! A quality 100 strand wire, with terminal ends soldered on & installed properly, will function well for you & the next 2 or 3 owners!!!
Bill W.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

Tom thank you for your reply. I tried a known good body, cap and rotor and still had no luck. Then tried a known good dizy and it fired right up and I could see a nice park at the points. Have no idea what is wrong with the other one. Have not tried a new condenser which I'll do tomorrow.

Sewall Tyler

Re: wireless lower plate
 

There is a good possibility that the metal wire end of the lower plate wire is grounding out against the housing , where it connects under the points, This is a common problem with the wire setup if the tab of the wire end isn't bent and positioned just right. One advantage of the wireless lower plate is there is no wire to short out for any reason . The upper plate can be removed and replaced with no concern for wire connection. The acorn nut style connection with original style points has never given a problem in nearly 20 years in my use . I've had wire setups give problems in much less time. I'm not one to use the spark lever a whole lot and wear is kept to a minimum. Deb and I took the roadster out for a spin late this afternoon and it run really good. the wireless lower plate works for me.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

Sitting at the bench this afternoon with a distributer in front of me and it occurred to me that the ground side of the upper plate is already "wireless" since it seeks ground through the three tabs that slide in the groove that holds the plate captive. (And that's steel to steel)

Seems to me that making the ignition side wireless, with better conductive metals, if installed right, should not degrade the system at all.

Just sayin........

Re: wireless lower plate
 

You also have the center hole and a good spring pressing against the top plate. Also make sure the head and distributor shaft that fit into the head are free of rust and paint, so it provides a good ground.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

Thanks

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I bought one in 1982 from a club member who was making them to sell. It's still in use today and never caused me a bit of trouble.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I had the wireless and converted mine back to the original design with the wire. No more problems. Believe in the KISS principle(Keep it Simple Stupid). Restore it like original and will last longer than I will.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I have had my wireless in my DIST since 1991 when in 28 degree weather the pig tail broke .... fortunately in my drive way. I use the lever as it should be used, not just full retard or full advance. Never an issue.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

I an new to your great site, but have been fixing old cars for 40 years.About a month ago I bought an AA with a lot of parts missing. I was able to come up with 3 distributors but no top plate except one with the bakelite broken out. I was anxious to try to start it so I went to my napa store which is only parts store on this island. I asked to look at some ignition points that were insulated bushing type. The second set he showed me I thought would work. I got a condensor too while I was there. I drilled and tapped the top plate to suit the points and condensor. Then I took the wire from a cell phone charger and using 2 pieces in tandem (I wasn't sure one run would carry the load), I ran it up the arm of the advance lever and to the coil. It isn't super pretty, but the truck started on the second revolution of the hand crank. I have been careful in routing the wire and it seems like it would last quite some time in this application. I kept the box tops from napa so I know what points and condensor to use if I need more. My wireless top plate story. I didn't even know there was a debate about such things when I did it....

Re: wireless lower plate
 

That is almost how the modern points are mounted on the plate and yours look like modern Ford parts. If you will run the wire down through the opening under the point contact and out the hole for the ignition wire, you won't have to have it taped to the timing lever. Also, that is not exactly "Wireless" since you do have a wire. The system being discussed here does not have a wire connecting the top plate to the bottom plate and ignition system.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

The relationship between the cam notch for the rotor and the fiber points block is very important in where to mount the points. If you weren't paying attention to the relationship, then you sure got lucky, because the trailing edge of the rotor needs to be in line with the distributor body contact when the points start to open with the spark lever full up.

Re: wireless lower plate
 

Since the notch for the rotor button is made into the points cam, wouldnt it always be oriented correctly? Assuming you timed it the way you're supposed to with the timing pin.
Anyhow, I think its pretty neat that he made it run with what he could find, even if it wasnt the correct stuff.:)
How many of us would have just given up and said " I'll have to wait until I get the right parts?"...I must admit, I will "rig" some things, but I probably wouldnt have attempted that one.