Now what the @?&$

[vern hodgson]

Ok, was able to finagle the spark rod into submission, next was to install the starter rod and the hole is almost one and a half inches off to the left. Engine is centered in frame and cowl seems sitting where it belongs. What would cause this much misalignment?? This body comes from Canada.

[Mike V. Florida]

Can't wait to see what they have to say about this. I have not a clue!

[vern hodgson]

Crazy question, was this the original purpose for the curved starter rod?? Was the cowl penetration relocated at some point? What is a good measuring point for the horizontal location of the penetration and what would that be in inches?

[marc silva]

I just went out and looked at mine. That hole is off. Are you sure that rod is mounted correctly? There is no way that is in the right position..Canadian or not.

[marc silva]

I have never heard of a curved starter rod.

[dlshady]

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Originally Posted by vern hodgson

Ok, was able to finagle the spark rod into submission, next was to install the starter rod and the hole is almost one and a half inches off to the left. Engine is centered in frame and cowl seems sitting where it belongs. What would cause this much misalignment?? This body comes from Canada.

The hole for the starter rod was offset to the passenger side on the earlier 1928 bodies, hence the offset starter rod. Can you tell us a little more about your body. IE: What year is it? Left hand emergency brake? Any other of the VE28 features?

[vern hodgson]

Originally Posted by dlshady

The hole for the starter rod was offset to the passenger side on the earlier 1928 bodies, hence the offset starter rod. Can you tell us a little more about your body. IE: What year is it? Left hand emergency brake? Any other of the VE28 features?

The car was assembled in Canada, a Tudor, fire wall date is 1928, e brake is pistol grip, on right side of gear shift. Have never seen date on the frame. Vern

[dumb person]

Think mine has a curved starter rod. RHD hole maybe?

[Mike V. Florida]

I know very little about the VE28's.

Restoration guidelines;

The offset starter switch rod was obsolete at about
vehicle 50,000.

[vern hodgson]

What are other defining features of early 28 bodies?

[Tom Wesenberg]

Originally Posted by vern hodgson

What are other defining features of early 28 bodies?

The parking brake lever is by the left kick panel for the first 5 months.

[Skeezixx]

Looks like a case for a solenoid and starter button on the dash.

[dlshady]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

The parking brake lever is by the left kick panel for the first 5 months.

This is probably the easiest way to tell quickly, but unfortunately the brake lever hole remained for a while after the brake lever was moved to the center. On top of that, the starter rod was changed to a straight rod quite a while before the brake lever was moved, so it's not a dead giveaway. The earliest Tudor bodies had several unique features that would help to pinpoint the production date of the body but most are difficult to explain without showing photos.

As for the firewall date, it's very likely the gas tank may have been changed somewhere along the line so the date isn't a dead giveaway either. Same with the emergency brake lever on the transmission. It's very likely that the transmission top was changed over the years.

Is there a body number stamped onto the subrail underneath the front of the driver seat? That would be helpful.


Deron

[Gary Karr]

You clearly have an E-28 cowl. What choke rod support do you have on the gas tank? I can see by your picture that the lip where the cowl lacing attaches is also '28 as it does not protrude forward beyond the front edge. AS Tom mentioned above, you most likely will have the hole by the left kick panel for the left brake.

[vern hodgson]

I will look at it now, thanks

[Bob C]

Here are some pictures that may help. Your hole
looks like it is also to low.

Bob

[160B]

Originally Posted by Bob C

Here are some pictures that may help. Your hole
looks like it is also to low.

Bob

In looking at the photos posted by Bob C, the hole for the starter rod is slightly to the left of the "D" nut at the bottom of the firewall, in the photo posted by Vern Hodgson the hole for the starter rod is significantly further to the left. The hole in the Bob C photo appears to be at the same height as the photo posted by BOB C.

?????????????????????????????

[Tom Wesenberg]

In post #1, what is the large round hole in the motor mount on the forward side?

[dlshady]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

In post #1, what is the large round hole in the motor mount on the forward side?

That's one of those Canadian motor mounts, eh?

Seriously though, it really is one of the Canadian cast mounts.

Originally Posted by Gary Karr

You clearly have an E-28 cowl. What choke rod support do you have on the gas tank? I can see by your picture that the lip where the cowl lacing attaches is also '28 as it does not protrude forward beyond the front edge. AS Tom mentioned above, you most likely will have the hole by the left kick panel for the left brake.

