Engine Swap

[rniez]

I am replacing the engine and transmission in a Model "A". In Les Andrews book, he suggests that you should install the transmission to the torque tube (mounted on a floor jack) then install the engine and mate the bellhousing with the flywheel cover.

It seems more intuitive to mount the transmission to the engine and then install the whole assembly. Am I missing something here? What do you suggest is the best approach.

[tbirdtbird]

???
It is not clear to me what Les might have really meant

The main issue is that the tranny bolts to the bellhousing from the INSIDE of the bellhousing, not the outside as is done today. The engineers must have been out in the hot sun that day on the drafting table.

The old timers just shoved a lifting eye in cyl #3 and since that perfectly balances the whole shebang (engine,flywheel cover, bellhousing, and tranny) just remove/install that way

We rarely have to remove everything, but that is how we do it when needed

If you are paranoid then use 2 lifting eyes on the head

[Joe K]

TBB is correct. Les may have trying to indicate an assembly methodology that builds directionally from back to front?

I can see why he might come to this. Some engine stands are challenged to carry the weight of the engine AND the transmission - something about overtipping?

Still, even to drop the engine from the stand to the floor, put the bellhousing/transmission on (with transmission attached by the inside bolts) and then slide/align the transmission assembly into position seems to me a lot quicker and easier. I'd rather align the clutch disk/pilot shaft on the floor than do it while standing in the middle of my frame trying to hold the rear axle/tranny up in my non occupied hand

I've done it both ways - building from the front back, or building from the back to the front - but not by the Les method.

That third hole works fine for lifting both engine and transmission - and at a nice balance. MUCH better than without the tranny.

Joe K

[Ford1931]

I prefer to do both the motor and transmission together, either way will work fine. The rear motor mounts are always tight. You will need help or a frame spreader.

[Fred K-OR]

I do the same as Ford1931. Seemed the best way for me. But it may depend on what equipment you have and what help you have.

[rob63mess]

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I just swapped an a motor and tranny for the first time a month ago....installed with the motor and tranny together using a cherry picker and leveler. Went fairly easy even for this rookie.

[Tom Wesenberg]

I like to install the tranny first, then the motor, if the body is on.
If the body is off the frame, then I like to install them together.

[CarlG]

I had hoped that I wouldn't have to be pulling my engine out and in all that much, but I finally broke down and bought a cherry picker and an engine stand. There are a couple of Bill Stipe's tools that make the job a little more pleasant: the head puller in the first picture captures 2 spark plug holes and does the lifting straight up rather than at an angle. It also has several places to hook your lift on for proper balance. The second picture is his engine stand adapter. This just works so slick, don't know how I got along without it.

As far as engine and tranny together, I've not done that on my Model A yet, always separate jobs.

Way back "when Hector was a pup" (as my Dad would say), on my 71 F100 Pickup, I worked for a half day trying to get the tranny out by itself. Finally decided to take the engine and tranny out together and had everything out and on the floor in less than half an hour.

[glenn in camino]

You might need a frame spreader. It makes the installation much easier.

[CarlG]

Originally Posted by glenn in camino

You might need a frame spreader. It makes the installation much easier.

Got one ordered.

[Neil Mylar LakewoodCA]

I usually put the engine and trans together first, but when working alone, I always find it a challenge to get the u joint at the correct angle and then to get the u joint turned exact so it slides into the drive shaft. If I have a helper at the u joint side, he can turn things to make it fit. Is there a trick to make it easier when it is a one man job?

[George Miller]

I leave the transmission. Just the engines is easier for me.

[swo4rd]

A cherry picker for a lift?????? Now that is unique.

As for fitting the drive shaft to the u-joint, on the assembly line, didn't they have the wheels off the ground so one could turn the wheels to get the splines to line up?

A frame spreader? now what does that look like?

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by Neil Mylar LakewoodCA

I usually put the engine and trans together first, but when working alone, I always find it a challenge to get the u joint at the correct angle and then to get the u joint turned exact so it slides into the drive shaft. If I have a helper at the u joint side, he can turn things to make it fit. Is there a trick to make it easier when it is a one man job?

This is why I find it much easier to install the tranny first, by itself. That way it's easy to tip the tranny to the correct angle, and turn the shaft to get the U joint splines lined up. One way to get the splines lined up is to have the rear wheels off the ground and turn the rear tire with your foot as you pull the tranny back into place.
A small A frame tranny lift makes the job much easier.

[Dave in MN]

Tom...You amaze me! Do you ever sleep? (That's a compliment by the way.)
Good Day!

[mshmodela]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

This is why I find it much easier to install the tranny first, by itself. That way it's easy to tip the tranny to the correct angle, and turn the shaft to get the U joint splines lined up. One way to get the splines lined up is to have the rear wheels off the ground and turn the rear tire with your foot as you pull the tranny back into place.
A small A frame tranny lift makes the job much easier.

Tom,

That's Awesome! Assume one of your home made rigs... If so do you have plan/drawing for it (I've got to get me welder....)

[CarlG]

Originally Posted by swo4rd

A cherry picker for a lift?????? Now that is unique...

A frame spreader? now what does that look like?

...

[Joe K]

I use one of the harbor freight "porta powers" as my frame spreader. The "foot" that can be applied to one end is most helpful.

Mine the 10 ton version - but I'm sure a 4 ton version will work fine too.

And I have heard about those that use the old fashioned "bumper jack".





Joe K

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by Dave in MN

Tom...You amaze me! Do you ever sleep? (That's a compliment by the way.)
Good Day!

Dave, I think I'm headed for an early death due to lack of sleep.

mshmodela, no plans but it's easy to see what size to cut by the picture. The legs have a slight spread to match the taper of the body. The hand crank with lock gear is something I pulled from a scrap metal barrel years ago. I just notched a piece of aluminum to act as a pawl.

[mshmodela]

Tom,

Yeah looks not too bad (get "A" frame legs over the car's frame and the clearance of the steering column.... Now where is my HF coupon! (they are have a sale on welders...) I really enjoyed doing that (esp. old gas welding).