The Ford Barn

Rolandwood · 07-08-2023, 10:42 PM

I’m trying to figure out how to remove the visor (if possible) and the header panel/windshield mount on my ‘29 Briggs 60C (blind steel back Fordor). I have the windshield frame removed, all the nails for the filler panel above the windshield removed, screws on the interior side removed, nails along the roof removed and both top (roof) side panels are off. I can’t get the header assembly to budge. Are there screws holding the assembly to the wood header that are hidden? Is the filer panel/ hinge mount/interior header one piece? Im stuck, literally. The visor appears to be one with the a pillars. How does that come apart? Thanks for your help. I have a lot of rotten wood to replace but don’t want to add to the job by wrecking anything, plus I need the wood as intact as possible for patterns.

Richard Knight · 07-09-2023, 12:47 AM

I will take a guess. There may be a leaded joint between the visor and the pillar. I have a 29 briggs and I can take close look. My 29 Murray did have a leaded joint for sure.

rotorwrench · 07-09-2023, 10:26 AM

I know they will come off but they blended that part into the A pillar so body solder may have been used or it is all one piece that is attached to the sides and goes over the top. I've never seen one like that though. Adhesives were not commonly used in that era except to glue wood to wood. Wood cars with screws and nails generally have them in places that were easy to get to during the assembly process so there shouldn't be any hidden fasteners unless they were covered over to hide them in some way. B. Terry Restorations has a restoration photo set on the site for a 60C. The photo of the bare windshield frame support is pretty basic. There isn't much to it after all the wood and sheet metal are removed. I've heard that all the later Fordors used the same basic visor but things were changed a bit in 1930 for mounting.

The Coupes & Tudor Sedans were simple in the way the visor was attached but the Briggs & Murray wood bodies were more complicated due to all the wood structure.

If the visor is soldered on the sides, it shouldn't take a lot of heat to melt the solder, The working range is between 360 and 490 degrees F for body solder. It starts to melt at 361 degrees and should be fluid at 376 degrees. The 40% tin & 60% lead solder is a little lower in the upper working range but it's still pretty close to 30/70. A large soldering iron (copper) may melt it without using a torch.

Brentwood Bob · 07-09-2023, 03:39 PM

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UkfQro...dex=11&pp=iAQB
David Gillespie removes a header on a two door. Might help with internal structure of the wooden header.

Rolandwood · 07-09-2023, 11:12 PM

Thanks for the input. I discovered four wood screws holding the header cover in place that were hidden under the residue of the weatherstrip tape Ford put on the cover. The screws go through the header cover, the steel frame joining the a-pillars and into the wooden header. I had removed the tape but the tar from the tape obscured the flush wood screw heads. Sneaky, that.
I think I can leave the actual visor in place, and it is welded and leaded to the a-pillars. I can understand why so many Fordor Briggs met their demise because of rotten wood!

Rolandwood · 07-09-2023, 11:15 PM

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Oops, my mistake the visor is only leaded to the a-pillars, not welded too. I still think I’ll try to replace the wood with the visor in place…maybe.

Richard Knight · 07-10-2023, 12:14 AM

I do know the header can be replaced on A Murray without removing the visor.

07-08-2023, 10:42 PM	#1
Rolandwood Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2021 Posts: 11	‘29 Briggs visor removal, I’m stuck! I’m trying to figure out how to remove the visor (if possible) and the header panel/windshield mount on my ‘29 Briggs 60C (blind steel back Fordor). I have the windshield frame removed, all the nails for the filler panel above the windshield removed, screws on the interior side removed, nails along the roof removed and both top (roof) side panels are off. I can’t get the header assembly to budge. Are there screws holding the assembly to the wood header that are hidden? Is the filer panel/ hinge mount/interior header one piece? Im stuck, literally. The visor appears to be one with the a pillars. How does that come apart? Thanks for your help. I have a lot of rotten wood to replace but don’t want to add to the job by wrecking anything, plus I need the wood as intact as possible for patterns.

07-09-2023, 12:47 AM	#2
Richard Knight Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2021 Posts: 130	Re: ‘29 Briggs visor removal, I’m stuck! I will take a guess. There may be a leaded joint between the visor and the pillar. I have a 29 briggs and I can take close look. My 29 Murray did have a leaded joint for sure.

07-09-2023, 10:26 AM	#3
rotorwrench Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: San Antonio, Texas Posts: 16,440	Re: ‘29 Briggs visor removal, I’m stuck! I know they will come off but they blended that part into the A pillar so body solder may have been used or it is all one piece that is attached to the sides and goes over the top. I've never seen one like that though. Adhesives were not commonly used in that era except to glue wood to wood. Wood cars with screws and nails generally have them in places that were easy to get to during the assembly process so there shouldn't be any hidden fasteners unless they were covered over to hide them in some way. B. Terry Restorations has a restoration photo set on the site for a 60C. The photo of the bare windshield frame support is pretty basic. There isn't much to it after all the wood and sheet metal are removed. I've heard that all the later Fordors used the same basic visor but things were changed a bit in 1930 for mounting. The Coupes & Tudor Sedans were simple in the way the visor was attached but the Briggs & Murray wood bodies were more complicated due to all the wood structure. If the visor is soldered on the sides, it shouldn't take a lot of heat to melt the solder, The working range is between 360 and 490 degrees F for body solder. It starts to melt at 361 degrees and should be fluid at 376 degrees. The 40% tin & 60% lead solder is a little lower in the upper working range but it's still pretty close to 30/70. A large soldering iron (copper) may melt it without using a torch. Last edited by rotorwrench; 07-09-2023 at 11:27 AM.

07-09-2023, 03:39 PM	#4
Brentwood Bob Senior Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: brentwood, ca Posts: 4,247	Re: ‘29 Briggs visor removal, I’m stuck! https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UkfQro...dex=11&pp=iAQB David Gillespie removes a header on a two door. Might help with internal structure of the wooden header.

07-09-2023, 11:12 PM	#5
Rolandwood Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2021 Posts: 11	Re: ‘29 Briggs visor removal, I’m stuck! Thanks for the input. I discovered four wood screws holding the header cover in place that were hidden under the residue of the weatherstrip tape Ford put on the cover. The screws go through the header cover, the steel frame joining the a-pillars and into the wooden header. I had removed the tape but the tar from the tape obscured the flush wood screw heads. Sneaky, that. I think I can leave the actual visor in place, and it is welded and leaded to the a-pillars. I can understand why so many Fordor Briggs met their demise because of rotten wood!

07-09-2023, 11:15 PM	#6
Rolandwood Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2021 Posts: 11	Re: ‘29 Briggs visor removal, I’m stuck! Sponsored Links (Register now to hide all advertisements) Oops, my mistake the visor is only leaded to the a-pillars, not welded too. I still think I’ll try to replace the wood with the visor in place…maybe.

07-10-2023, 12:14 AM	#7
Richard Knight Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2021 Posts: 130	Re: ‘29 Briggs visor removal, I’m stuck! I do know the header can be replaced on A Murray without removing the visor.