He said it has a firewall date of 28 so I'm betting the tank has been changed. It's going to be interesting to see just how early the body really is.

[Wm J.]

That is a Canadian motor mount.

[160B]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

In post #1, what is the large round hole in the motor mount on the forward side?

Tom the vehicle is a Canadian and they used a "Canadian mallable cast steel rear engine support"

RG&JS page F-2 and F-3

ENGINE (RIGHT SIDE)
The three-point front engine support bracket was
introduced in December 1928. Early rear engine supports
were riveted to the frame. A second type, which was the
same as the USA rear engine support, was used until June
1928. Thereafter, through the end of production, unique
Canadian malleable cast steel rear engine supports were
utilized. Beginning in late 1931, a few stamped steel rear
engine supports were again supplied.






Maleable cast steel rear engine support used from June 1928 to
the end of production (left); stamped steel rear engine support
used from beginning of production to June 1928 and late 1931
(right)

[Tom Wesenberg]

Even if the firewall is an early one, the offset early starting rod has the offset in a vertical plane. This one would need the offset to the side.

In #16, what do each of those panels fit?
I don't recall seeing a slotted hole for the choke rod.

[Bob C]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

Even if the firewall is an early one, the offset early starting rod has the offset in a vertical plane. This one would need the offset to the side.

In #16, what do each of those panels fit?
I don't recall seeing a slotted hole for the choke rod.

Don't know, found the pictures on Epay.

Bob

[Tom Wesenberg]

Now I'm wondering about the offset being in a vertical plane. I just came across this picture I took at the Gilmore last summer, and the offset looks like it might go up and to the side. Wish I'd have taken the picture straight on.

Here's two pictures of my 9-27-28 Phaeton. Notice the extra hole to the side of the starter rod. I always wondered if that wasn't a left over hole from the earlier bent rod. You'd think not since several months had passed since the bent rod was used. My car does have the cover plate for the left hand parking brake hole.

I just noticed the Gilmore car doesn't have a battery cable to the starter.
Also the dipstick isn't installed correctly. Half the handle missed the hole.

[dlshady]

Originally Posted by Tom Wesenberg

Now I'm wondering about the offset being in a vertical plane. I just came across this picture I took at the Gilmore last summer, and the offset looks like it might go up and to the side. Wish I'd have taken the picture straight on.

Here's two pictures of my 9-27-28 Phaeton. Notice the extra hole to the side of the starter rod. I always wondered if that wasn't a left over hole from the earlier bent rod. You'd think not since several months had passed since the bent rod was used. My car does have the cover plate for the left hand parking brake hole.

I just noticed the Gilmore car doesn't have a battery cable to the starter.
Also the dipstick isn't installed correctly. Half the handle missed the hole.

No Tom, it's offset to the passenger side. I'll try to snap a picture of my sedan before I leave the shop tonight because it shows the difference clearly. It started life with the offset rod but somebody added the more traditional hole later, I'd assume in order to use the later starter and rod. It looks much the same as your firewall, only this one has the D-nuts on the inboard hole.

[vern hodgson]

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Ok, gentlemen it is all coming together now. Yes this is a Canuck. The body no. Is W2468, the firewall stamp is 10-13-28 and the engine # is CA112012. The stamping on the 28 is very light, but it is possible to make out the two humps of the eight as opposed to the rounded nine. Also I was incorrect about the E brake. It is forward of the shifter and the subframe does have an oval cut out on the left bulkhead. Interesting to see the modified starter rod hole location. I had originally assumed the starter rod was vertical also, but no see it must offset toward the passenger side. Now I can stop looking for a bent frame or tweaked body as the problem. Any idea what the body numbers mean?

[vern hodgson]

Those photos really help to Splain a lot. Do the judging standards detail all of these little idiosynchracies? Thanks for all the input, quick replies, glad there are some night owls out there, I was able to get to sleep last nite and stop stressing.

[Cockshutt Kid]

As you guy's are starting to figure out, all Canadians are a little off. With metric conversions we don't know what temperature it is or what any measurement is. Those holes are the same except one is measured in metric and the other is in imperial. hope this explains a lot! Jim

[160B]

RG&JS Page 2-4 Revised 2011




STARTER SWITCH
Four types of starter switches were used. All starter
switches were either cadmium plated or painted black
with the starter. From the beginning of production until
October 1928 two nearly identical rectangular switches
were used with the terminal post in the rear. The first
version used through March 1928 had an offset starter
rod. Beginning in April the second version with a straight
rod was used. Both type rods were cadmium plated. The
starter rod connected to the switch with a cotter pin
through a plunger spring cover which varied in length.
On the early switches with the offset rod, the sleeve had
an indexing groove to prevent rotation of the rod.

[Afordman31]

Offset Starter Rod on Ebay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/MODEL-A-FORD...p2056016.l4276

This person is making them. Afordman31

[vern hodgson]

Originally Posted by Afordman31

Offset Starter Rod on Ebay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/MODEL-A-FORD...p2056016.l4276

This person I making them. Afordman31

Thanks for the tip. Nice looking.

[Muttley]

Originally Posted by Skeezixx

Looks like a case for a solenoid and starter button on the dash.

Yep

[BILL WILLIAMSON]

Originally Posted by Muttley

Yep

Dog here,
In only 17 1/2 minutes, he culd have made him a KROOKEDY ROD!!
Buster T.

[vern hodgson]

Originally Posted by BILL WILLIAMSON

Dog here,
In only 17 1/2 minutes, he culd have made him a KROOKEDY ROD!!
Buster T.

Exactly what I intend to do, will take a bit longer however, plus no points, oh well.

[zzlegend]

He must make them. I believe this is the third one he has listed.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/MODEL-A-FORD...3D321726146045

[tallen]

does anyone have a pic or know where i can get an emergency brake handle for an earlr 1928 modela

[harleynut]

Are you looking for the front mount brake handle. I got one . Very rusty but it should work. Cat doesn't go with it.....just the handle.lol

[Gary WA]

Originally Posted by vern hodgson

Ok, was able to finagle the spark rod into submission, next was to install the starter rod and the hole is almost one and a half inches off to the left. Engine is centered in frame and cowl seems sitting where it belongs. What would cause this much misalignment?? This body comes from Canada.

I think you need to find a CanadianStarter? Hi Vern. Just kidding..

[updraught]

Originally Posted by 160B

Tom the vehicle is a Canadian and they used a "Canadian mallable cast steel rear engine support"

These two are the only ones I have seen in my lifetime. Now you are telling me it isn't normal!

PS. The RHD starter hole is a big thing in the hump in the middle. Specially designed for that extra bit of warming on a hot day.

[160B]

Originally Posted by updraught

These two are the only ones I have seen in my lifetime. Now you are telling me it isn't normal! ..................day.

Not sure what you mean by "Now you are telling me it isn't normal!"

The below information is from the RG&JS, Canadian Model A's page F-3.

The Maleable cast steel rear engine support was used from June 1928 to
the end of production.

The stamped steel rear engine support was used:

1. from beginning of production to June 1928 when the maleable cast steel rear engine support was introduced.

2. and then again from late 1931 to end of production.

Also remember what was sent to AU could be different than what was installed in Canada for domestic use.

[Jeff/Illinois]

Originally Posted by Gary WA

I think you need to find a CanadianStarter? Hi Vern. Just kidding..

Or, fill the hole with a Robertson screw and drill a new hole. That way it stays Canadian

[Tinbasher]

Welcome to Canadian cars. Your build is Oct of 28 like mine. The lag on parts is about 6 months behind what the American built cars are. I think as things where changed up the parts where sent here to be finished up or we had a stock pile of parts and it took that long to use them up. I've changed up some parts 2 and 3 times until I got the right one to fit the product time. My car has the solid front engine mount how about yours?

Hope this helps. John Poole

[vern hodgson]

Originally Posted by Tinbasher

Welcome to Canadian cars. Your build is Oct of 28 like mine. The lag on parts is about 6 months behind what the American built cars are. I think as things where changed up the parts where sent here to be finished up or we had a stock pile of parts and it took that long to use them up. I've changed up some parts 2 and 3 times until I got the right one to fit the product time. My car has the solid front engine mount how about yours?

Hope this helps. John Poole

I don't recall, when I return home from Thailand I will check it out and let you know.

[Chuck Sea/Tac]

What's the deal with these two year old threads popping up?

[vern hodgson]

Originally Posted by Chuck Sea/Tac

What's the deal with these two year old threads popping up?

People exchanging ideas, information and conversation, nice to see people using archived information.